Advice for sci.electronics.design

On Sat, 04 Jun 2005 16:39:44 +0000, Ban wrote: ...

Well, it seems to be working so far ...

He Guy, remember when you posted all these trolls in April? Now you just do the same...

Subject: THE ART OF TROLLING: Winding up the net Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2005 04:40:05 +0000 Organization:

Message-ID: X-Complaints-To: snipped-for-privacy@supernews.com Lines: 225 Xref: news-in.tin.it sci.electronics.design:5441308

It seems you are seeking attention from the members of this NG. Have you ever thought why you are in need? You want to be appreciated as everybody does. But when someone else does a similar thing, you lament about having to read this BS, which is not on topic or whatever. Thompson writes about sunset bbq in Phoenix, I write being granddad, Rich shows his teeth and Genome his frying pan- you know at least we let the others participate in our little lives, it might be boring but it also transmits a taste of the real person. These little personal bits are annoying you for what reason? Because you want to be anonymous, you want people to respect you because of your knowledge. You are afraid people might reject you or say you are not worth anything. You hide behind a false facade, but still those personal bits come through. But because you do it unconsciously, you leave this goofy feeling in the reader. It doesn't make you a popular guy here, and I'm sure it has been like this already your whole life. Now you will say you are sharing this with a lot of people here, right, but I have accepted it. Look at Rich, he even shows his fears his weak spots his depression. So if you want attention why not saying it and sharing something of your *real* self: the fear of getting old and dying, our craving for appreciation love affection reputation prestige. That is life, and it is one of the reasons I enjoy participating here. Have the guts to be real Guy.

You have incorrectly assessed my internal mental state.

You are correct, and I expect that there will be a lack of details about products under development. I briefly considered offering an option that would allow posts to go through a user-defined chain of mixmaster anonymizers, but I concluded that keeping the product details secret is more important than keeping the name of the developer secret. I don't know whether this will be a fatal flaw.

I won't allow the vultures to post, and those who think they have something which is going to make them rich (but lack the skills to develop it) will have to be told the truth. They might not like it but it's the right thing to do.

Which, of course, I will handle with a FAQ.

Perhaps. Time will tell.

Such people do exist. You obviously are not one of them, of course, so I would expect you to continue using s.e.d as you always have, knowing that it is unmoderated and that no proposal to moderate it will be allowed to be voted upon.

Indeed they are, and I wouldn't change that even if I could.

I have a question for you; should I whitelist you so that your posts go straight to misc.business.product-dev without moderation? The answer to that depends on whether you are inclined to follow the moderation policy when posting to m.b.p-d. even though you strongly disagree with it and very much prefer unmoderated groups. Your comments above about vultures and sheep were quite insightful, and I would have approved them in a heartbeat in a [POLICY] post to m.b.p-d.

You have incorrectly identified my "lament." I *LIKE* things like the BBQ and grand-dad posts. What I don't like is the fact that they (as well as post after post about George Bush) are usually labeled in the subject line as posts about electronic design, thus wasting my time when I wish to read about electronic design.

I think that people should have choices and that it is rude to erect artificial barriers limiting those choices. Those who fill threads that start out being about electronics with posts about politics are erecting a barrier limiting the choice of reading about electronics without politics.

--- Perhaps, but I think it's interesting (and telling) that instead of stating _why_ my assessment was incorrect, you chose to edit my post by snipping the salient bits, then merely disagreeing with what you found so distasteful you had to eliminate it. If this is how you act in an unmoderated group where you wield no power, I think your stint as a moderator is going to win you no friends.

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--- The "truth" as you see it?

What might that be?

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--- Sure you would. You already said you had a whiz-bang way to stop off-topic posters dead in their tracks, which indicates to me that if you could, you'd change the nature of sed. Otherwise, why offer it up as a "solution"? for a problem which you wouldn't change, if you could?

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--- Do what you like, it makes no difference to me.

I have no interest in participating in any discussion where what I post is subject to the whims and vagaries of a self-appointed moderator or a moderator of any type.

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--- It seems incredible to me that you think that complying with a "moderation policy" is something that is important to me. It isn't. As a matter of fact, I find it repugnant and will have nothing to do with any moderated newsgroup.

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--- Fuck what you'd approve and what you wouldn't, and if you're serious about increasing the signal-to-noise ratio on usenet, stop trolling this NG with your off-topic crap.

-- John Fields Professional Circuit Designer

Yes. When posting a question, try to include information on what effort you have done so far to answer it yourself.

When answering, quote only relevant parts of the preceding post and type your contribution below that.

robert

Well, the point is that if they had put the stones down before, they never would have found the path that most people liked. It's like capitalism. Pencils get built because there are literally hundreds of different little businesses all over the globe that collect the parts, transport the parts, manufacture them, transport them to stores, sell them, etc. Almost nobody in the chain knows what the other guys are doing. There isn't a central planner for making and selling pencils. There are just local needs and resources, and positive feedback for certain activities, in the form of capital. Trying to force people to build pencils by making plans is far less efficient, particularly when the situation changes quickly.

In the "Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy", the mice want to buy Arthur's brain, and dissect it to find the question of "Life, the Universe, and Everything". Zaphod says "Well, we'll just replace your brain with a mechanical one, that says 'huh?' and 'what?' Nobody will know the difference!". Arthur complains that *he* would know the difference, but Zaphod says "No, that is the beauty of it, we'll program you *not* to know the difference!".

I still think that this is one of the best ideas I have ever heard, and I still for the life of me cannot figure out how you can make the big bucks you deserve for seeing what others missed (but which is obvious once you hear of the idea).

You *could* wait until misc.business.product-dev gets to where it is running well and pose the same question there... :)

In the news this week in my country we have heard about social studies in kindergartens.

Earlier they put the boys and girls at mixed tables when they had lunch. The thought was that the girls would act as cooling elements among radioactive fuel elements. The girls kept the boys calmer by their presence.

When they studied the videos from the lunches they saw that the boys did not talk, they just grunted, or pushed a girl sitting next to them with the elbow when they wanted something.

The girl looked at what the boy had on his plate, realized what he needed more of, and got it for him.

So they decided to let the boys sit at one table and the girls at another, to see what happened.

Confusion and irritation broke out at the boys table as they tried to make each other help them. They did not even know the names of the stuff on the table, so they had to learn to use words like milk, corn flakes, and marmalade.

Who are raising and teaching the boys and the girls stuff?

Their mothers. They are the ones who make boys who can only say what and huh. Or is it their fathers?

I wonder how much our lives and minds are still influenced by traditions and social processes from the stone age.

Nobody has missed the idea, retard; almost every appliance with a door is interchangeable left to right. The microwave oven is different because of a set of interlock switches and locking mechanisms internal to the housing as well as the fact that it is a monitored and certified microwave seal not to be tampered with by the customer or dealer, by law. You can easily triple the retail price with a fixed reverse door. But , hey, if you're a know-nothing with drug abuse induced brain damage, then this simple non-idea of an "idea" may appear "awesome." I can see now that your p-d group will consist of a bunch worthless crap-for-brains rejects.

Well, I had some friends from Goteburg visiting me and the husband was only allowed to say huh. Seems a tradition in your country that carries on the whole life.

Yes, that is the scary part of it.

By the way, I watched your webcams one morning as the sun went up.

I almost felt like sending you an email asking you to lean out your window and ask for that girls telephone number. She was standing outside your house for a while looking out over the sea. Long blonde hair.

"No way Jose, that is my wife.", maybe.

I went on to contemplate how much of that former beach which is now covered with asphalt and gravel, for cars to drive on. All horisontal areas in the right web cam are car areas.

Maybe in the future you can put the cars underground and have nice grassy slopes down towards the sea.

A statement of fact by a person who is in a position to know that fact needs no justification. If I say that you hate orange juice and you tell me that I am incorrect and that you actually enjoy orange juice, you don't have to tell me why my assessment was incorrect - you just have to tell me that you like orange juice.

You are incorrect again. You appear to lack the ability to peer into someone's mind and determine their desires and motivations. I do hope that my pointing out this apparemt lack of psychic ability does not upset you too much.

Ah. I see that you are confusing a possible change in any aspect of any thread with "changing the nature of sed." If that is your definition, you change the nature of sed every time you post, and so do I.

If you are impying that I wish to limit or change your actions in any way, I assure you that I lack that ability and that I wouldn't want to if I could. Perhaps you wish to control those who have expressed a desire to read a few threads that stay on-topic, but you can't. They have the same freedom that you do.

THE STANDARD ADVICE:

There is a way to influence what gets discussed in a newsgroup that works well, and another way that has never worked no matter how many people have tried it.

What works: Post articles on the topic you wish to see discussed, and participate in the resulting discussion. Use killfiles and filters so that you don't see the articles that you dislike. If you don't know how to use a killfile, use good old fashioned discipline and don't read the articles that you dislike. Never, ever respond to articles that you dislike.

What doesn't work: Respond to articles that you dislike, complain about articles that you dislike, complain about posters that you dislike, complain about how terrible everyone else is for not posting what you want them to post. Talk about how to respond to articles that you dislike. Make the articles that you dislike the center of attention, the main topic of discussion, and a personal crusade.

(Please note that it may be appropriate to post a correction if someone is giving out false information in a technical newsgroup, and that it may be appropriate to tell someone about The Standard Advice, but please be aware of the possibility of becoming a troll feeder while doing so)

--- Just so there's no question about what I posted, here it is again:

"You're not interested in moderating the group in order to make it more "productive", what you're interested in is having dominion over a population. Whether or not you ever exercise the power, merely being _able_ to puts your ilk in a heady state of being."

Notice that that's not quite as cut-and-dried as your orange juice sidestep, where there's no onus on not liking orange juice.

I maintain that your interest lies in being able to control others, and in this instance has caused you to go so far as to become a "moderator", where you will have ultimate authority over whether anyone is able to post content which you find to be objectionable.

You have already demonstrated your desire for that control by your actions in this newsgroup; an example of which is your editing of my posts in your replies. Not just snippage for the sake of brevity, but snippage for the sake of changing context.

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--- Your attempt at a personal attack indicates that you have found my statement incontrovertible and can't counter it with a factual refutation.

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--- The infinitessimal change in nature because of the content of an individual post isn't what's being discussed. What _is_ being discussed is the change in the nature of the group which would come about if you had your way and only on-topic posts were allowed.

You can't deny that that's what you've advocated time and time again, so why lie and say that you wouldn't change sed even if you could?

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--- You're a liar. I'm abrasive, I post off-topic material all the time, and I'm often profane. You've stated that you find those actions offensive and have offered to offer a plan which would make it impossible for that kind of behavior to be allowed on this NG. That sounds to me like if you had your druthers you'd certainly change things around here so they'd be more to your liking.

Or, I suggest, since there's not a damn thing you can do about it you've resigned yourself to taking the position that you're really disinterested and quite above it all.

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--- Awww, poor baby, is what you're whining about surreptitiously that I'm trying to control one of the downtrodden "who have expressed a desire to read a few threads that stay on-topic"?

You, for instance?

LOL, do you feel a desire to do my bidding or the world closing in on you and a sense of fear if you don't?

You're pathetic.

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--- So, you responded to my article because you liked it and decided to add fuel to the fire with misspelling and sarcasm, to wit:

"I do hope that my pointing out this apparemt lack of psychic ability does not upset you too much."

---

--- Sounds to me like you've pretty much learned how to feed yourself.

-- John Fields Professional Circuit Designer

This is sci.electronics.design. I'd wager that very few of the people here give a rat's ass about your internal mental states.

Please go over to your private newsgroup where you can self-absorb to your heart's content.

John

Bwahahahahaha! John you sure do have Guy's chain dancing around ;-)

...Jim Thompson

Well, the whole point of hijacking a dead newsgroup (how many votes did that take?) and crowing about it here is for an otherwise dull person to make himself into a pompous-oracle center of attention.

It won't work, of course.

John

Darn! I thought you had blacklisted me. You really should find another hobby. This one is going to kill you. Heart attack, stroke, cancer, they are all caused by hostility and stress.