mold forms on cords, knobs, and tool handles

Jeff Liebermann wrote on Fri, 01 Mar 2013 18:47:40 -0800:

Hi Jeff,

Those were fantastic pictures. I always assumed it was mold, but, now, I must rethink 'what' it is.

I don't remember trying acetone, but, my screwdrivers still have a hint of the white stuff from years past, so I will try that to see.

Thank you very much for the wonderful experimental work. You're in the top 1% of all people who THINK on this planet!

The microscope photos were awful, grainy, and somewhat otto focus but sufficient to make a few observations: I left the microscope setup in my office and will try to take some better pictures with better objective lenses and better lighting on Monday night. Bottom lighting didn't work because the "plastic rot" was too thick. It also wrecked the focus as my depth of field is very limited at x100 and x400. Maybe lower power will help.

Ever wonder who makes the tool handles? Nothing on their site about the problem, or even what type of plastics are used.

Typical acrylic extruded rods:

It's not mold. It looks, acts, burns, melts, and disolves like acrylic plastic. It's translucent, not white. It doesn't grow, has no structure, doesn't creat colonies, and doesn't produce spores.

Hold it. Don't try using acetone to clean your screwdriver. It will attack and make a sticky mess of the good parts of the screwdriver handle. Acetone will dissolve acrylic plastic which is what I guess the handles are made from. Consult a chemical compatibilty chart for plastics before using any solvents. For cleaning, use anything that will scrape the stuff off, such as a knife blade, scouring pad, or sandpaper. Use a buffing wheel to retore the shine.

Thanks again. I'll spare you my lecture on the topic. The simple version is from Sherlock Holmes, where Watson "sees" but does not "observe". Plastic rot is similar in that we "see" mold, but few have the time, abilities, and equipment to test if it's really mold.

Your next mistake was growing up. ;-)

Or in other words, another failure of the proper application of Occam's Razor. All things being equal, the simplest explanation is that it is mold.

The failure is that accepting the simplest explanation "it is mold" limits the search for "all things" and some important facts are missed.

I see this all too often in computers, where people without a clue, fix a broken system by replacing parts randomly.

If there are 5 componens in a system, replacing any one of them has a chance of fixing the system, possibly as much as 20% and then declaring themselves "experts". :-)

Geoff.

Shotgunning is the true mark of a very poor tech. They don't want to learn why things fail, or what parts are actually needed.

I met a cute little 4 year old girl one day and because I flirt with gals of all ages, I asked her if she would marry me when I grow up. The tyke looked me up and down and said "You're already grown up." to which I replied, "You're the first girl who's ever said that to me." ^_^

TDD

Often it is the same component that fails 90% of the time. That makes the 'experts' have an even beter reputation if they know of this part.

I just fixed the dial light on a radio of mine that has a known failuer of a driver transistor. It was a $ 2 part and about an hour of my time instead of spending about $ 100 to ship it off and get it back. I did not trouble shoot it, just tried the 'known' fix. The rado and where the part is located at is past my ability to do actual trouble shooting, but not beyond my ability to actually replace the part.

When I was working I would sometimes get a call while I was at home on something at work was not working. By knowing some known problems, I could tell the ones at work a thing or two to try,and many times that would fix the problem.

I can't believe this thread is still going on and people are still suggesting mold. A few seconds with Google will explain the process.

Try "white powder screwdriver" and actually read a few of the posts.

Then maybe the OP will come back and report what he smells.

This was discussed here in alt.home.repair a few years ago.

Might I respectfully semi-disagree?

I have always wanted to understand >>why

Just use that dipping handle cover. Here's one such product I have different tool boxes for different uses, such as electrical, plumbing, carpentry, car, bicycle, motorbike, general, etc. I get it in different colors, to identify which tool box or "application" tool kit they belong to. It has really cut down on tool "evaporation". It also has made enforcement of tool replacement to it's proper box far easier with other family members.

Jeff Liebermann wrote on Sun, 03 Mar 2013 10:03:27 -0800:

Hi Jeff, I think it's a rare combination of both intelligence, wit, and inquisitiveness, plus the rarest of all desire to help others to answer the question, that makes you so valuable for us.

A few on alt.home.repair have that quality - but not very many (probably a half dozen, e.g., Oren, krw,

Jeff Liebermann wrote on Sun, 03 Mar 2013 10:03:27 -0800:

... last post sent too soon by accident ... trying again ...

Hi Jeff, I think it's a rare combination of both intelligence, wit, and inquisitiveness, plus the rarest of all desire to help others to answer the question, that makes you so valuable for us.

A few on alt.home.repair have that quality - but not very many (probably a half dozen, e.g., Oren, Jim Elbrecht, SMS, Trader4, Ed Pawlowski, & DerbyDad03, krw, etc.).

Plus, very few take the time and energy to post a photograph, which, in my humble opinion, is just plain old COMMON COURTESY when asking a question.

Some, but not all, make statements that aren't backed up by URLs (when they should be).

And, most just drop off, without also writing up a SUMMARY of lessons learned. Some do, but very few.

Lastly, some get downright acidic when they are confronted with alternative information. They're the worst, of course, because they're a cancer on the discussion.

Anyway, I, for one, greatly appreciate your efforts at figuring this out. To my knowledge, it has never been figured out before definitively (although I see a post that says it was discussed in a.h.r but the poster didn't provide any URLs so we have to look it up to see what the result was and the proof supplied).

Here you go:

That was a discussion over the Xcelite and Craftsman nutdrivers that stink. There is nothing in that thread that I can find that even mentions "mold" on the plastic handles. Please try to stay on topic.

There is also some wrong information in the thread.

1. It's not the plastic handles that stinks. It's the caesin (milk based) plastic cases that reek. I have several of these and can confirm that the drivers are fine and the cases are the source of the smell.
2. The handles are made from acrylic and not vinyl as claimed. Vinyl is quite flexible and very different from the hard acrylic. Hoewever, I have NOT been able to definitively identify the type of plastic used in my Vaco and Craftsman screwdrivers. My guess is acrylic, but I'm not 100.0% sure. Maybe a burn test:

Thanks. Hopefully that balances my previous screwups, errors, and bad logic. It's impossible to write as much as I do, and not get something wrong occasionally.

That doesn't bother me much. I'm used to it. What bothers me are one-line postings, that offer little thought and less information. Unfortunately, many web forum pages have so many navigation aids and so much advertising on their pages, that long and detailed replies seem to be discouraged. The resultant one-liners are of little value.

To get a decent answer on usenet, one needs to provide:

1. What problem are you trying to solve or what are you trying to accomplish? (Keep it simple)
2. What do you have to work with? (Make, model, version, etc)
3. What have you done so far and what happened?
4. Where are you stuck? It is possible to get answers without all the aforementioned information, but it is much more difficult and tends to attract vague guesswork type answers. Besides, my crystal ball is being repaired by my wizard, so I can't temporarily guess what someone is asking.

Thanks again. I did the usual Google searching for prior research into the nature of the plastic "mold" and found little besides bad guesses and vague assertions. I found plenty of complaints, but no analysis. That's why I decided that it was time to dig in and analyze the stuff. The convenient discovery of my drawer full of "moldy" nut drivers also inspired the investigation.

The stink and the white powder are part of the same process.

Do some searches, I've already supplied working keywords.

Much as I appreciate your efforts, I don't consider myself responsible for proving *your* point. If you believe that the white powder in the handle, and the smell coming from the case, are one and the same, methinks it is your responsibility to supply the relevant links which demonstrate the connection and describes the process. The above URL never even mentioned white powder or a similar problem. Got a better URL?

I've been sniffing Xcelite (and similar) tools on and off for years, and I always assumed the odor came from the handle, not the case.

It does. The ones without a case smell just as bad (just got a bunch of screwdrivers at work last week).