Re: *RANT* Ridiculous EDA software "user license agreements"?

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On Thu, 01 Jul 2004 04:46:42 GMT, license_rant_master

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Have you tried tightVNC on maximum compression?  The lossy compression
leads to some visible artefacts on bitmaps (e.g. your modelsim wave
window), but it's a lot better than anything else I've tried over a
voice band modem.

http://www.tightvnc.org /

Regards,
Allan.

Re: *RANT* Ridiculous EDA software "user license agreements"?
: I am an ASIC engineer who frequently 'takes work home' with me.
: Recently, I began using ssh to remotely login to our company's
: servers to run some Verilog/VHDL simulations.  Launching
: sims (from the UNIX command line) is fairly easy and painless,
: but any kind of interactive (GUI) operations are pitifully
: slow over an WAN/internet connection.  In the past, I
: haven't needed to do much more than check on running jobs,
: restart them, then logout.  Now, I find the need to do some
: interactive debugging work (waveform viewing, code editing,
: etc.)

Look at NX. It what LBX (Low Bandwidth X ) promised, but NX
delivers. Probably not to easy to set yet, but worth a try.

Bye
--
Uwe Bonnes                 snipped-for-privacy@elektron.ikp.physik.tu-darmstadt.de

Institut fuer Kernphysik  Schlossgartenstrasse 9  64289 Darmstadt
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Re: *RANT* Ridiculous EDA software "user license agreements"?

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It's easy enough to set up the server (either look at the commercial
version from www.nomachine.com, or google for "freenx" or "nxserver") on
linux, and clients are even easier (download free from nomachine).  It is
said to be usable over a modem connection - I have certainly found it
works well over ADSL for most work.  It's definitely faster than tightVnc
(which is also okay for many things - and works well for pretending you
are sitting at your office windows desktop).


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Re: *RANT* Ridiculous EDA software "user license agreements"?
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Too bad its not easy to setup a server in FreeBSD ( i know, totaly OT )

Like others will most likely point out, something like TightVNC would
support compression, and is even easier to setup then NX..

Re: *RANT* Ridiculous EDA software "user license agreements"?

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With SSH, He is actually half way there, just forward port 5900 and install VNC.



Re: *RANT* Ridiculous EDA software "user license agreements"?

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I've heard that this is to prevent on-site consultants from sharing their
personal license (or more likely, the consultant's company's license) with
their customer.  Otherwise only ASIC consulting companys would be buying the
$500K licenses.

--
/*   snipped-for-privacy@world.std.com (192.74.137.5) */               /* Joseph H. Allen */
int a[1817];main(z,p,q,r){for(p80%;q+p-80;p-=2*a[p])for(z=9;z--;)q=3&(r=time(0)
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Re: *RANT* Ridiculous EDA software "user license agreements"?
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or an america and european company could get together and share licenses, with
a 7-8-9 hour time difference they wouldn't need the licenses at the same time

I think some companies (big ones) can a special license, I know one that share
worldwide and I would think they have a pool of licenses

-Lasse


Re: *RANT* Ridiculous EDA software "user license agreements"?
On Thu, 01 Jul 2004 19:21:28 +0200, Lasse Langwadt Christensen

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This was certainly the case when I was at Agilent.  We had three
license server triads (three each in Germany, US and Singapore) that
served the company's global license needs.

It sucked a bit that we were in Melbourne, and the closest server was
several thousand km away.  The time taken to acquire a license was so
long that some users would simply not close the gui (e.g. in Modelsim)
and use up a license all day even when they didn't need to use the
tool.

Regards,
Allan.

Re: *RANT* Ridiculous EDA software "user license agreements"?

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Here's a hint: like a lot of things in life, these restrictions are negotiable
if you are a big enough customer.

Re: *RANT* Ridiculous EDA software "user license agreements"?
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The trend of "unless you are going to fork us over some more megabucks and
are a large company anyways we will disallow doing resonable things" in
software licences is rather disturbing.

--
    Sander

+++ Out of cheese error +++

Re: *RANT* Ridiculous EDA software "user license agreements"?
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I'm glad you did speak up ! I wish more people would -
preferably not anonymously ...

Here is another free Verilog simulator, you might find
it will run the more serious verilog jobs:

http://www.pragmatic-c.com/gpl-cver /

Runs on Linux ...

Good Luck !

Best Regards,
rudi              
========================================================
   ASICS.ws   ::: Solutions for your ASIC/FPGA needs :::
..............::: FPGAs * Full Custom ICs * IP Cores :::
FREE IP Cores -> http://www.asics.ws/ <- FREE EDA Tools


Re: *RANT* Ridiculous EDA software "user license agreements"?
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I'm not sure what you are trying to suggest.  If you mean he should run
the programs on an office machine using interface software from home,
that is what he wants to get away from.  If you are talking about
checking out the license over the network, that is what is forbidden by
the license.  

What are you suggesting?  

--

Rick "rickman" Collins

snipped-for-privacy@XYarius.com
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Re: *RANT* Ridiculous EDA software "user license agreements"?
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But with VPN the license is still checked out only on the machine at
work.  VPN only allows you to see your work desktop at home, so
technically it's probably legal since the tool is not actually running on
your home machine at all (your home machine only acts as a terminal).

Phil

Re: *RANT* Ridiculous EDA software "user license agreements"?
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[...]
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(Disclaimer: IANAL)
Site wide licenses definitely are licenses and the two companies
involved can agree basically on any ridiculous licensee term that they
can up with, but this might not be the case for a personal edition.

For example if you can manage to buy modelsim PE in a shop or order it
online without clicking through the license agreement than you just
made a regular purchase and there is no license agreement involved.
Even if you click through the license agreement it is very doubtfull
that it is valid. Basically a purchase is a purchase not matter what
you call it and the first sale doctrine applies, which means that the
rightholder can not control the use of an item after the first sale.

This means that you can move your software around (both from place to
place on the same computer, but also from computer to computer)
Also, your company can sell the software to you and you sell it back
later. There is no way the tool vendor can interfere with that. (for
purchased, not rented software) Once you have license files for both
computers you can change ownership easily as often as you want. But
remember to deinstall the software each time.

Kolja Sulimma

Re: *RANT* Ridiculous EDA software "user license agreements"?
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Be careful. License law is a very hard field, especially if different
countries are involved. If you download your software, there might be
the law of two countries involved, which complicates everything.

In Germany your are right that you could ignore any license agreement,
when purchasing a standard programm (enter the shop and buy a CD). But
you have to deal with the license agreement, when purchasing a license
(or get it free) by downloading a software.

These are two different things, which seem very similar.

bye Thomas

Re: *RANT* Ridiculous EDA software "user license agreements"?
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Probably not. By downloading you are receiving a single copy of the
software. The process of copying was initialized by the seller. Only
the ownership of that copy is transfered, there is no license for
copying necessary, the transaction can be handled as a purchase.
Also, the buyer probably believes this is a purchase anyway, so that a
license contract is likely to be void.

One could argue that the process of copying is performed by the person
doing the download, but that view has MAJOR implication on copyright
law. Basically it makes P2P downloads legal in many countries. So
don't expect that view to be successful.

Again, IANAL,

Kolja Sulimma

Re: *RANT* Ridiculous EDA software "user license agreements"?
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IANAL, too.
German law is not logical in any ways (as most other laws I asume).
Maybe you should google in de.soc.recht.*
 
In short you can't get ownership on software in Germany, but you can
get ownership on a CD containing software.
For using a software you need the right to use it (Nutzungrecht),
often called license. In Germany you get this license either by
getting owner of a CD containing the software, or by a license
agreement.

bye Thomas

Re: *RANT* Ridiculous EDA software "user license agreements"?
Hello,

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My understanding of "on the computer hardware or at the site for which
an applicable license fee is paid" is that it can be either used on
different computers at the same site *or* on one computer at different
locations, i.e. a portable computer. Am I wrong?

Paul


Re: *RANT* Ridiculous EDA software "user license agreements"?

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..and of course entirely unenforceable in practice, unless they insist you have
a GPS receiver on
the machine....
How is anyone ever going to know where you physically are when you use it ?

 


Re: *RANT* Ridiculous EDA software "user license agreements"?
I have a company modelsim dongle, which I have always assumed I can move
around and use on any machine the dongle is currently plugged into. By
definition I can only be using it in one place at a time ...

Surely this is allowed ??

/MikeJ

p.s. sorry I mailed you Hans, hit the wrong button :)



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