Part 15 and "test equipment"

The recent thread on Zigbee and FCC reminds me - In the past, I've bought equipment that was shipped as a bare PCB rather than a boxed product, and the reason given by the manufacturer is "so that it qualifies as [parts || lab equipment] and therefore doesn't require FCC testing".

Can someone point me to the relevant section of Part 15 where this exemption is made, if it indeed exists? I'm thinking here specifically of submarine components that I want to offer for sale either as kits or as A&T units. If there is some special route by which these can be declared "parts" (which they are) or "lab equipment" (which they kind of might be), then I'd like to know the ins and outs.

Reply to
Lewin A.R.W. Edwards
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Hi Lewin,

This does not sound right. If something is shipped as a part and then integrated into a system this scheme would place the burden on the integrator. In your case that looks like the customer. They would have to test for compliance and they would have to know that they need to do so. Shipping something with the notion that this would let everyone "off the hook" can result in lots of trouble, liability and so on.

For example, if you buy a fast UHF transistor from ON Semi or even a complete RF amplifier module from Motorola you'd be the integrator and responsible for FCC compliance. They'd only be responsible for sticking to their specs. Now they also make complete radios. If you buy one of these they'd have to test FCC compliance. In any case, someone will be obliged to do it.

Regards, Joerg

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Reply to
Joerg

Hallo Joerg,

Note that when I said "equipment" above I should have qualified that by saying "eval boards". When was the last time you bought an EVB that had an FCC ID on it, by the way? (I've had a LOT of EVBs, including for radio transceiver ICs, and none of them had FCC or CE markings).

In my particular case, it's not quite as simple as a discrete part vs. a standalone unit. The boards I'm thinking of offering for sale do nothing

- literally - if standalone. They require a control module. The software in the control module can, in some cases, significantly affect emissions. It wouldn't be possible to do a meaningful test of the bare unit anyway.

I know everybody does it - NOBODY sells kits with FCC type approval, for instance - but I'm curious to know if there really is a loophole, or if everybody merely likes to live dangerously.

This may never eventuate anyway - there are other complications (like how the !@#&*%^!! to collect sales tax and perform other required paperwork). But I'm trying to gather as much info as I can.

Reply to
Lewin A.R.W. Edwards

CFR 47 Part 15.101 reads:

"(1) No authorization is required for a peripheral device or a subassembly that is sold to an equipment manufacturer for further fabrication; that manufacturer is responsible for obtaining the necessary authorization prior to further marketing to a vendor or to a user."

The whole of Part 15 makes for interesting bedtime reading:

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I am not a lawyer and this is not legal advice.

Reply to
Jim Stewart

Hi Lewin,

Just look at the quote Jim shared:

CFR 47 Part 15.101 reads:

"(1) No authorization is required for a peripheral device or a subassembly that is sold to an equipment manufacturer for further fabrication; that manufacturer is responsible for obtaining the necessary authorization prior to further marketing to a vendor or to a user."

That is pretty clear to me. One way or another, at some point after the mfg process it must be tested for compliance and it must be compliant.

Just think about it. Say, you build a car from a kit and it is a new version so you have a prototype or eval version. Now it doesn't pass smog so you don't get the sticker. Highway Patrol stops you and asks about it. "Oh, but this is just an evaluation model". Won't fly.

Then I believe it needs to be tested with that software and under worst case conditions, meaning when it does generate max emissions. That's what we have to do in all the EMC tests, cables spread out, full power and so on. No mercy there.

If they do not stress these facts in the accompanying documentation then yes, they are living dangerously. If they are selling to the general public it is even worse. That could, in really nasty cases, lead to some time at Club Fed.

Can't you register a business? Or if that's too much hassle sell through an outlet that has the licenses and book keeping mechanisms in place? I have done it in the past, it isn't that hard once you get the hang of it. At least in the beginning it is a great help to have a CPA look over your shoulder. That's what I did and still do so that I can be sure everything is complinat with all the authorities involved.

Regards, Joerg

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Reply to
Joerg

IANAL, but the mfr reps are slightly mis-informed. Yes, there are exemptions, but it is not based on how the device is (or isn't) packaged, but rather how or where it will be used.

In a nutshell, if it's targeted as a piece of test equipment, it fits the loophole. FWIW, I've also verified this interpretation with UL at the time they were trying to sell me FCC testing services.

See this FCC doc for Part 15 highlights:

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...

"Digital devices that are exempt from FCC technical standards."

There are a number of digital devices that are exempt from the technical standards in Part 15. These are:

[...]

Section 15.103(c) o Digital devices used EXCLUSIVELY as industrial, commercial or medical test equipment. "Test equipment" includes devices used for maintenance, research, evaluation, simulation and other analytical or scientific applications in areas such as industrial plants, public utilities, hospitals, universities, laboratories, automotive service centers and electronic repair shops. Devices designed for home use, such as consumer blood pressure meters, bathroom scales and digital thermometers, do not fall under this exemption.

Well, "lab equipment" might require some creative explaining, but you should find it easier to adapt this exclusion for watercraft ... ;-)

Section 15.103(a) o Digital devices used EXCLUSIVELY in any transportation vehicle including motor vehicles, aircraft and watercraft.

Enjoy!

Cheers, Richard

Reply to
Richard

There's a learning curve to starting out, then it's not too bad...

IIRC, you're in the US, so the rough checklist is:

  • Business entity - sole proprietor, LLC, etc.
  • Federal Tax ID (via phone with mail-in form after-the-fact)
  • Tax permit (State)
  • Tax permit (City)
  • Maybe an occupancy permit, depending on the city. A formality for home operations.

For the first item, the generally recommended structure is LLC (for protection and simplicity), but you should do your homework. Check out

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for an long-time upstanding outfit. It's the most expensive part; the rest are often $10-30 fees.

If you have an office in the same state as the buyer, you charge the local tax rate on the transaction. Out of state shipments are tax exempt. (If your volume is low, you'll eventually file sales taxes quarterly or annually; they adjust based on trend.)

Check out

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for free advisors to get jump-started...

Good luck!

Reply to
Richard

If you look at things like Modem cards (when they still exist) and LAN cards that are PC add-ons they often have FCC ID and CE marking EITHER on the board or in the documentation. It has to be shown that the PRODUCT CAN be made compliant.

You are confusing THREE basic categories (ESPECIALLY when refering to CE marking, but *probably* is very *similiar* for FCC). This is a SIMPLIFICATION NOT A LEGAL DEFINITION, as such such be used as a GUIDE.

1/ PARTS Items that cannot be used on their own, but must be built into a system BY A MANUFACTURER of other products to be SOLD ON etc. (Things like LAN cards can be added as accessories by ANYBODY to a system and as such are classed as accessory PRODUCTS). 2/ PRODUCTS Items that can be used on their own or as accessories to products that are used/added by the END USER. 3/ TEST EQUIPMENT This is primarily custom IN HOUSE built equipment, that is NOT sold. These include prototypes, evaluation systems. These are used IN HOUSE primarily.

Note Scopes, meters etc. are SOLD as products and NOT solely used in house and can be used anywhere.

Some evaluation boards are classed as parts and/or Test Equipment. The CE marking has gone through phases where some eval boards sold in Europe had to be encased in metal boxes and CE marked, with disclaimers all over the documenation stating that removing the cover could break CE conformity. This practise seems to have changed as these items are only going to be used in a 'lab' type environment.

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Paul Carpenter          | paul@pcserviceselectronics.co.uk
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Reply to
Paul Carpenter

Hi Paul,

That is what I meant with modules and parts versus equipment (for example the radio as a product). I left out test equipment because that is a very rare category and even there the user, who is to be considered an expert, has the ultimate responsibility not to exceed FCC limits. While these limits can be eased inside a lab this leniency usually ends at the property line and above the installation. Even gear built in house must comply as an installation where EMI limits cannot be exceeded outside the premises. This makes the third of your categories almost the same as the first, from an agency's point of view.

Yes, but that lab type environment must also maintain EMI limits. You can't generate excessive noise in, for example, the air band just because this is a lab. The pilot flying above doesn't care about what's below, the FCC limits need to be maintained no matter what unless there is some written exemption by the authorities. These will likely only be granted if there is neither a flight path above nor any other users that could be disturbed.

Regards, Joerg

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Reply to
Joerg

Right. I think these particular items classify as parts. They are subassemblies, yes, but they are nothing by themselves and are not commodity products. A system must be designed specifically to work with these modules of mine, and they are not conformant with any kind of industry standard. I.e. there is no off the shelf product that can be used with these modules.

Reply to
Lewin A.R.W. Edwards

It's all very much hand-waving and cogent arguments could be made in practically any direction. This sub, even if sold FULLY assembled and tested (i.e. mail-order submarine) is clearly not a Class B product in nature; if anything, it's Class A equipment. The subassemblies are also Class A in nature, and would never be advertised in "consumer" channels. However, advertising on the Internet is an interesting question - is it consumer advertising? The examples the FCC uses as being non-consumer advertising are direct mailing, industrial journals, trade publications etc. But the Internet is by definition untargeted advertising :)

Dunno that I want to go down this route either, because if I say it's for aircraft I probably have to comply with FAA rules, for motor vehicles probably NTSB regs (?) and likely some similar bureaucratic lunacy for watercraft.

In fact, from the look of things I may have to declare the vehicle as a "custom boat" and get a HIN for it, and register it with my state's DMV. It's not clear.

I think the best approach is to declare them as parts, which they clearly are...

Reply to
Lewin A.R.W. Edwards

Test Equipment under CE can include a lot of different ONE OFF equipment even equipment put together to control a one off process in a factory. I only gave a simplified explanation above.

That is true, but the question was whether to test [full] compliance and obviously if testing do you then do the necessary marking.

NO, agencies like to keep these separate for many reasons, often usage and future legislation and/or changes to codes of practise. It is easier to change the requirements for one category that already exists, than to create new legislation to first define new category and spell out the differences between the categories. This is true of many regulations.

A similar thing exists with Value Added Tax in UK (Sales Tax) we have two tax bands that are called Zero Rated and Exempt, however they are currently both 0% tax rate. However they could change the rate of Exempt easily to a different rate (e.g. 1% instead of 0% or normal 17.5%) without having to classify what the Exempt band was first, and what had moved from Zero to Exempt band.

You soon know for a lot of bands if they cause EMI. How many people have found adding a scope probe to circuit causes interference to a radio.

However all test criterion are for normal usage, not for when testing, or other conditions including quite a few fault conditions, as they cannot always be tested or predicted.

Various other regulations come into play here AS WELL, like minimum flight path altitude above built up areas which is higher for controlled traffic. Yes you need to make sure it is not exceeding limits, but you have to also use a bit of common sense as in

1/ how often and how long equipment is used for. 2/ Total energy available in the equipment and likely maximum energy released as EMI/RFI/.... 3/ Making prototypes, test equipment and the like can have episodes where things fail or unpredicted results can occur. You need to find these to remedy them. 4/ Best endeavours are allows used to minimise potential risks understanding what standards exist and need to be met.

Can anybody put there hand on their heart and swear that at NO TIME have they had a piece of equipment fail they may or may not become a transmitter however briefly, or even worse a 'spark gap transmitter'.

It is for those reasons that originally CE marking insisted that all these had to be marked as well. The fact thatquite a lot of these would be too large to fit into quite a few test labs, let alone be run there simulating normal usage.

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Reply to
Paul Carpenter

On 20 Oct, in article snipped-for-privacy@larwe.com "Lewin A.R.W. Edwards" wrote: ......

For watercraft start with things like IMO (International Maritime Organisation), various registries like Lloyds and various treaties. However *most* of the RF bands get covered in FCC/CE testing as these bands are not allowed for other uses, the level of emmisions may well be different (especially in aircraft). The safety and other electrical regulations get a whole lot different, just like they do with medical equipment.

I did not think the DMV did maritime vehicles.

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Paul Carpenter          | paul@pcserviceselectronics.co.uk
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Reply to
Paul Carpenter

Hi Paul,

Well, I didn't mean the category but rather how an installation has to comply. So whether or not they lump it into one category won't matter, you have to maintain the FCC limits, or in your case IEC/CISPR.

Oh, don't get me started on that one. I have run a biz in Germany and as far as I remember we had seven different VAT categories at that time. And they had seven different rates. But I had that automated with a database. Those who did it by hand grew gray hair.

Or actually makes the circuit work ;-)

Legally it's nearly all the same, class A or class B. There are very few exemptions. But of course there is some wiggle room in that they won't put you into the dungeon below the Tower Bridge if one little RF burst made it out. Now if that burst caused traffic systems to fail and a gigantic jam at Picadilly Circus, that may be another matter. If they ever find out who dunnit, that is.

Now did you have to make all of us feel guilty? The worst one was the test of a defibrillator proof design upon which the company's computer network froze up and the telephone switchboard did an auto reset. Pretty embarrassing...

Yes, that CE mark. But then again they mostly allow self certification which should ease the path for large installations.

Regards, Joerg

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Reply to
Joerg

I can't, but after reading this:

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I'm going to keep the ICOM IC-R2 in the lab tuned to 121.5 when I'm working on a new design (:

Reply to
Jim Stewart

And the US Coast Guard safety regulations.

In my state, at least (and I think most states of the US), private boats are registered with the DMV.

Reply to
Lewin A.R.W. Edwards

Yeah, this article caused us a good deal of laughter at work. We actually have a couple of products that are clocked internally at

60.75MHz, so this is more of an issue than you might think.. ;)
Reply to
Lewin A.R.W. Edwards

Embarrassing? Several times in the last month or two I've run into police officers roaming our campus yelling for blood... some of our products have built-in pager dialers... the default "there's something bad happening" message sent by these products is 911 followed by an event code and/or zone number... if someone in QA forgets to set the pager central office number before connecting this device to the phone line, it will dial 911 and hang up - and the operator assumes this means we want cops, fast. At least three times I've seen them diving into the phone switch room to trace back the line and kill it (and maybe the employee on the other end).

Reply to
Lewin A.R.W. Edwards

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