The local library system is designed for little kids and retirees. I could probably carry ALL of their technical books, from all the branches by myself, and I have to use a cane in my left hand to keep from falling. I used to know a couple used book dealers at flea markets who would hide any technical books till had a chance to look at them. I found some great deals on books that way, like a copy of Skolnik's RADAR Handbook for $5 (US) and it looked like it had just come from a shelf in a bookstore. I also found a copy of the Radiotron Designers Guide for $5 or $10.
--
Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to
prove it.
Member of DAV #85.
Michael A. Terrell
Central Florida
Yes, I missed it. On the other hand I was limping between two buildings and working on five computers at the time. I had stopped for a quick lunch and didn't take time to proofread it. I just hit "Send" as I hurried back out the door.
--
Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to
prove it.
Member of DAV #85.
Michael A. Terrell
Central Florida
That's just one of the problems. Here in the US they often require ABET compliance of your course work. For many older engineers that is not quite possible because even top notch universities didn't have some ABET cert 20+ years ago. Also, you'd exclude pretty much all foreign universities. That is hardcore discrimination and can (and would be) litigated.
That's the 2nd problem: There is no critical mass here. The classical chicken and egg situation. I know a whopping two licensed engineers but both in the wrong field since they are civil engineers. I don't know any licensed EE personally (ok, if I make it to one of Jim's parties some day I would know at least one) and have never come across one in my work. So, where would someone like me or all my colleagues obtain three supporters?
But not qualified in my field. What do they know about medical electronics? Sure, they could test me on how to design bridges and I would still remember the basics of structural load and stress calculations. Problem is, I do not design bridges.
And how would the others get a job? How would you prove experience if you never worked under, for or next to a licensed engineer because there were none?
That's scary. Passing those tests doesn't take much. But the thought of someone designing medical equipment without truly understanding EMI mechanisms, dielectric breakdown scenarios or regulations such as IEC601 would outright frighten me.
That's the theory. In practice decades of licensing rules have IMHO failed to prove that they improve anything in electrical engineering. I have even read a statement of a licensing body admitting to that.
Libraries are a sad story these days when it comes to technical education. I donate to them, including Skolnik's Radar Handbook. They almost hugged me. Strange thing, I had to look up something in Skolnik and since I had given it away went to the library. It wasn't even in the list of books. I have to ask them where it went, probably sent down to the university I guess.
No idea. But I have a hunch that it was in the basement of my late father in law's house. In which case I should have it somewhere because nobody else was keen on tech books. When I find it I'll post.
The other one is: Hanfland: "Der Neuzeitliche Maschinenbau", 1929. ("Modern Mechanical Engineering").
In no way do I endorse homework cheaters. OTOH the species of 'engineer' generally excels not because of summa cum laude academic achievements but by knowing where to find solutions or ideas.
A stark example was a patent search. Half a department was frantically looking for prior art to fend off a (rather ridiculous) infringement claim. Took me about 30 minutes on Google and I had a smoking gun dating back 40+ years.
I still have my first calculator, at Texas SR-50. Got to restore it though but I won't use it much because it's not RPN. Here is the weird thing: TI called it "slide rule"!
I guess my trusty Aristo-Scholar VS slide rule must have been miffed about that. But it keeps blessing me by never displaying 'low battery'.
That is clearly a trend. I have seen folks move to places like Arkansas. Nowadays the means communication are so excellent that it doesn't really matter where you design stuff. There are clients that I haven't seen in years but it never mattered.
The upside is that the move to a rural place can provide tranquility, less stress and a re-focus on what the real values in life are. Plus there is some great Americana to be found that I sorely miss in the cities. Saloons, country music, a "real" main street that doesn't fall dormant at night, people have time for each other, people help each other, after a while you know almost anyone and they know you, and so on. And nobody cares whether you drive a snazzy ritzy sports car or not. In fact, all you might need is a pickup truck (to haul some farwood from them thar forest...).
The only people I have come across actually interested in C. Eng or Eur. Ing are the licensing bodies/societies (fees and self perpuating) and govt depts or law courts.
No business I have ever worked for or worked with ever brought the question up.
That used to work in the UK, but ONLY for those who worked in places like British Aerospace, Plessey, GEC, British Telecom, British Rail and the like. How many of those still exist or have that many people working on designs anymore, let alone ones with time to do mentoring and sign off.
The situation is that the questions and experience get academic orientated rather than practical orientated, as the majority of people who have time to sit on these panels are usually
1/ Academics (even less os these days) 2/ Retired members 3/ Staff from large organisations that the organisation can afford these staff time to do this, usually because they are of little other use. 4/ Occasionally relevant people in the same field(s) with RECENT experience.
The same is usually of the committees, boards and other working parties for most professional societies in Uk and some around the world.
Most require you also to write some form of academic paper, when ever I have enquired.
Having never KNOWINGLY worked with any C. Eng or Eur. Ing, but in or with many companies in the UK, I do not see them as relevant. Especially any time I made enquiries about these sorts of 'senior' level of membership they never can find people who can cover the breadth and depth of my experiences which have been parts of medical equipment, various research areas, plant control or monitoring, broadcast video electronics, and even some comms devices.
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Paul Carpenter | paul@pcserviceselectronics.co.uk
PC Services
GNU H8 & mailing list info
For those web sites you hate
Bill, as much as I admire you, please come here to Slovenia and show me how we're doing worse than say Greece, Portugal, Spain or any other EU country in terms of malnutrition.
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Siol
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Rather than a heartless beep
Or a rude error message,
See these simple words: "File not found."
Thanks!. An old friends name whom I'd long forgotten. Just had a pleasurable hour rummaging through those slide rule websites. Used that Aristo for years but had absolutely no remorse in ditching it the moment I'd saved up enough for my first calculator. john
They usually are sensible about that. They look at the time and place of the degree for older engineers.
No it wouldn't. Not in the UK. There are plenty overseas universities that are recognised. Even US ones. OTOH the US is usually quite good and not recognising anything foreign.
This is sometimes a problem in the UK. The C.Eng is usually obtianed via your own institute. For SW and electronics it would be the IEE or BCS and you would know people in these. In the US I assume it would be the IEEE. They can usually provide suitable people you can talk to.
Yes. EXACTLY Qualified in your field!!!
Virtually everything. The people who asses your application and do the interview... (I forgot to mention that apart from the academic qualifications, the relevant experience and additional training there is also an interview) will be in the same field as yourself. In your case medical electronics.
In the case of a friend of mine it was a bit awkward as the top person in his field was also one of his sponsors. So he was not able to do the interview for his candidate. .
What have bridges got to do with it? Unless you are a Civil Engineer applying via the Institute of Civil Engineers.
In the UK there are enough for this to not be too much of a problem.
It scares me too but at the moment anyone can do medical stuff at the moment. However in the case where there is no degree you need to prove a lot more *relevant* experience and I thin a 10K word paper to support that is formally assessed and the three supporters and your work record signed off which as to be a LOT better than at the moment when any one can do the medical work.
If the licence became a requirement it would improve things. Just like it has in all the other professions where it is required.
the problem is that as licensing is not required most do not bother (workers or employers) Once the majority are in the system then it will improve.
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\/\/\/\/\ Chris Hills Staffs England /\/\/\/\/
/\/\/ chris@phaedsys.org www.phaedsys.org \/\/\
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Bill, himself, is so malnourished that he's demented ;-)
...Jim Thompson
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| James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens |
| Analog Innovations, Inc. | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona Voice:(480)460-2350 | |
| E-mail Address at Website Fax:(480)460-2142 | Brass Rat |
| http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |
It's what you learn, after you know it all, that counts.
No problem. I am starting to lose my close-up eyesight to diabetes, and have to depend on the spell checker. I have severe carpal tunnel (The VA and Shands hospital doctors tell me the surgery won't help me) so I have to type with just a couple fingers. That causes me a lot of spelling errors. I get so busy trying to make sure the spelling is correct that I sometimes forget to check the syntax.
--
Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to
prove it.
Member of DAV #85.
Michael A. Terrell
Central Florida
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