Just to add more aspects to this discussion. In Germany, practically all houses have 400V three-phase electricity, which is three 230V phases 120° degrees apart. So all the normal 230V outlets are just a single phase out of those three plus neutral.
Big appliances in a fixed location like electric ovens and water heaters get all three phases but are not required to use them in balance.
The nice thing about this is that if you want to set up a workshop in your house, all you need is some extra fuses and cable and a couple those nice big, red CEKON sockets.
Leaving aside the joining wires/terminal blocks issue, on the subject of the plugs and sockets, the UK one to me is superior in many ways.
fused plugs.
cord grip in plugs
screw terminals in plugs -no wrapping wires.
ALL receptacles and plugs have earth pin.
3 prong design means a better fit (they don't waggle about at all)
much thicker pins - handle more current, do not bend, and seem to resist arcing damage better.
switched sockets .....etc.
The US /japan one only has the advantage of compact size, personally I can live with a bigger plug if it means better performance. I couldn't care less about cosmetic aspects!
Ok, I'll conceed that one, but only 50%, after all, how many people put a 16amp fuse on a .5mm cord?
You can get them in the U.S. I occasionaly use them here for 120 volt equipment (I brought a few items with me) and had a friend bring me some LEVITON (high quality plugs) from the U.S. They ave execelent grips on them.
The Leviton plugs have them too. I'm not sure they are an advantage, the gripping area is the area of the screw shaft,not the circumfrence times the area of the wire surface, a lot smaller.
Cut me a break. Since around 1960 all of the outlets in the U.S. have grounds. In the U.K. you can buy appliances with 2 condoctor cords with two plug pins that can usually be forced into U.K. outlets. They are supposed to be for export to the E.U. but they are sold.
Many of the appliances sold here come that way too, but I must be the only person who cuts them off and puts three pin plugs with large grips on them. I also write the name of the appliance on its plug.
It does not make an difference electricaly, the appliances come with two conductor cords and I don't replace them.
See above.
That's a big problem here. Many appliances use 15-16 amps (at 230 volts) and come with the smaller round plugs which are rated at 16 amps, but not for continuous duty. When we moved into this appartment, all of the outlets had burnt "hot" pins because the previous tenants plugged high current heaters into them.
I replaced the outlet for our oven with an airconditioner plug, which except for the round pins looks like a U.K. plug. It's no longer used we replaced it with a gas oven.
switched sockets
Maybe. only good if they are not at floor level.
One advantage we have here in Israel is that all new construction requires a GFI on all outlets. Usually it's BEFORE the main circuit breaker.
As someone said earlier, it depends upon how much you pay. If you buy cheap junk, you get cheap junk. :-)
Geoff.
--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson, Jerusalem, Israel gsm@mendelson.com N3OWJ/4X1GM
IL Voice: (07)-7424-1667 U.S. Voice: 1-215-821-1838
Visit my 'blog at http://geoffstechno.livejournal.com/
13 amp is the largest plug top fuse. And all flex these days is such that it will blow a 13 amp fuse in event of a short - to allow for the fact that householders won't use the correct fuse.
You've no choice in the UK - all plugs must conform to the BS standard. One without a cord grip wouldn't.
No you can't - legally. With the exception of shavers or toothbrushes etc designed to fit a transformer isolated bathroom outlet, everything must be fitted with a '13 amp' plug with a suitable fuse.
Well if you reach down to plug/unplug you can operate a switch at the same time. Most do as it's sort of bred into them through habit - most outlets have always been switched in the UK.
The usual modern way here is to have a split load consumer unit. One set of MCBs protected by an RCD and one set not. The non protected used for fixed loads like cookers and water heaters where slight leakage might cause an RCD to trip. But we seem to be moving to one RCBO (RCD and MCB combined) per circuit.
In general it's not possible to buy poor quality plugs and sockets in the UK.
This is one example of the bottom end price wise, but will give good service for years.
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Of course you can pay several times that much for chrome etc finish accessories.
--
*Growing old is inevitable, growing up is optional
Dave Plowman dave@davenoise.co.uk London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.
Most US-style fixtures have some plastic barriers between hot and neutral and ground. If the wire was stripped too long the barriers don't help... :-(.
Stranded is the standard for line cords. I've never seen a line cord with solid copper (maybe forbidden by code?)
Knob-and-tube was used through the 40's, maybe even 50's, in some places in the US, and in most places is still allowed for repairs and even extensions (if you can find the stuff! And no inspector ever agrees with anyone on how to extend knob-and-tube using Romex!)
Where Romex is allowed, you're right. But there are some localities where even residences have to be wired with conduit and there the ease of pulling stranded outweighs the slightly increased cost for the stranded for a lot of runs.
When I was in the local reference library today I looked up when the last Southampton, England house was converted from DC to the new-fangled 240V ac. It was 28 September 1967
-- Diverse Devices, Southampton, England electronic hints and repair briefs , schematics/manuals list on
Electric clothes dryer, stoves/ovens, and permanently installed air conditioners are only available in 240 V versions. Also, larger sizes of electric space heaters. The first three are probably more likely to be wired in directly to a junction box than to use a plug/socket. There are several incompatible types of 240 V plugs. All are huge, bigger than the UK plug, and expensive. Tam
Really! I'm amazed... I thought Romex really had taken over the country completely... does some locality think Romex is dangerous? Or they just haven't updated their electrical codes to take it into account?
Hey, Louisiana was the last state to finally outlaw c*ck fights, doing so... today. Hmm...
Well, much of the "fires" due to faulty wiring are because we have
*had* wiring as a general condition in most houses since the early
1900s, so after 100 years or so it gets a little tired, and when overloaded can fail. Of course, 100 years ago, y'all had very nice green lawns and gorgeous buildings.... but little electricity other than the very wealthy. Other fires are due to just plain idiocy on the part of users, such that would occur here, there or anywhere else. Very damned few fires are caused by properly utilized wiring even if
100 years old.
As to wire-nuts, what would you propose? Per the code, they must be enclosed, the expectation is that the wires are first twisted together, then the nut is attached, and the internal threaded section is spring-loaded. Are you seriously telling me that wire-nuts are not permitted in your country?
De gustibus non est disputandum. Electricity has been working for us over here a good deal longer than it has been working for you over there. The typical poor-man's rowhouse (900 sf, 100 sm) in Philadelphia has been wired since 1913. Parts of NYC have been wired since the late 1800s...
On the other hand, there is something to be said for observing the experiences of others for 50 years or so before taking the plunge... Cell phones are a similar item. The US started Analog, only slowly went digital because of legacy issues, Europe dropped the first nearly
10 years of teething, the Middle East and third-world went right to Tri-band....
My "rich man's" rowhouse built in 1916 in Philly, which was quite deteriorated by 1975 when I moved in had a meterboard marked "Philadelphia Electric Company 1925" on it. I call it a "rich man's" house because it was 1200 square feet, had a basement, hardwood floors and some expensive (at the time) finishing touches.
When I moved in it had 25 amp 240 volt service with a four circuit fuse box. I upgraded it to a 16 circuit fusebox and later had the whole thing replaced with 200 amp service.
To follow the Philly theme, Willingboro, New Jersey (originaly Levittown) houses were wired with aluminum wire because of a copper miner's stike in South America. By the 1970's the wires broke inside the walls, arced over and caught fire.
Geoff.
--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson, Jerusalem, Israel gsm@mendelson.com N3OWJ/4X1GM
IL Voice: (07)-7424-1667 U.S. Voice: 1-215-821-1838
Visit my \'blog at http://geoffstechno.livejournal.com/
No, he IS saying it is in use. Some of it has been replaced, but not all of it.
Geoff.
--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson, Jerusalem, Israel gsm@mendelson.com N3OWJ/4X1GM
IL Voice: (07)-7424-1667 U.S. Voice: 1-215-821-1838
Visit my \'blog at http://geoffstechno.livejournal.com/
As late as about 1980, my father in law's house still had some original ca
1906 wiring. It was cloth over rubber, like telephone wire. In fact, it probably was. Part of the house had been rewired so you could use a hair dryer or clothes iron. Fuses were short pieces of bare small gage wire between two terminals. You had to turn off the main power switch (It had a big handle) to change a "fuse". I hope the new owner did some electrical work.
When an appliance has its own fuse, a faulty appliance disables itself. With unfused plugs that most countries use, someone can and likely will plug the faulty appliance into another socket at some point, and be exposed to the danger again, possibly several times as it changes hands.
The fuse only need be rated to supply the appliance, so most protective fuses will thus be of much lower current rating (typ 3A) than they would be on unfused plug circuits. This improves discrimination greatly, helping to ensure more faults are cleared quickly and safely.
Many plugs not having them means lots of damaged and failed connections due to repeated movement and strain. Sale of gripless plugs has been illegal here since the early 70s.
I used to use gripless plugs years ago, and all the bad connections, wires coming out and most-strand-broken conductors that happened then are rarely seen with today's gripped plugs.
What happens is the copper flex deforms to fit the connector and screw. Having used both modern connectors and old wraparounds, the modern one is much more reliable. The greater contact area of wraparounds is of no benefit in practice, screws provide more than enough contact area.
I'd agree with you there, and hope 2 pin UK plugs become permitted one day, probably only premoulded ones on appliances to stop their misuse.
However when 2 pin rewirable plugs are sold it is inevitable some will be misused on 3 core leads.
not legal here.
The only time EU 2 pin plugs are sold on appliances is when a UK adaptor is permanently attached to the 2 pin plug, bringing it up to UK standards. These are seen now and then on imported goods that were orignally intended for the (non-UK) european market.
Also there are 2 very similar types of 2 pin plug which sometimes causes confusion. The modern EU ones cant fit a UK socket, the pins are too fat and too closely spaced. Forcing doesnt work. There are also historic French plugs that look similar and do fit our sockets with a bit of fiddling, but very rarely does one see one of those used over here. They have 4mm pins. I dont think I've seen one in over 20 years.
waggly sockets are unheard of here, but common in US.
Means goods are switched safely rather than by pulling the lead out, which damages socket contacts by arcing, leading to overheating and fire. Also means many appliances and cords arent left live when not in use. Most UK sockets are switched, though not all.
We have a bit of an issue with socket positions here. The great majority of sockets are low down, and this doesn't stop the switches being used. However new builds now require them high up for dubious PC reasons, transforming trailing leads into trip hazards, which I think will only cause more injuries and electrical faults.
...which naturally dominates a price-led market. A political issue AIUI.
Here our cheapest stuff has 3 solid pins, half insulated pins, cordgrips, shutters, screw connections on plugs and all sockets, and is normally solid reliable equipment.
It seems to be political why the US doesn't want to stop the sale of unsafe accessories and the deaths that result.
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