Escrow Service and Counterfeit Goods

It's prohibited in outbound international mail:

And it's not a crime, intrinsically, they're just prohibited items. Courier services usually have the same prohibition for international shipments also

That it's somehow illegal to ship counterfeit items around domestically to your hearts content as a private citizen to other private citizens, or as a return to a corporate entity, for no financial gain on your part, seems like nonsense.

The crime is "trafficking" and it's pretty well-defined what trafficking is. If you're not trafficking in counterfeit goods, and you're not shipping prohibited items in the particular circumstances that the couriers prohibit shipping them I don't see what the problem is

snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote: ==========================

** Only if it leaves the country. FYI I have been involved in such an case. ** Not overseas, just proof of the items being counterfeit. ** Yes, contracts cannot make or allow either party do something illegal.

Whats up ? Got some bad semis from Asia?

...... Phil

"Cheap, and worth it."

I ordered five of these from China they sent me ten by mistake lol:

They work well enough so long as you de-rate them on output power by about half of what's claimed

I don't understand why you say "domestically". The goods were bought from China and need to be returned there.

I don't understand why you say this is not "trafficking". What else is trafficking other than selling counterfeit goods? Returning counterfeit goods for a refund is not substantially different from selling them in the first place.

You seem to be constructing an argument without a basis in fact.

There is also the fact that this could be considered exactly "trafficking" with a significant penalty.

18 U.S. Code § 2320 - Trafficking in counterfeit goods or services (a) Offenses.—Whoever intentionally— (1) traffics in goods or services and knowingly uses a counterfeit mark on or in connection with such goods or services, ... snip other similar offenses ... or attempts or conspires to violate any of paragraphs (1) through (4) shall be punished as provided in subsection (b). (b) Penalties.— (1) In general.—Whoever commits an offense under subsection (a)— (A) if an individual, shall be fined not more than $2,000,000 or imprisoned not more than 10 years, or both, and, if a person other than an individual, shall be fined not more than $5,000,000; and

Second offense is $5 million dollars and 20 years. Seems rather excessive for what is essentially a financial crime. I see murderers get less time... well, maybe not in Texas or Florida.

Yes, I have some unobtanium parts that are clearly counterfeit. The price wasn't so low I thought they were fake. I now know to at least ask for photos of markings and package labeling. Seems when they "refurbish" chips (I wasn't told they were refurbs until I found they didn't work) they sand off the markings and re-engrave them with the laser. They seem to flip over the chip as well as the pin one mark was laser etched with an embossed pin 1 mark on the bottom. So these aren't fake chips, they are some other chip, relabeled.

At this point I don't even trust US suppliers as I have no experience with any of them other than the mainstream vendors. Vyrian in Texas claims to have parts, but their conversations tend toward "when can we get a PO?"

Interestingly enough I found some (not enough) parts on eBay from a guy who bought a reel for a new design just before the factory burned down. Once he found out the problem he respun the board for a different chip. Now he is making a bundle on his "misfortune". He will bring the chips to my contract assembler who happens to be an hour drive, where we will test them and exchange the funds. This I trust.

If you look at the first four photos, the third is a mirror image. I see this a lot on the Internet and wonder why? Is this some sort of attempt to detect copying? I don't see how that image is any better by being reversed.

Also, what's up with what looks like an automotive fuse? Is that soldered in?

How am I supposed to know where or why or who you bought them from I'm not a mind reader, damn.

There are lots that look like this that are variations on a theme, mine has two outputs that one has one, and the fan header and third cap is populated. The -V output doesn't regulate properly unless the +V is loaded, though.

Yep it's an automotive fuse on the real item too. Not soldered in it's socketed. Probably didn't want to pay for a glass fuse + holder or make the PCB any larger to accommodate it.

We don't use stuff like that in our products; too risky.

But we had some problems with our standard edge-launch SMA connectors. A batch of boards were at and a bit over their max thickness tolerance and the connectors wouldn't fit.

These are insanely cheap, they fit the boards, and they seem to be quite nice.

snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote: =========================

** Cos you made no distinction in your post. ** Fraid doing that is illegal. ** The words " no fininacial gain" arepretty simple. ** Which you are NOT doing. ** It is *very different* !!!!.

FYI: I once bought 100 counterfeit MJ15003/4s from a local dealer. I was lied to about the source being a Motorola agent, it was not. He offered me a refund if I returned them. By then, I knew I was dealing with a crook so I made sure he could not sell them on. By removing all the ink markings with acetone.

Got a hot letter from his lawyer for doing that. Sent a even even hotter reply to said lawyer.

Still got my refund cheque a few weeks later.....

• * ROTFL - pot / kettle.

** FFS get you hand off it wanker !!

...... Phil

Exactly. But you assumed, that's on you.

snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote: =============================

** NO HE FUCKING DID NOT !!!!!!

The post covered BOTH possibilities !!!!

Learn how to READ - you dumbfuck asshole

There would have to be considerable doubt as to whether returning something to an escrow service would meet the definition of trafficking given in that section, and also whether the use of the mark in that context satisfies the test in (f)(1)(A)(iv).

Sylvia.

Sylvia Else wrote: ==============

** HUH ?????

Massive false assumption.

..... Phil

Not to an escrow service, to the seller in China.

Sure, someone could mount a defense. I simply don't want to have to even explain. I've made it very clear in my messages to the seller that I know the goods are counterfeits. The alleged original manufactured has said the markings are forgeries and I passed on that email to the seller. I certainly could not claim I was not aware the goods were counterfeits.

I don't see how there can be any question at all that the marks are intended "to deceive". What are you saying? The only question is that they were so poor, anyone with a minimal amount of knowledge of true AKM markings would know these were fakes. Still, you don't have to be a good counterfeiter to be a counterfeiter.

Me neither. I've used them for some one-off prototypes and for my tube experiments. There are only 3 chips, an ST UC3842 current-mode PWM controller, LM358 comparator, 78L09 regulator. The FET is an "RU7088R":

The output isn't particularly clean, and the flyback transformer and output caps are probably under-specced for the claimed 40W continuous,

70W peak.

Incidentally do you know where to get "automotive" ribbon cables? I can't find them anywhere from a US distributor. 14 pins, the wide ones like 2" wide, not IDC you just friction-fit them in the socket.

No, sorry, don't know about those.

Sylvia Else wrote: =============

** Certainly, if you return items for a refund with a cover note saying : " These devices are all counterfeits and useless to me or anyone "

You are not gonna be liable for being misleading or fraudulent.

However, if you have reason to believe the supplier is regularly *dealing* in counterfeits and so likely to sell them on to another - you have every right to deface them. This also has the added benefit of protecting you from suspicion of dealing in fakes.

..... Phil