We had this subject a little while ago and I think we came to the conclusion that those little plugin power factor correction devices don't work. Meaning they won't reduce you power bill by a measurable amount. Not for the undistorted current and not for the harmonics.
There is a new player in the market and they even send pamphlets to private households, asking $199, discounted (RRP $299):
Would you find it appropriate to alert the ACCC?
Tony
If you read the blurb under "Learn More" you discover that what they're claiming is that correcting the power factor and eliminating harmonics reduces energy losses in the wiring between the meter and the appliance. They expressly admit that the power meter does not charge for reactive power.
On that basis the device will reduce power bills - just not by very much. Their claim of 10% seems improbable in the extreme.
I'll drop a line to the ACCC about it myself, but I know what will happen, which is that they'll advise me that they've recorded it in their database, which is code for "they'll do stuff all about it."
Sylvia.
"TonyS"
** The simple truth is they INCREASE your power bill !!!Cos the device ( a couple of 10uF caps probably ) is powered all the time and hence drawing current all the time - and that creates I squared R losses ALL the time.
** Been done.Thing is, there is no evidence from that site that ANY have been sold yet.
The ACCC are not concerned about a scam that is not in operation plus they need to get a device and have it tested before taking any action.
Kindy find something *worth* worrying about - the choice is endless.
.... Phil
**As Phil and Sylvia have already stated, you are wasting your time. It might be better to spend your time suggesting to the ACCC to investigate Tony Abbott's dodgy claims about his CO2 reduction scheme. It has been comprehensively debunked by every economist in the country.
TonyS wrote in news:f7adnXxGB-2HXY7TnZ2dnUVZ snipped-for-privacy@westnet.com.au:
I do recall seeing inside one of those on an overseas trip earlier this year. I remember it had a micro and a reasonable amount of processing electronics, it is not in my field so I did not take much notice.
"Geoff"
** Really ??????????????????** So it draws power of its own all the time too ?
That will be way more than any I squared R savings could ever be.
.... Phil
"Phil Allison" wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@mid.individual.net:
Yes, and it stuck in my mind cos it was an Aussie company.( was demoed as an example of good plastic injection moulding capability)
Good, I have contacted ACCC and they contacted the company straight away. GO4GREEN replied immediately with a long email stating how their device has been tested by a reputable engineering company and its proper function be irrefutable. I also contacted the marketing company that distributes the flyer, which I probably shouldn't have done. I could read some threats between the lines of the go4green response.
Tony
[...]
I am puzzled as to how an active device is correcting PF and harmonics???
"TonyS"
** Irrelevant that is has some undefined function.The claim it saves the user money is not demonstrated and highly fraudulent.
** Only shows that they are very nervous..... Phil
Well, it takes more than just processing power. Typically, it'll require a largish capacitor. But sticking just a capacitor across the wires will create the very problem it's meant to be solving when the (presumed inductive) load is absent. So current through the capacitor has to be controlled.
Sylvia.
none of it will make any difference as the carbon is not creating any problems in the first place. Julia will just lower your standard of living - for absolutely nothing
Fortunately it seems about 60% of Australians have seen through the bullshit.
"kreed"
none of it will make any difference as the carbon is not creating any problems in the first place.
Julia will just lower your standard of living - for absolutely nothing
Fortunately it seems about 60% of Australians have seen through the bullshit.
** Only 60% ??IMO - rabid greenies are thee only supporters of a CO2 based tax.
Thing is, the ALP are beholding to them for any hope of re-election.
So much for democracy - eh ?
.... Phil
and there's the problem. Garnaut et al are economists, and that qualifies them as experts on the environment exactly how?
I agree with that 100%
In my post, I was just referring to the "official polls" published in the mainstream media, they show approximately 60% against the carbon tax. I personally think this is greatly understating the opposition to it.
From what I hear in the general community, it would be more like 90% against. For the first time ever, I am hearing more and more raw anger brewing among people over this and many other things
I have yet to run into anyone who has a good thing to say about Gillard.
As for democracy, we only have the choice between a couple of masters that we are forced to obey and be slaves too
As seen with Gillard, they can fraudulently promise anything they want to us to get votes and into power, but these promises mean nothing anyway.
We live under little more than a dictatorship that is dressed up in drag as a free democratic society, and the more I see, much of the world does too.
As for our democracy, with its overload of bludging bogan ferals, our "democratic system" is more akin to 2 cats and a mouse sitting down to democratically vote on what will be for dinner.
They aren't claiming 10% (anymore(?)), just implying it.
On their home page it says "The EnergySmart is designed and proven to reduce kWh usage and electricity costs by up to 10% and more in a standard single phase property including homes, offices, shops and light commercial premises."
The "up to" is a weasel word, but it seems to me that they still have to substantiate their claim in the sense of showing that 10% is a number that it is possible to exceed (to justify "and more") in a standard single phase property. An empty house with large inductors across the power points doesn't count.
Sylvia.
"kreed"
We live under little more than a dictatorship that is dressed up in drag as a free democratic society, and the more I see, much of the world does too.
** Careful - you are sounding a bit radical there......As for our democracy, with its overload of bludging bogan ferals, our "democratic system" is more akin to 2 cats and a mouse sitting down to democratically vote on what will be for dinner.
** That IS s rather good.You ought to copyright it ...........
.... Phil
Except that the ACCC can only investigate claims made in the course of trade. Whatever one might think of the claims of politicians, whether Tony Abbott, or otherwise, they are not made in the course of trade.
Sylvia.
The only way of defeating the market for this stuff is to pirate it. Yes, seriously. Just crack open some of these ripoffs in front of a camera identifying its components and drawing the schematic, then post the video to youtube encouraging everyone to build his one. For those not into electronics one could also offer very cheap kits/clones using identical components and schematic, making clear that the intended purpose is to ask, say, $15 to give people enough knowledge to save $200.
I'm pretty sure the manufacturers lawyers would *not* come after the clone maker and their clients will have to find something else to rob people.
Have something to add? Share your thoughts — no account required.
Ask the community — no account required