Two bridge rectifiers on a centre tapped transformer?

You have invented a four-diode bridge fed from the ends of the transformer. The bridge branches connected to the centre tap are in parallel, and they do not serve any useful purpose.

I re-drafted the schematic for LTSpice:

---- clip clip ----

Version 4 SHEET 1 880 680 WIRE 224 16 112 16 WIRE 384 16 224 16 WIRE 496 16 384 16 WIRE 688 16 496 16 WIRE 112 64 112 16 WIRE 224 64 224 16 WIRE 384 64 384 16 WIRE 496 64 496 16 WIRE 688 96 688 16 WIRE 112 144 112 128 WIRE 112 144 -272 144 WIRE 224 144 224 128 WIRE 304 144 224 144 WIRE 384 144 384 128 WIRE 384 144 304 144 WIRE 496 144 496 128 WIRE 576 144 496 144 WIRE 112 176 112 144 WIRE 224 176 224 144 WIRE 384 176 384 144 WIRE 496 176 496 144 WIRE -272 208 -272 144 WIRE 112 288 112 240 WIRE 224 288 224 240 WIRE 224 288 112 288 WIRE 384 288 384 240 WIRE 384 288 224 288 WIRE 496 288 496 240 WIRE 496 288 384 288 WIRE 688 288 688 176 WIRE 688 288 496 288 WIRE -272 368 -272 288 WIRE -112 368 -272 368 WIRE 304 368 304 144 WIRE 304 368 -112 368 WIRE -112 416 -112 368 WIRE -272 448 -272 368 WIRE -272 576 -272 528 WIRE 576 576 576 144 WIRE 576 576 -272 576 FLAG -112 416 0 SYMBOL diode 128 128 R180 WINDOW 0 24 64 Left 2 WINDOW 3 24 0 Left 2 SYMATTR InstName D1 SYMATTR Value 1N4148 SYMBOL diode 128 240 R180 WINDOW 0 24 64 Left 2 WINDOW 3 24 0 Left 2 SYMATTR InstName D2 SYMATTR Value 1N4148 SYMBOL diode 240 128 R180 WINDOW 0 24 64 Left 2 WINDOW 3 24 0 Left 2 SYMATTR InstName D3 SYMATTR Value 1N4148 SYMBOL diode 240 240 R180 WINDOW 0 24 64 Left 2 WINDOW 3 24 0 Left 2 SYMATTR InstName D4 SYMATTR Value 1N4148 SYMBOL diode 400 128 R180 WINDOW 0 24 64 Left 2 WINDOW 3 24 0 Left 2 SYMATTR InstName D5 SYMATTR Value 1N4148 SYMBOL diode 400 240 R180 WINDOW 0 24 64 Left 2 WINDOW 3 24 0 Left 2 SYMATTR InstName D6 SYMATTR Value 1N4148 SYMBOL diode 512 128 R180 WINDOW 0 24 64 Left 2 WINDOW 3 24 0 Left 2 SYMATTR InstName D7 SYMATTR Value 1N4148 SYMBOL diode 512 240 R180 WINDOW 0 24 64 Left 2 WINDOW 3 24 0 Left 2 SYMATTR InstName D8 SYMATTR Value 1N4148 SYMBOL res 672 80 R0 SYMATTR InstName R1 SYMATTR Value 120 SYMBOL voltage -272 192 R0 WINDOW 123 0 0 Left 0 WINDOW 39 0 0 Left 0 SYMATTR InstName V1 SYMATTR Value SINE(0 17 100) SYMBOL voltage -272 432 R0 WINDOW 123 0 0 Left 0 WINDOW 39 0 0 Left 0 SYMATTR InstName V2 SYMATTR Value SINE(0 17 100) TEXT 70 454 Left 2 !.tran 100m

---- clip clip ----

Reply to
Tauno Voipio
Loading thread data ...

Is ALSO a civilian award. Its also a military rank in both the navy and airforce.

Reply to
Rod Speed

So not as easy as just adding a choke?

Yes it is rectified and smoothed. Bridge rectifier and massive capacitor.

I was thinking of how to use a bridge on each half then put both in parallel, but because they are currently (oh dear) in series, I think it's impossible.

So I got nasty. I've hacked into the coils and changed it into three sets of unconnected coils. Which I then paralleled and bridge rectified and smoothed. Got a nice 60 amps, but the voltage change from open circuit to full load is too high. I'm going to try a large capacitor, as there's quite a ripple.

It's destination is to power many GPUs which want 11.6V to 12.6V. The load on the transformer can vary dramatically as they process data or not.

Reply to
Commander Kinsey

Good idea, I shall add those accordingly, got loads of heatsinks and fans kicking about.

Can I do the same with a SMPS? Mind you they're probably limited so I'd need to alter the circuit.

Reply to
Commander Kinsey

Yes, air flow increases the power capability of most things. Resistors can be run at 1.5 to as much as 5x rated power with a lot of air. This is usually best determined by testing.

A flyback power supply may never put out much more than design power... probably not cooling limited.

Reply to
John Larkin

Thanks! It just so happens I just downloaded LTSpice, I'd not got round to working out how to use it though. Where do you get the components to insert? I couldn't find the voltage source for example, only buttons for a handful of components.

I have loaded the file you created below. It appears the load gets 24V RMS, as I suspected - I wasn't sure as I could trace both 12V and 24V getting to the load, I guess the 24V wins. I was trying to give it two 12V in parallel, but the power is going forwards through one bridge and back through the other. Is there any way to stop this?

Reply to
Commander Kinsey

This shows a voltage source symbol.

[Picture]

formatting link
The .tran statement shows how long the simulation should run, and stands for "transient analysis" or so.

And this isn't a real simulation, in the sense that there's no behavioral model of a transformer in there, to show regulation effects.

*******

And while you're simulating, have a look at the Hammond low-power transformer catalog. The eleventh page has a few equations.

formatting link
On the thirty-fourth page, you'll find a toroidal transformer. One of the downsides of these (apparently), is a fairly nasty inrush current. If you don't tame the inrush current, it could cause your mains to drop enough, to knock out your computers in the same room. If you use an AC switch to the toroid, it might destroy the switch contacts after some number of cycles. I don't know if Hammond has a recommended circuit for the mains side, or not. The characteristics of laminate transformers might be a bit softer than that.

They also do high power transformers suited to the power company, but this too is likely a bit of a miss, for what you intend. So I don't know if they actually carry the kind of transformer you're looking at. I bought a transformer from them, for my computer speaker amp (drives some leftover bookshelf speakers at a puny power level).

Some of the toroids, have dual secondary windings. You get four wires for output, and if you want to "stack rectifiers without doing LTSpice", you can.

Paul

Reply to
Paul

They get damn hot. What else would limit it?

Reply to
Commander Kinsey

Energy stored in the inductor times the pulse rate is the limit of output power, and both are usually limited.

Cooling will improve reliability if it's getting hot.

Reply to
John Larkin

One of them (12V 83A) smells bad at only 60A. But it's been running 24/7 like that for a couple of years.

Another (12V 40A) gave up after running at half power for 4 months. When I opened it I found the two largest transistors weren't tightly attached to the heatsink, and were dead shorts across all three pins. Would that have killed anything else in the circuit? I've ordered two replacement transistors (J13009). To be fair, it used to power a scuba compressor (at 40A) which made a lot of vibration.

Reply to
Commander Kinsey

Unlikely to be a flyback, at that power.

Bad heat sinking for sure.

Heat skinks are expensive so that's where people skrimp. More air will certainly make power supplies more reliable.

Vibration may have loosened the screws on the transistors.

Reply to
John Larkin

Ah! So the AND gate is actually a symbol meaning "any component". Not very intuitive.

Reply to
Commander Kinsey

Never made much heat when the heatsinks were in place.

What's weird is I have two of the 83A ones, the new one makes a quarter of the heat. Same design, same manufacturer, looks a little bit different peeking through the vents. Can they really improve efficiency that much?

Reply to
Commander Kinsey

Never made much heat when the heatsinks were in place.

What's weird is I have two of the 83A ones, the new one makes a quarter of the heat. Same design, same manufacturer, looks a little bit different peeking through the vents. Can they really improve efficiency that much?

Reply to
Commander Kinsey

Never made much heat when the heatsinks were in place.

What's weird is I have two of the 83A ones, the new one makes a quarter of the heat. Same design, same manufacturer, looks a little bit different peeking through the vents. Can they really improve efficiency that much?

Reply to
Commander Kinsey

Don't worry, it's well beyond your capability.

Reply to
Fredxx

You don't use LT Spice?

Reply to
John Larkin

I used PSpice a long long time ago.

Reply to
Commander Kinsey

ElectronDepot website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.