LEDs, a somewhat surpising result

Dec 23, 2013 9 Replies

LEDs, a somewhat surprising result I wanted to see if I could make an ozone detector by looking at the ratio of absorption of yellow versus blue and red light for detection of the ozone generated spark in my air speed meter.



This can be done by switching a RGB LED, so R, G, B, sequentially and looking (with an ADC and PIC) for ratio changes with a photo detector (I wanted to use a BPW21, as I already have used that in the Tritium decay experiment, but that part needs ordering. So I was wondering what would happen if used the same RGB LED as detector and as transmitter of light, wondering if red would see red, and blue blue, and green green..



Anyways, the setup, the LED are driven by exactly 20 mA. The receiver side photo current is measured with the Chinese multimeter in the 2000 MOhm (no typo) range:

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Transmitter is in front, receiver looking towards the camera (these LEDs are BLINDING). Close up with alligators:
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And the results, those are puzzling:

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First we see red shining on red, that gives some photo current, as expected, red -> green does nothing (good) red -> blue nothing (also good).



But then.... green shining on red does something green shining on green does nothing green shining on blue does nothing mmm strange



And finally Blue shining on red gives the strongest signal yet. blue shining on green also very strong, and blue shing on blue is a lot weaker.



I color coded the receive wires, and measured everything twice, the 00 symbol means on 2000 MOhm meter range infinite. I actually measure resistance, but that is just reverse current in the LEDs.



So, from this, with the R, G, B LEDs in parallel, these LEDs should be able to detect white light..... :-) Not so sure about the spectral curve at all...


Simple.

The photons have energies red < green < blue.

Corresponding to the bandgap (and voltage drop) of the leds.

In detector mode, photons with energy higher than the bandgap of the detector get detected.

Of course if you don't believe in photons I have no explanation for you... :)

John Devereux

On a sunny day (Mon, 23 Dec 2013 14:17:11 +0000) it happened John Devereux wrote in :

Photon is just the energy needed to knock that electron into a different place (in the widest sense of the word). It is a mathematical construct, and should not be used or viewed as a 'particle'.

Yes, basic physics, the ultra violet catastrophe, blue 'photons' have a higher energy...... Planck's experiment and constant.

In free space however the wave is _not_ quantisized, as least not at the granularity level we can detect. It is only at the interaction of wave and matter the quantization takes place.

And actually the sentence 'In detector mode, photons with energy higher than the bandgap of the detector get detected' is not correct, it depends on the detector, look at it from a resonance POV, some detectors are only sensitive to _one_ specific wavelength, or energy. And that was one thing this experiment I just did was also curious about, would the (bandgap structure) in a red LED make it more sensitive for red, same for blue, etc...

The third thing (or yet an other if you have counting problems), is the intensity ratio for the RGB LEDs, Normally we use, in color TV, .3 R, .59 blue, and .11 red for eyes to see '1' 'white'. When radiating with that strong blue light we see detection values for red, green, and blue as 4, 12, 36, or intensity ratios as 1/4, 1/12, 1/36, or 9 to 3 to 1, showing the red LED is a much better detector than I would expect from the _emitted_ light ratios. Maybe the bandgaps in the RED LED are lower, electrons fly away more easily?

  • Do YOU belong to the church of Pho Ton? Do you care a particle about light? Emit a ray of hope!

The church of Pho Ton preaches that electrons do not have wings. Go forth and emit no more!

Brother Baer, I HAVE SEEN the LIGHT.

Best regards, Spehro Pefhany

"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward" speff@interlog.com Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com

Wave, particle, the Holy Duality.

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc jlarkin at highlandtechnology dot com http://www.highlandtechnology.com Precision electronic instrumentation Picosecond-resolution Digital Delay and Pulse generators Custom laser drivers and controllers Photonics and fiberoptic TTL data links VME thermocouple, LVDT, synchro acquisition and simulation

You sure about that? I'm not sure it makes any difference in your conclusion, but For any on-scale (non infinite) reading, the led current it exactly the current supplied by the meter current source. You're measuring the voltage at which that fixed current happens.

Like I said, may not affect your conclusion. Might matter if you intend making actual measurements and inferring light intensity.

And it is dim!

Jamie

Sung by the synchrotrons.

Jamie

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