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I notice from your post on "Stop Light Design" that you're no stranger
to PICs, and you went ahead with what you considered a valid solution
with, it seems to me, little regard for the learning curve or the OP's
experience with PICs or the length of time it was going to take to
debug your code and program the chip, so what's got your knickers in a
bunch this time? Perhaps because I had the temerity to post a better
solution than your dual 555 mess on this thread? Perhaps because I
suggested a µC before you did? Who knows, and more importantly, who
gives a shit.
Oh, and before I forget: Fuck you, Jones, and have a nice April 1st!
I have a vision of a crane with an electromagnet lifting tons of stuff. IF that's the case, you DO NOT EVER WANT TO INTERFACE WITH THE MAGNET IN ANY WAY!!! You build a device to supply information into the operator's decision process. Even inhibiting the "on" button can cause you legal grief if the magnet is needed in an emergency and it don't work because of you.
Last thing you want is a ton of steel falling out of the sky 'cause you turned off the magnet...no that's the second to last thing. Last thing you want is an injury accident traced to something with which you were even peripherally associated.
If temperature is the issue, that's what you should be measuring.
If we're talking about a hand-held tape demagnetizer...never mind...
mike, AKA Dumbass
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Looks like the "funster" done evacuated the area when pressed to give the real meaning of the 50% and 5 minute interval- so not a critical application, probably something like a solenoid to release air blast to load Batman underwear into a package...
I never said a PIC was an easy solution, where you did - that is the difference. PICS ARE NOT SIMPLE DEVICES - except if John Fields is using them, since he's the world's biggest know-it-all. Furthermore, a stoplight program is trivial compared to a 50% duty cycle/temperature integration program. I couldn't care less about your bloated ego, sorry. Only females should be put on a pedistal, and even then, pedistals are still a bad thing. Are you implying you're a woman? Or that you just want to be treated like one?
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Really? If you can show where I said that a PIC was an easy solution
I'd appreciate seeing it. What I thought I said was that a µC would
be a less expensive solution, in terms of the hardware required to do
the job, and I don't think you can dispute that.
That's the first truly intelligent thing you've said since sticking your head out from between your mother's legs (and gasping for air.)
To think, you resorted to cutting down my mother with childish slander. How old are you again? Ego get a boost there? Johnnie boy, hehe, grow up. So far all you've done is proven your ego-centricity and childishness. Yeah, you might know quite a bit about electronics, but you're still an arrogant, egocentric, childish jerk. Chew on that for awhile. Don't expect a reply; apparently I'll be busy scrogging/felching my mother.
-- "When the world collectively arrives at the mindset that war is pointless, perhaps we'll finally earn our GED from this school of life and go about living it proper." MCJ 20050302
Of course they are. That's the whole point of PICs. They *ARE* simple.
No, "except if you recommend them".
Oh good grief. The difficulty in any new uC is learning the tools and building the first trivial program (why I like attaching blinkin' lights). Once the tools hurdle is crossed either of the above problem becomes trivial. I've never used a PIC, but wouldn't hesitate to jump in there if I ever had a need for a *simple* embedded processor.
The fact is that *you* think PICs are somehow difficult, which says a lot for your skills.
Women should be, so? They *are* the mothers of our children.
You are inferring a lot! ...again saying more about you than John.
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That's according to who? You? LOL, you can't even admit that a
solution you condemned when I offered it is precisely the same
solution you offered earlier _with code_ attached! Sound hypocritacal
to you? I does to me. Not too smart either.
You did not tell us who or what turns on the relay and turns it off. If controlled by a microcontroller, then it could easily be programmed to count down to zero. If it is the operator that performs this function then the timing would not be precise.
Having said that, you could use a timer circuit (555) that is started by the action of the relay switch and times out after 5 minutes. It will then drive the alarm if not reset by the action of the relay switch (Operator).
Hope that this helps.
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Well,
That $30,000 looks pretty much to me. But on the other hand, there certainly
*has* some work to be done. Customized solutions tend to be expensive.
Let's recapitulate. Somewhere some operator has to activaty some equipment and starts it. Some detector finds out and some clock starts to tick. After five minutes the clock raises some alarm while continuing ticking. Some operator deactivate the equipment. Some detector finds out and the clock start to tick in the reverse while signaling somehow that the equipment should have been to leave alone until the clock is back on its starting point. It should be nice to also raise the alarm when someone activates the equipment during that period.
Be aware that the principle is not very interesting from an engineering point of view. As we have lots of sheep electronics these days, an electronic solution seems the best. Half a century ago one would use some relays, switches and a small motor for instance.
But some tasks has to be done for every solution. You have to find out how to sense that the equipment is on. Decide what components you need, build the detector and find a way to install it. No need to say it has to be safe and reliable. Most of this part of the design depends on information you did not provide. So do the costs.
On the output side you need some alarm. Both audible and visual components are available in wide ranges and versions. You have to decide what satisfies your needs and how and where it has to be installed. The same counts for the signaling whether or not the equipment is ready for use.
Now you need some processing unit, the clock. Whatever you build, you will need some power supply, some chassis or PCB and an enclosure for it.
My choice would be to buy some of the shelf enclosure. As I need only one of a kind, I would use some prototyping PCB with a micro - an eight pins PIC or AVR will do - two signaling LEDs and a driver for the audible alarm. The latter can find a place in the enclosure as well along with some input jack to connect the on/off sensor. I can do so while I have the skills and equipment to program the micro. As for the power supply I would use an off the shelf 5V wall wart.
Note that allthough $30,000 is still pretty much, you will for sure need some thousends to get this all done by a professional.
I thought those were electric sheep? Anyhow, another thing to consider is that it might be necessary to have non-volatile storage of some of the information. Otherwise the operator could fool it by jogging the power on and off-- operators are typically programmed to find any possible weakness in your design and exploit it.
Best regards, Spehro Pefhany
--
"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward"
speff@interlog.com Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
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Even if you leave that out, the sneaky b*ggers have opposable thumbs and enough intelligence (or perhaps some kind of instinct) to operate the plug on the power cord.
Best regards, Spehro Pefhany
--
"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward"
speff@interlog.com Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
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Well, you're definitely right on this one... These crane operators are known to stick their hands into a 250 VDC panel from time to time. This magnet is on a bridging crane (one in which the operator goes for the ride). One time a maintenance employee looked up at the crane overhead and saw the operator in front of an open electrical panel. Soon later the maintenance dept. got a call that the crane was inoperable. Apparently the operator wanted to set himself up with a comfortable long break while the repair had to be done. Management put an end to this by requiring the operator to sit in his crane cab whether or not the crane was operable.
So, any design would have to consider attempts to defeat the system. If the operator could just reset the clock by turning on and off the power, that wouldn't be an acceptable design.
BTW, if anyone has a need for "vandal resistant screws" they are available through McMaster Carr. I've seen many instances in a factory where they are useful. Employees at the shop love to turn down the volume on the speakers for the public address system. Then they can't hear when they are called for a job. When the boss walks over to talk to the worker in person, he just says, "What? I couldn't hear you because the speaker is "not working". Vandal resistant screws would make it difficult for personel to open the local call-boxes and manually turn down the volume control.
I am amazed at how quickly people hurl insults at one-another on the internet. I've heard that when there is a conference of one type or another and these flamers actually see one-another face-to-face, they act very politely to one another. None of this "%&@#$ off you $@^*#(" LOL.
Here's my theory: People in real life are used to being treated in accordance with the position they have or haven't achieved. Thus, a superintendant in charge of a department is used to people listening to him when he speaks. A high-school dropout construction worker employed by an abusive Italian foreman is used to being cursed at on a daily basis. On the internet, everyone is apparently equal and so the high-school dropout is equally free to cuss out the department chief. So, let's just try to have fun here. :)
Wow man, thanks. I'm going to build this one just as a way of educating myself. However, the circuit for the actual application would have to have a clock readout. I looked a little bit into a RC charging circuit, but that is non-linear. Does anyone out there know of a simple linear ramp circuit? Let's say I needed 0 to 5 VDC and I needed it to take 300 seconds to get there. Is there a simple circuit out there which ramps up in a non-exponential, linear fashion? So far, the 4060 chip linked to the decade counter looks good and cheap. I could build a working device for low cost and present it to supervision. This would be the "Chevy" version of the circuit. Later on, after sufficiently educated in the ways of PIC microcontrollers I could probably make an attempt at the more sophisticated version with the serial output... The "Cadillac" of all electromagnet monitoring circuits!
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