Proposed ban on LCD and Plasma screens ?

Firstly, they're different lamp technologies, and secondly, incandescents have NOT been banned. Sure they've talked about it, but it was just that- talk.

I've read that lighting accounts for about 8% of our energy usage. (read about it on the Internet, so it must be true). Though that 8% makes up for everything, just account for worst case and see how insignificant the change to CFL would be.

I'm sure they have an exemption, and in fact, if they're huge energy users, they have their own plant. If that's the case, (since they technically don't draw from the grid) they would be independent of this. (not sure though, so feel free to dispute).

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"dmm"

** Care to actually read it ??

All 166 pages.

...... Phil

The proposal is so silly, John, that I hope it's "just talk" but the manager at my local lighting wholesaler did say there was word in the industry that you wouldn't be able to buy incandescent globes from next year, so for him it's real enough.

"Sleazy"

** Must be right off with the Pixies.

The phase out is set to begin in 2009 with no more on shelves by 2010.

Expect to see MASSIVE hoarding before then.

Of course, eBay sellers will have a field day, as will UK lamp suppliers.

...... Phil

users,

they

Do you in fact know of ANY that have built their own power station? Alcoa in Portland had a special transmission line installed for them, at taxpayer expense of course. And they get a special electricity rate far lower than domestic users pay.

MrT.

Just to note that our local Coles and Kmart stores are no longer selling incandescents, only CFLs. The Coles manager "informed" me that incandescents will be banned soon.

So it may be true or perhaps Coles like the bigger profit margins on the CFLs.

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Search or browse for that IC, capacitor, crystal or other component you need.

CSR (the sugar people) have a coal power generation plant in their refinery. At least the one in sydney we visited did (a gazillion years ago). I can't remember the power it was capable of generating, but it was relatively small. (Relative to power generation stations)

When your power bill is in the order of a bazillion dollars a year, they jump over hoops, and the GovCo gets into the act by saying "their" substidy is good because it creates many more jobs (and much more taxes). It gets paid for one way or another.

In Alcoa's case, they determined that power lines from the main grid (and along with other subsidies) was cheaper than doing it themselves.

At the end of the day, it always comes down to two things: Dollars and Cents.

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I think it's more of a pre-emptive strike than anything else.

Oh yeah. :-) That sounds MUCH more plausible than the "banning real soon now" lines.

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Sure, coal fired plant *can* be slower than gas plant, particularly gas turbines. But it isn't that slow. Even for chain grate combustion...hour or so at most. Fair bit quicker for pulverised fuel.

The main reason why domestic lighting changes will have minimal aggregate effect on GHG is simply that proportionally their contribution to total energy usage is close to zip, simple as that.

The Devil made me do it.

Typical! Yes, undoubtedly the big boys see a ramp they can fleece us with (nice mixed metaphor). Here Woolies still have plenty of stocks. Have not tried Coles.

For once I agree entirely with Phil, and I'm glad someone quoted him and thus defeated my killfile list on this occasion!

On Sat, 13 Oct 2007 13:52:08 GMT, "ian field" put finger to keyboard and composed:

I doubt it. I expect that lamps and/or inverters will need to be replaced within 5 years.

If they push this issue, then hopefully the consumer backlash will consign them to political oblivion where they belong.

- Franc Zabkar

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On Fri, 12 Oct 2007 07:13:53 -0700, kreed put finger to keyboard and composed:

I can't imagine ever reverting to a CRT display for my PC, if only for ergonomic reasons. An LCD monitor places *much* less strain on my eyes than any CRT ever did.

Instead I'd like to see the public service lead by example and switch to less power hungry CPUs, eg VIA C3 CPU (20 watts max at 1.4GHz) instead of AMD64 or Intel Core 2 Duo. I suspect that an energy audit of our various government bodies would reveal enough energy savings to decommision an entire power plant.

- Franc Zabkar

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Coal feeders in power stations use variable speed drives and can (and do) change load in seconds. Getting a boiler to raise steam temperature may take a few minutes, but the load change on a grid system is very gradual unless a generator drops off the system due to a fault. See if you can get hold of a load graph. The bigger the grid the more stable it is. I think nearly all coal fired power stations in Australia would use pulverized coal. I doubt any would use moving grates.

Peak loads caused by reverse cycle air conditioners are the main problem on a grid. That's when you'd run a peaking plant such as gas or oil. Oil is very expensive. Most grids get around this now by getting industry to shut down non-essential plant, this is done by the grid controller using an automated control system.

Dorfus

This is taken directly from the Greenhouse Office website in their FAQ section re Halogens.

• Good quality halogen lights will continue to be available, but halogen lights that use too much energy will be phased out.

And thats the only referance I can find re halogen lights and any ban.

Given that there is no definition of what constitutes a halogen light that uses too much energy its hard to know what they are talking about,re whats going to be phased out.

"Mauried"

** Yep - and it basically says that halogens are to be banned. ** The efficiency of small halogen bulbs ( ie dichroic downlights) is hardy any better than that of standard incandescent bulbs.

The only " halogens" you can expect to escape the ban are large wattage types ( ie PAR lamps etc ) used mainly for outdoor lighting & entertainment purposes.

....... Phil

substidy is

As long as you ignore how much the taxpayer is subsidising some jobs, whilst saying too bad to thousands of others! What makes an Alcoa job more important than a Telstra one for example?

(and

Of course it is, when you are being subsidised by other users and taxpayers!

Cents.

No, greed and corruption!

MrT.

It makes more money for govco. And they're the only ones who count.

But, after some time, they're going to make that money back via pay tax on the people who work there. (where they wouldn't if alcoa wasn't there). Not only that, they're going to keep making money once it's paid off.

Only cost is in the meantime (short term), they're down n Gazillion dollars. That's of no consequence, because they can make up the shortfall with little money spinners like another fuel levy, or more speed cameras or something equally as benign to society.

And the difference is??

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