how much standby power do ALL your appliances use? - Page 4

How difficult would it be to assemble something like this?

+--------+   2-conductor cord   +--------+   power cord
| switch +----------------------+ outlet +----------------<E mains plug
+--------+                      +--------+

Plug into the wall outlet, plug the TV into the cord's outlet, put the
switch in a convenient place and use it to control TV power. You could
even make the cord between the switch and the outlet long enough to put
the switch next to where you sit to watch TV.

I don't think he really wants a solution to the problem. If he did, he would
have solved it ages ago. He just wants to bitch about a perceived "wrong", and
then swear at people that don't immediately agree with his opinion exactly.

Whereas you think bad product design is the consumer's fault apparently.


Graham

Guess again.

Well, the 'switched' wall outlet is inconveniently located (consider it
inaccessible), so everything is run from multi-outlet extension leads (none of
which are switched and I don't ever recall seing a switched one in a UK store).

Secondly, if you physically remove power from the STB, you then have to wait
around 3 mins while it 'self-tests' etc during which time you get no TV picture
or sound. Following this it takes up to 10 minures more for the programme guide
to 'catch up' too (althought that alone is of less bother to me).

The fact is that Samsung need their backsides kicking for making such a sloppy
piece of kit.

Graham

Understood. That's why I suggested what I did (wondering as I did so why
I'd never seen what I was drawing in a store).



I agree that this seems like a consumer unfriendly design. Seems like
you should be able to manually select a channel and watch it while the
box does its internal housekeeping.



Well, I'm not going to kick their butt for you - but you can tell 'em I
said I wouldn't have such an unfriendly POS in /my/ house. :-)

of

store).


However you know those 'torpedo switch' type things that were once popular for
table
lamps etc which is what I imagined you might have in mind for a switch ? Those
are
now strictly verboten (and unavailable) on safety grounds. Too many cases of
electrocution.



picture

guide


That would be a big improvement.



sloppy


I certainly will.

Graham

It HAS a remote control that puts it into the same non-power-saving standy mode
as the button on the front.

Graham

the

expert

consumer who




4 WHY DON'T YOU-YES BUT
Thesis. "Why Don't You—Yes But" occupies a special place in game
analysis, because it was the original stimulus for the concept of games.

It was the first game to be dissected out of its social context, and
since it is the oldest subject of game analysis, it is one of the best
understood.

It is also the game most commonly played at parties and groups of all
kinds, including psychotherapy groups.

The following example will serve to illustrate its main characteristics:

White: "My husband always insists on doing our own repairs, and he never
builds anything right."

Black: "Why doesn't he take a course in carpentry?"

White: "Yes, but he doesn't have time."

Blue: "Why don't you buy him some good tools'?"

White: "Yes, but he doesn't know how to use them."

Red: "Why don't you have your building done by a carpenter?"

White: "Yes, but that would cost too much."

Brown: "Why don't you just accept what he does the way he does it}"

White: "Yes, but the whole thing might fall down."

Such an exchange is typically followed by a silence. It is eventually
broken by Green, who may say something like, "That's men for you, always
trying to show how efficient they are."

YDYB can be played by any number.

The agent presents a problem. The others start to present solutions,
each beginning with "Why don't you . . . ?" To each of these White
objects with a "Yes, but. ..."

A good player can stand off the others indefinitely until they all give
up, whereupon White wins.

In many situations she might have to handle a dozen or more solutions to
engineer the crestfallen silence which signifies her victory, and which
leaves the field open for the next game in the above paradigm, Green
switching into "PI A," Delinquent Husband Type.

Since the solutions are, with rare exceptions, rejected, it is apparent
that this game must serve some ulterior purpose.

YDYB is not played for its ostensible purpose (an Adult quest for
information or solutions), but to reassure and gratify the Child.

Starts at page 49:
http://www.geocities.com/ripxburn/ericberne-gamespeopleplay.pdf
591 kb.

I didn't choose it. There is no choice. It's what the catv people supply. I said
that at the very beginning.

Graham

And you chose to use it. Nobody made you. Just cancel the service and you will
have your life back.

I want the SERVICE thanks. Just not the £15 electricity bill.

It's just occurred to me that Australians must be a bit like Americans in their
attitude to energy wastefulness.

Graham

What is wrong with the remote control or auto power switch idea? One or both
products are designed to solve problems exactly like that.

Turn your TV off, the STB switches off. Turn your TV on, STB switches on -
easy.
Or do it from your armchair with a remote control.

Dave.

Just how many MORE remote controls do you suggest I need ? The one that comes
with it puts it into the same non-power-saving mode that the button on the front
does.




And then you get the 3 minute 'power-on self-test' sequence. Thanks a bundle for
that idiotic idea.

Technology is meant to solve problems not CREATE them.

Graham

*yawn*



You're most welcome.

So lets see now, there are two thing that piss you off with this product in
your situation (apart from the design aspect no one has ever argued):
1) It's inconvenient to switch on and off
2) It takes 3 minutes to "boot up"

Yet you'd presumably like to lower the power consumption when not being
used.
Hmm, nows lets think real hard about this for about one second...
Oh, I know, there is this amazing product called a mains timer, you can get
them for a few bucks from your hardware or grocery store. What it does it
really amazing, it allows you to switch off appliances based on your usage
habits, you just program the on-off times. Have it come on before you will
need it, and bingo, no power-on problem. Amazing.

You sleep at reasonably predictable times like most people I'm assuming?
Have it switch off while you are sleeping for starters. That might be a
third of a day off, not a bad saving, timer would probably pay for itself in
a year.

Dave.

Absolutely not.



You know, I'd thought of that but I don't work fixed hours and my
waking/sleeping patterns are quite unusual.

Neat idea but not practical here.

Graham

unplugging
board
things

And the power board HAS to be placed "on the floor underneat things", WHY
exactly?
(mine isn't)



Because YOU can't?

MrT.

You want people tripping over it and injuring themselves ?

I'm having GREAT trouble how you think all of this excuses inherently
incompetent product design by Samsung.

When the power switch says 'standby' it BLOODY WELL ought to use LESS power,
not just change the colour of the effing LED !

Jesus, many companies could manage this simple task at least TWENTY years
ago.

Graham

Oh FFS, what kind of EXCUSE is that for fundamental POOR DESIGN ?

I'm an electronics designer of some repute. I would be mortified to design a
device that saved NO energy in 'standby' mode.

Graham

Settle down.
I was not implying in any way that it's an excuse for poor design, I don't
know how you got that impression. I was merely pointing out options on how
to fix the power consumption if you are forced to use a POS like this.
Better than flapping your arms around and saying how crap it is.



So would I.

Dave.