Department store self-checkouts run on XP (and they crash)

Here's yet another example of a very poor embedded design that somehow made it out the door.

For those of you who haven't seen self-checkouts yet, they're basically a way to replace cashiers by getting the cutomers to scan and bag their own items. You put your item infront of the barcode scanner and then you put it in a bag that sits on a scale. The checkout weighs each item to make sure you're not bagging anything that you haven't paid for. This all sounds like a good idea in theory.

So I was at the local department store a few days ago and while using the self-checkout, the application completely quit and I was left staring at a standard Windows XP desktop with the green hills in the background. There were three items left in the taskbar: PipeServer, Switch Checker (with its default blue MFC icon) , and a console app called POS (how appropriate). At first I got a really good laugh out of how poorly written this thing was and how it just crashed for no reason. Next I noticed that the touchscreen remained fully functional I could move the mouse pointer! Now I became genuinely worried about how serious of a security hole this was. I was almost tempted to start poking around to see if I could find the self-test program for the change dispenser in the start menu, or to see what other PCs I could find on the network. But curiosity didn't get the better of me this time and I just left the thing alone.

Next I became somewhat annoyed that I now had to push the big red "I'm an idiot" button to call a real cashier for help. Eventually the guy started walking towards me with that standard obligatory fake smile. As soon as he saw the screen, the smile vanished and his expression quickly changed to that of a deer caught in the headlights. He told me that he'd have to call the manager. After about twenty minutes of runaround from cashiers, head cashiers, managers, assistant managers, and leprechauns who have no clue what they're doing I was finally able to pay for my purchases. I'm never using the self-checkout ever again.

Now what I want to know is what kind of company could let a product like this out the door. I'm not too concerned about the crashing as much as I am about the fact that ANYONE off the street can potentially gain access to the insides of a machine that handles inventory, cash, and credit cards. Something like this would have been completely unacceptable at pretty much every company that I've ever worked at. If I was in change of QA at this particular company I would order an immediate shutdown of all units in the field until the gaping security hole is fixed. How this kind of implementation could have ever gotten past a design review is beyond me.

As I was leaving the store, I noticed one of the assistant managers making a big handwritten "out of order" sign which he would put on the checkout. I guess nobody knows how to reboot it. Meanwhile another one of them opened the little door underneath the checkout (which is not locked) to reveal a power bar, a PC, and A KEYBOARD! Best. Security. Ever.

--Tom.

Reply to
Tom
Loading thread data ...

I suggest you repost this to comp.risks. Also identify the grocery. I NEVER use those things on various principles, including preserving jobs.

--
Chuck F (cbfalconer at maineline dot net)
   Available for consulting/temporary embedded and systems.
Reply to
CBFalconer

Well, that's where you went wrong IMHO. I'd have demanded *immediate* service from an actual cashier - no waiting for the thing to be fixed - and if that wasn't forthcoming, walked straight out the front door!

You'd be making a much stronger point that this won't be tolerated, and perhaps they'd seriously consider sending the things back!

Regards,

--
Mark McDougall, Engineer
Virtual Logic Pty Ltd, 
21-25 King St, Rockdale, 2216
Ph: +612-9599-3255 Fax: +612-9599-3266
Reply to
Mark McDougall

Hi Chuck,

Have you thought about dumping your computers and hiring a bunch of scribes - that would make jobs.

More seriously - the system Tom describes is obviously far from perfect but his best bet is to moan to the store. I do a lot of work designing embedded bits and pieces that go into retail POS systems (nothing Windows based I promise) and in my experience the store will apply enormous pressure to the supplier of the system to fix the bugs. The MD of at least one major UK chain gets a daily report of all the non functional lanes in their stores - things get fixed or dumped pretty fast.

Michael Kellett

formatting link

Reply to
MK

... snip ...

I am not thinking of protecting the store, but of protecting the public.

--
Chuck F (cbfalconer at maineline dot net)
   Available for consulting/temporary embedded and systems.
Reply to
CBFalconer

And they are much slower than an average clerk

Reply to
Marco

But remember that fully HALF of clerks are slower than average ;-)

Reply to
Tom Lucas

As long as they are windows based, the public will not need this kind of protection, I cannot see the day when they will be able to work unattended :-). Even if they do, they will always be slower than a human because of the "out for lunch with the HDD" habit windows has. Commercially, they have no chance. Being imposed from above (by Big Brother or whoever) may of course be the future, but then our boykott won't matter anyway.. :-) :-)

Dimiter

------------------------------------------------------ Dimiter Popoff Transgalactic Instruments

formatting link

------------------------------------------------------

CBFalc> >

it

I

saw

a

insides

that

gotten

Reply to
Didi

I remember a recent furore here, when a School Principal commented that half the teachers were below average. He had to rephrase it, to something less correct, but more PC!!!!

-jg

Reply to
Jim Granville

You guys need to get out the statistics books. Half of the 'whatevers' are below the median, not necessarily below the average (mean).

Dave Rooney

Reply to
Dave Rooney

Be warned, though, that some teachers hate it when you correct them. Especially when you're right. And especially the half below the median ;-)

Reply to
DJ Delorie

Yes, and those ones above the median, would likely point out that any number could be equal to the median, and thus "up to half, are below the median", would be more correct. ;)

-jg

Reply to
Jim Granville

Dave Rooney a écrit :

Who am I, as a non native speaker to say this, but aren't both mean and median a kind of average?

"average: It is better to avoid this sometimes vague term. It usually refers to the (arithmetic) mean, but it can also signify the median, the mode, the geometric mean, and weighted means, among other things"

formatting link

Reply to
Lanarcam

The median is the value at which the population above it equals the population below it.

The average is the sum of the values, divided by the number of values.

Consider these values: 1, 2, 3, 4, 90.

The median is 3 - the middle number in the above (sorted) list.

The average is 20 - (1+2+3+4+90)/5.

Reply to
DJ Delorie

Which is why median income is a better measure of a the affluence of a country than average per-capita income.

Best regards, Spehro Pefhany

--
"it's the network..."                          "The Journey is the reward"
speff@interlog.com             Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog  Info for designers:  http://www.speff.com
Reply to
Spehro Pefhany

And why the given example is more representative of the US under a Republican administrations tax cuts for the rich. Cut all assistance to the poor or sick. Ignore global warming. Drill for oil everywhere. Ignore Kyoto.

--
Chuck F (cbfalconer at maineline dot net)
   Available for consulting/temporary embedded and systems.
Reply to
CBFalconer

This might have been an option, but I had already swiped my credit card before it crashed so I had no way of knowing if the thing had already processed the payment. For all I knew the damn thing could have charged me $999999 right when it decided to crap out! So in this case walking out of the store wouldn't have been a good idea. As it turned out, the thing had already processed the proper payment amount before it crashed, but there was no way for me to get a receipt. So not only is the thing seriously lacking fault tolerance, it also has absolutely no fault recovery whatsoever.

Please tell me that the company that makes these things will NEVER be designing traffic light controllers or aircraft computers.

--Tom.

Reply to
Tom

Technically, Lanarcam is correct - both mean (20 in this case) and median are different types of "average". However, in popular use, "average" almost always means "arithmetic mean".

In many cases, "mean" and "median" will give roughly the same value - it depends on the skew of the distribution. Gaussian distributions (balanced bell-shaped curves) have the same mean and median, so for anything involving a large number of independent variables (such as the rolls of many dice, and many types of noise), they are the same. For highly skewed data, such as incomes, they are very different, so talking about "average" is non-sensical.

Reply to
David Brown

ElectronDepot website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.