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Re: Why does the Raspberry Pi exist?
Bob Martin wrote:
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If school children are going to learn to do those sorts of things, then  
three cheers for the Raspberry Pi.  It's a big if though.

--  
I think I am an Elephant,
Behind another Elephant
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Re: Why does the Raspberry Pi exist?
On 20/06/13 09:32, Bob Martin wrote:
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As I said 'a component, not a PC..'

--  
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc?-ra-cy) ? a system of government where the least capable to lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a diminishing number of producers.


Re: Why does the Raspberry Pi exist?
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I am designing a real-time monitoring platform for a hosting centre. I plan  
on using rpis to drive _all_ the monitors, around 12 in total; and use
phidgets (again, around 12) to sample environmentals, and have trimslices
as hubs; 4. All powered by a dual marine power supply at 12V backed by
enough battery to last 48 hours, including switches and some emergency
internet back door.

Actually, the screens themselves take around 70% of the power budget. We
may dispense with 2/3rds of them if the power cut takes more than 4-5
hours.

-- mrr

Re: Why does the Raspberry Pi exist?
declaimed the following:

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    And even that may fade if one considers:
http://www.velleman.eu/products/view/?id40%4998
or the kit version
http://www.velleman.eu/products/view/?country=be&lang=en&id35%1346
--  
    Wulfraed                 Dennis Lee Bieber         AF6VN
     snipped-for-privacy@ix.netcom.com    HTTP://wlfraed.home.netcom.com/

Re: Why does the Raspberry Pi exist?
Bill doors email me, Nicki agrees catharsis is good...  

Re: Why does the Raspberry Pi exist?

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But that's just what happens: I d'lded Raspi, and (from a blog) I was  
recommended to run "aptitude update" - it filled my SD card, and messed it  
up to non-boot (no room for tmp?).

--  
It's a money /life balance.

Re: Why does the Raspberry Pi exist?
On 19/06/13 18:48, Stanley Daniel de Liver wrote:
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The minimum card size is 2GB, which will fill up very soon if you are  
not careful. The recommended card size is 4GB or more and you need to  
use the "expand file system" option on the initial config screen to use  
it (there are other ways, but that is easiest).

aptitude update is very unlikely to fill up anything as it just  
downloads the latest software index files. aptitude upgrade will use up  
space (in /var/cache/apt/archives/, not /tmp).

None of this has anything to do with the CPU speed, or amount of RAM on  
the system.

Re: Why does the Raspberry Pi exist?
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That's the issue - it's actually very hard to get software that's not
designed to run on a modern PC - modern software has kept pace with modern
hardware, so the "office" application is rather large - as is the email
client and so on. Trying to get that software we used to use on those old,
slow PCs (and my first Linux box was a DX4/66) is almost impossible.

But with care, it's very usable if you select the right software. e.g. I'm
finding that xfce4 is better than lxde for a GUI environment. The Chromium
browser is usable, but you must remember to not open many tabs, etc.

I've not tried libreoffice, but others have - I use LaTeX and it works
better than it did when I first used it on a Sun3 with 4MB of RAM well
over 20 years ago...

But if you want to run alpine for email, (which I still do), trn for
usenet, vi/nano/emacs to edit and use gcc for development then it's  
a nice little platform.... Although I find the latency to the SD card
to be higher than those old PCs - I suspect the Pi's SD card IO driver
and SD card operations themselves have a higher "startup" time cost
and hence latency.

Gordon

Re: Why does the Raspberry Pi exist?
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It depends /a lot/ on your SD card.  Some (apparently all Class 10 cards)
are utterly terrible at 4KB random writes (10KB/s) while others are much
much better (MB/s).  Try and find an SD with as many IOPS as possible -
often this information is difficult to find.  500+ 4KB random write IOPS is
good, some class 10 cards can have something in single figures.

Theo

Re: Why does the Raspberry Pi exist?
On 20 Jun 2013 00:45:34 +0100 (BST), Theo Markettos

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    Class 10 cards are rated for streaming video; ie, single file I/O on a
freshly formatted card.

    Classes 2/4/6 are rated on fragmented cards.

    While I'm surprised that a Class 10 could be /that/ bad when it
encounters fragmentation and multiple file requests... I have no experience
(my video cameras still use miniDV TAPE)
--  
    Wulfraed                 Dennis Lee Bieber         AF6VN
     snipped-for-privacy@ix.netcom.com    HTTP://wlfraed.home.netcom.com/

Re: Why does the Raspberry Pi exist?

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You could argue that the Rpi might tend at least to make people more
aware of the bloat which has afflicted standard PCs so that they would
try a little harder to avoid it.

Especially now that silicon has run out of steam, speed-wise, while
GaAs no longer seems to be a possible replacement.

Of course some govt. agency might have very quietly taken up where Cray
left off; I'm not certain if such an event would become common
knowledge.


--  
Windmill, snipped-for-privacy@Nonetel.com               Use  t m i l l
J.R.R. Tolkien:-                                   @ O n e t e l . c o m
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Re: Why does the Raspberry Pi exist?
On Wed, 19 Jun 2013 23:58:53 GMT
snipped-for-privacy@Onetel.net.uk.invalid (Windmill) wrote:

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Back to the good old days of optimising every cycle and byte.  :-)   I
do think the RPi is giving people pause for thought, when they realise
how much of "normal PC" work can be done with a Pi.  I've occasionally
played with Via ITX boards, which are quite similar spec (but x86, with
all the usual PC interfaces) commonly used as thin clients.
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Today's silicon is generally more than fast enough for most applications
anyway, the new-Windows, new-PC upgrade cycle of the past couple of
decades has pretty much broken down as people are finding they can do a
lot of their usual stuff with low power mobile kit, consoles and STBs,
and the PC they bought 5 years ago still does what they want.  Modern
servers are looking more like mini supercomputers, with masses of low
power units racked (and in some cases clustered) together rather than a
few high power CPUs.


Re: Why does the Raspberry Pi exist?

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But not every bit, which was the norm when memory was expensive.

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It certainly does what I want. Some have said it's too slow for
browsing, and that may be correct from where they stand. But with
servers usually overloaded, an ftp transfer getting only 0.2 MB/s over
a supposed 2 MB/s link, and a brain which is becoming hard-of-thinking
(especially in the afternoons, unless I skip lunch), it's fine for me.

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I have one such, bought as a lower power unit which could be left
always on, but then there was the FitPC, and now the Pi which truly can
be left on at little cost even when they raise energy prices.

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--  
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J.R.R. Tolkien:-                                   @ O n e t e l . c o m
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Re: Why does the Raspberry Pi exist?
On 21/06/13 10:51, Windmill wrote:
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I've got a 24x7 Atom server.  Is there any way to hook a PI up to SATA  
drives?



--  
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc?-ra-cy) ? a system of government where the least capable to lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a diminishing number of producers.


Re: Why does the Raspberry Pi exist?
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USB->SATA adaptor.

Theo

Re: Why does the Raspberry Pi exist?

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run via a powered hub, because the pi definitely won't supply enough  
power over USB to run a hard drive.

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Re: Why does the Raspberry Pi exist?


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The USB<->PATA adaptor I have runs from an unpowered hub because it has
its own power supply. USB<->SATA might well be the same.

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J.R.R. Tolkien:-                                   @ O n e t e l . c o m
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Re: Why does the Raspberry Pi exist?
On 21/06/13 12:29, Theo Markettos wrote:
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MM. looking ta the overall cost and casing requirements, it seems not  
worth the trouble and expense.

i.e if you want linux with big storage, stay with the Atom.

--  
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc?-ra-cy) ? a system of government where the least capable to lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a diminishing number of producers.


Re: Why does the Raspberry Pi exist?
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And much as I like the Pi, I'm sticking with my Atom servers too -
the main issue in that department is the single USB interface - off
which hangs the Ethernet interface and a USB hub - to serve the external
peripherals - like disks, etc. Anything taking data from USB storage to
Ethernet and vice versa isn't going to experience the performance you
might like...

The Pi is a great little £25 personal computer - with limits.

Gordon

Re: Why does the Raspberry Pi exist?
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Come on, the rPi is about half a cray-2 in scalar performance, and
about half a cray-1 in vector performance. Not what I would call
"slow" by my standards.

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USB to SATA enclosure?

-- mrr

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