Any progress on accelerated GL?

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Some time ago an accelerated version of OpenGL was introduced as an
experimental feature on Jessie for the RPI. Far as I can tell there
haven't been any changes/upgrades to it since the original demo release,
despite regular exercises of apt-get update/upgrade/dist-upgrade.

Am I missing something?  

Thanks for reading,

bob prohaska


Re: Any progress on accelerated GL?
On 04/02/2017 02:27, bob prohaska wrote:
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Put on ice. Software management isn't a strong point of the Foundation.


Re: Any progress on accelerated GL?
On Sat, 4 Feb 2017 17:21:19 +0100

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I thought it was because it's based on proprietary design information,
so the specification couldn't be released for anyone outside Broadcom to
work on it.


Re: Any progress on accelerated GL?
On 04/02/2017 18:24, Rob Morley wrote:
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That's the open source video driver. I think OP asked about Wayland.


Re: Any progress on accelerated GL?
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Truth be told I'm not entirely sure what I was asking about. Only that
the "experimental GL driver" seemed to speed up the Neverball demo in
fairly impressive fashion and that nothing further seemed to be happening.

There was some publicity about Broadcom releasing the the VC4 manual  
as an aid to developing a GPU-based video driver, which I _thought_
was the accelerated GL driver. The link is here:
https://docs.broadcom.com/docs-and-downloads/docs/support/videocore/VideoCoreIV-AG100-R.pdf

It's quite unclear to me just how much help such a document might be:  
Likely not much to a device driver writer, but maybe necessary to someone
writing a code generator for a compiler.

The role of Wayland in the enterprise is rather unclear.  

Thanks for reading, and any insights!

bob prohaska


Re: Any progress on accelerated GL?
On Sun, 05 Feb 2017 05:34:39 +0000, bob prohaska wrote:

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VideoCoreIV-AG100-R.pdf
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IIRC Wayland is a new X-server implementation that replaces the older X11  
Xserver. Xservers can appear to be back to front at first glance. They  
own screen, mouse and keyboard and provide access to them as services to  
their client programs.
  

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martin@   | Martin Gregorie
gregorie. | Essex, UK
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Re: Any progress on accelerated GL?
On Sun, 5 Feb 2017 12:38:18 -0000 (UTC),

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Yes.

https://wayland.freedesktop.org/

    Wayland is intended as a simpler replacement for X, easier to
    develop and maintain. GNOME and KDE are expected to be ported
    to it.

    Wayland is a protocol for a compositor to talk to its clients
    as well as a C library implementation of that protocol. The
    compositor can be a standalone display server running on Linux
    kernel modesetting and evdev input devices, an X application,
    or a wayland client itself. The clients can be traditional
    applications, X servers (rootless or fullscreen) or other
    display servers.

I haven't tried wayland recently, so I can't comment on its current
robustness or suitability for anything other than a test bed.  There's
something to be said for a simpler implementation of X.

--  
Consulting Minister for Consultants, DNRC
I can please only one person per day. Today is not your day. Tomorrow
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Re: Any progress on accelerated GL?

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It is not an implementation of X at all.  See:
  https://wayland.freedesktop.org/faq.html

--  
http://www.greenend.org.uk/rjk/

Re: Any progress on accelerated GL?
On 07/02/17 23:07, Richard Kettlewell wrote:
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Simplified to the point of unrecognisability?

I have to say that X windows was, at its inception (rather like  
postcript) the implementation that could in theory do everything.

When all that was needed was the ability to do one thing supremely well.  
Completely Define the pixels on a page or a screen.



--  
"When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign,  
that the dunces are all in confederacy against him."

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Re: Any progress on accelerated GL?
On Wed, 8 Feb 2017 10:25:50 +0000

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    Not even close to X.

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    No not really, what X windows was at its inception was a hardware
independent and network transparent graphics protocol. Both of these
features were new and *very* useful and they are still very useful.

    Wayland retains the hardware independence but throws away the
network transparency, which almost certainly makes for a local display that
performs better than X can.

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    That's partly true if you're dealing with a self contained computer,
but that's not the world X was designed in.

--  
Steve O'Hara-Smith                          |   Directable Mirror Arrays
C:>WIN                                      | A better way to focus the sun
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Re: Any progress on accelerated GL?
On 02/11/17 06:32, Ahem A Rivet's Shot so wittily quipped:
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and Wayland removes the ability to run a GUI application on the RPi
while displaying it on another computer that's connected via a network
cable, something that _I_ do a _LOT_ on headless systems.  I want to be
able to connect my RPi via ethernet ONLY, no keyboard, no mouse, no
video.  Just the ethernet.  And from here, I can program it to do
_anything_.  And being able to run 'pluma' to edit system files, shell
scripts, python code, and so on *LOCALLY* on the RPi is a *HUGE*
benefit.  Wayland takes ALL of that AWAY.

some of the BEST feature of the RPi surface when you run it as a
HEADLESS system, and for that, running GUI applications over the
ethernet is a HUGE benefit.

FYI - if you haven't tried it, here's how it works:

let's say your desktop computer is 192.168.1.50, and the RPi is
192.168.1.51 .

(on the RPI from a secure shell)
export DISPLAY19%2.168.1.50:0.0

(on 'your desktop computer' running the X11 server)
xhost +192.168.1.51

(you may need to alter the X11 config a bit to make sure you can access
X11 on the network; check for port 6001 listening on your desktop
machine, and don't expose it to the outside world, i.e. block it at the
firewall)


then run an application like 'pluma' or even a web client like 'midori'.
 It will display on the desktop computer, and interact with the
keyboard/mouse there.  Enjoy!



Re: Any progress on accelerated GL?
On Mon, 20 Feb 2017 09:45:59 -0800

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    That is what I mean by network transparency, it was one of the more
important design features of X.

--  
Steve O'Hara-Smith                          |   Directable Mirror Arrays
C:>WIN                                      | A better way to focus the sun
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Re: Any progress on accelerated GL?
On 20/02/17 18:07, Ahem A Rivet's Shot wrote:
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One of the most useless features, except if for some reason you actually  
needed it.


--  
Gun Control: The law that ensures that only criminals have guns.

Re: Any progress on accelerated GL?
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You could apply that comment to any feature on anything! :-)

All features are useless unless you need them.

--  
Chris Green


Re: Any progress on accelerated GL?
On Mon, 20 Feb 2017 18:31:59 +0000

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    Such as running GUI applications from headless servers, which I have
done many many times over the last quarter century or so. In my current
setup I have calibre installed in a FreeBSD jail on a headless server,
when I want to run the calibre GUI I just ssh into the calibre account on
the jail and the GUI pops up on my workstation, or if I feel so inclined on
my laptop even when I'm in a different continent using my VPN (yes I have
had cause to do this).

    Useless ? No! Powerful.

--  
Steve O'Hara-Smith                          |   Directable Mirror Arrays
C:>WIN                                      | A better way to focus the sun
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Re: Any progress on accelerated GL?
On 20/02/17 21:35, Ahem A Rivet's Shot wrote:
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#
yes, useless, because I also have calibre 'running on a headless  
server', I mount the file system and run caliber on a desktop.

100% of all I need to do is dome with a combination of exported file  
systems and a terminal.

I looked at running exported X, but it wasn't nearly as slick as e.g.  
webmin or phpadmin and friends

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all government is basically a self-legalising protection racket, is  
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Re: Any progress on accelerated GL?
On Mon, 20 Feb 2017 22:48:54 +0000

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    Hmm so trains are useless because some people drive cars to get
from a to b ?

    Here is a *very* simple point for you - in order to export a
filesystem you need root access to the machine holding that filesystem, in
order to run an X application on a remote machine displaying on a local
machine all you need is a login on both. I could just as easily run calibre
for a thousand users my way and none of them would even be able to see
anything but their own collection. Your way would require a thousand
exports and anyone would be able to mount any export unless you restricted
the exports to specific clients.

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    So *you* do not use it means that it is useless no matter how many
other people find it useful ?

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Steve O'Hara-Smith                          |   Directable Mirror Arrays
C:>WIN                                      | A better way to focus the sun
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Re: Any progress on accelerated GL?
On 21/02/17 07:55, Ahem A Rivet's Shot wrote:
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That is apart from the 'need for root to set it up' such ignorant tosh  
that its not worth responding to.

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Lost of people use i-phones as a replacement for a ballpoint and a  
notepad too.

NO sysadmin worth his salt uses X to export sessions off a server.

99.9% of Xsessions are between a client and server on the same machine.

Waypoint acknowledges that and aims to remove a minority interest that  
leads to massive complexity, with something simpler faster and less  
resource hungry.

I dont know if it will succeed, but that is the rationale.

--  
"I guess a rattlesnake ain't risponsible fer bein' a rattlesnake, but ah  
puts mah heel on um jess the same if'n I catches him around mah chillun".


Re: Any progress on accelerated GL?
On Tue, 21 Feb 2017 10:14:47 +0000

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    Translation every word of it is correct and you won't admit it. You
are hereby exposed as a trolling idiot.

--  
Steve O'Hara-Smith                          |   Directable Mirror Arrays
C:>WIN                                      | A better way to focus the sun
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Re: Any progress on accelerated GL?
On 21/02/17 10:39, Ahem A Rivet's Shot wrote:
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sigh. How do you set up user accounts on your machine - the thousand  
user accounts you need to have a 'private caliber' for each one. Using  
root privileges.

If you e.g. exported /home as an NFS export, that is the only export you  
need.  course your adduser script could be simply modified to add a  
discretely exported home dir as well, if you really wanted to do that

Bearing in mind that all users would have userids that would prevent  
than from farting round in other peoples home directories.

I supect you are from a MS windows background, and NFS, unix permissions  
and unix sysadmin principles are foreign to you  and you feel you need a  
GUI for everything.


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the right place whilst your head is in the clouds and your hand is in  
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