Verizon Telephone Ringer ISSUE (land line)

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Hi,

      I have an intermittent problem with telephone(s) NOT RINGING when
someone tries to call.   Most of the time, the telephone will ring.  Therefore
removing all devices from telephone line, then connect one device at a time
to find "culprit",  is not practical.  Note: I removed 3 devices I seldom use
from phone line.  Ringing voltage increased to 81.VAC (3 devices removed) due
other devices loading.

      At main input jack, everything disconnected (no loads), ringing voltage
was 93 VAC.

      I am retired electronic technician.  I used my Fluke DMM with "Max/Min"
capture feature to log the ringing voltages.  Twice, I was able to "capture"
the NO RINGING voltages, 34.4VAC and 38VAC.

      TEMP SOLUTION:

      Since my answer machine is on all the time, and answers on the
4th ring,  I told my relatives & friends to hang up if phone rings 5 or more
times. Then call again.  The odd thing (good thing), when they call back,
the phone(s) ring!!   So far, every time.

       Did anyone else have this issue?

          Thank You in advance,  John
  

Re: Verizon Telephone Ringer ISSUE (land line)
On Fri, 10 Jan 2020 13:06:14 -0500, snipped-for-privacy@verizon.net wrote:

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Been retired after 47 years in the business, but the ring voltage
sounds borderline since the max is 105 v. However with the "tweaty
birds" in use today don't require anything near that high. There is
another number that is very important. The Ringer Equivalence Number
must not ex ceded. The REN is usually printed on the unit providing
the ring voltage. Finding it on the ringer is a different thing all
together. One thing you never want to do is have an oldfashon
mechanical ringer these days.

 Of course the unit putting out the ring voltage could be a problem
under load.

I would look at the ringer in each phone to see what it is and maybe
the REN is printed somewhere.

When I started ring voltage came from the central office for any
switchboards (Cord) that may be in the building. It was really "HOT"
found out by standing on damp soil !!

Good luck, I always hated "stupid" problems.


KenW

Re: Verizon Telephone Ringer ISSUE (land line)
On Friday, January 10, 2020 at 1:06:20 PM UTC-5, snipped-for-privacy@verizon.net wrote:

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Had the same issue - poor connections in the Telco Demark. The 'first' attempt apparently helped the connections such that it rang through if the call-back was relatively immediate.  

Peter Wieck
Melrose Park, PA  


Re: Verizon Telephone Ringer ISSUE (land line)

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Hi,   Here is more information (I use my Tracphone to call my landline
number):

   I scoped the phone line.  When there was no problem (phone rings), I saw a
nice 20 hz sign wave on the display.

   When the phone did NOT ring, I saw what looks like a rounded sawtooth.
One sawtooth for each ring period!!  The amplitude of the "sawtooth" was
much lower than the normal ring signal.

   Since I have DSL for internet, is it possible one of the DSL filters might
cause this problem?

   I am going to disconnect everything in the house at main phone jack,
plug in a single spare telephone.  If that doesn't ring, then I will contact
Verizon.   I will post an update later.

                  Thank You in advance,  John



Re: Verizon Telephone Ringer ISSUE (land line)
I would not be surprised to find out that the problem is external to the ho
use.  The copper line system is aging and receives minimal maintenance thes
e days.  I too had intermittent issues with my landline prior to getting FI
OS.  While not as regular as you, the problem ended up being a connection o
n the street a few blocks away.  Similar problems prior were traced to the  
local "switching" station a few towns over.

Dan

Re: Verizon Telephone Ringer ISSUE (land line)

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Yes it could be.


KenW

Re: Verizon Telephone Ringer ISSUE (land line)
On 1/11/20 6:13 AM, snipped-for-privacy@verizon.net wrote:
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<http://www.benjammin.net/www/pages/techtips/dsl-filter.html


--  
"I am a river to my people."
Jeff-1.0
We've slightly trimmed the long signature. Click to see the full one.
Re: Verizon Telephone Ringer ISSUE (land line)
I'll give you some ideas.  When/if the telco guy comes out have him fit a DSL filter in the NID.  Have everything else ready and be prepared to help.  I should be able to supply CAT5 from the NID to the inside of the house,

You have "two lines" at this point. Filtered and unfiltered or split.

With the filters/spliters removed and the modem OFF, you have a normal telephone line.  If you turn on the modem (no filters) and pickup an extension, you;ll hear HF noise.

I think it's an important concept.

Hum, it's likely the "protector.  In the NID or the old carbon one.

Spiders, wet and poor connections.  

Pull the DMARC and look at the resistance into the house.  It needs to be high  

If it;s not high (like 1M or greater), It's probably a jack and not a phone.  Inspect any low lying jacks for spider webs especially ones that can get wet.

he will measure the resistance of the phones in the house and will easily say it;s your problem.  Finding it - use your best guess.

Cob webs on the pole is possible too.  The ring voltage tends to break through the oxides.

DSL upgrade. Have a splitter installed by the telco.  use the highest pair (Pair 4) (8 cond)for DSL.  Being all 8 into a parallel punch down block (assuming no alarm RJ31x). Break out to telco and DSL.

Punch down telo and punch down to a RJ11 jack to DSL.

You can buy a CAT 5 straight RJ11-RJ11 to your DSL modem.  The modem doesn;t care if the polarity is reversed.

I have a mix of quad cable, no-home run and about 12 phones. No issues.  The quad non-home-run was installed by the phone company.

The final plan is aN rj45 phone patch where everything is parallel (a RED PANEl)  
  


Re: Verizon Telephone Ringer ISSUE (land line)
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     UPDATE:

    This problem got worse (more frequent) in the last couple days.  As a
result, I was able to determine that NOTHING in the house was the cause.

     I disconnected everything at the main phone jack,  plugged
in a spare telephone at that jack, and used my Tracfone to call
my landline number.  The first time, the telephone rang. A little
while later, I tried it again, and by golly, it did not ring.  I contacted
Verizon tech support. A service man is scheduled to come Monday.

                 John


Re: Verizon Telephone Ringer ISSUE (land line)

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That's one of the best diagnostic techniques for a lot of phone problems.

I've found that the following sort of phrasing works wonderfully well:
"The problem exists at the demarc, with all premises wiring
disconnected from the demarc, and can be demonstrated using either of
two different telephones plugged directly into the demarc jack."

That tells the telco customer-service rep (and the tech that they
eventually send out) two things:  the problem is in _their_ equipment
(not yours), and you know enough about the situation that they can't
scam you into agreeing to pay for a service call for your inside wiring.




Re: Verizon Telephone Ringer ISSUE (land line)
On Sunday, January 12, 2020 at 11:07:20 PM UTC-5, Dave Platt wrote:
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a
ed

Telco hires trained monkeys to take service calls. I had one insist that it
 had to be my inside wiring. That was one foot of new station wire to a new
 jack on the other side of the wall. They finally sent two techs out who de
termined that the 50 year old underground trunkline was bad and switched me
 to another bad copper pair. Centurylink isn't replacing bad underground tr
unk, they are waiting to replace it all with Fiber, one of these decades. I
 lost service during Hurricane Irma. A pedestal at the end of my street was
 pulled out of the ground by a damaged power pole. The pole was replaced, b
ut not the pedestal. They insist that my service was restored, and claim th
at I owe a lot of money for a line that never worked, again. I tried to clo
se the account at 90 days, but they would only do it if I called from the n
umber I wanted terminated. I asked, "How do I do that on a dead line?" They
 shrugged and tried to sell me a cell phone.

Nothing but poorly trained monkeys. A lot of businesses in the area had to  
go to VOIP to have usable phone service. Thankfully, the downtown area has  
1Gb fiber internet at a good price.

Re: Verizon Telephone Ringer ISSUE (land line)
On Mon, 13 Jan 2020 01:02:24 -0800 (PST), Michael Terrell

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Had the same problem with AT&T. After dicking me around for 10 years,
a tech told me there was water in a quarter mile long underground
cable and they weren't going to replace it.

Re: Verizon Telephone Ringer ISSUE (land line)

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True Story.
 Back in the 80s I lived in a Redmond WA neighborhood that had all
sorts of water problems. I had to deal with tons of water flowing
across my property from uphill houses. My phone started getting all
sorts of static on it but I wasn't surprised because we had GTE and
they seemed to be light on servicing their equipment. We had a phone
box in our front yard. One of those small boxes that sits atop a pipe.
The box was probably 14 inches long by 4 inches wide by about the same
deep. Anyway, I went outside for some reason and water is squirting
out of the box seams! It was hilarious. Static problem found. So I
went inside and called GTE to tell them about it. The woman I spoke to
told me that water was not used in phone systems. I insisted that I
knew that and that's why I called. Water was not supposed to be
squirting out of their phone box. I finally convinced her to send out
someone and she told me that I was going to be charged a service fee
if I was wrong about water coming out of their box. When the service
guy arrived and saw the box he was shocked and then laughed out loud.
Needless to say there was no charge on my phone bill.
Eric

Re: Verizon Telephone Ringer ISSUE (land line)
On Monday, January 13, 2020 at 1:04:16 PM UTC-5, Chuck wrote:
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As a
se.
acted
ms.
g.
 it had to be my inside wiring. That was one foot of new station wire to a  
new jack on the other side of the wall. They finally sent two techs out who
 determined that the 50 year old underground trunkline was bad and switched
 me to another bad copper pair. Centurylink isn't replacing bad underground
 trunk, they are waiting to replace it all with Fiber, one of these decades
. I lost service during Hurricane Irma. A pedestal at the end of my street  
was pulled out of the ground by a damaged power pole. The pole was replaced
, but not the pedestal. They insist that my service was restored, and claim
 that I owe a lot of money for a line that never worked, again. I tried to  
close the account at 90 days, but they would only do it if I called from th
e number I wanted terminated. I asked, "How do I do that on a dead line?" T
hey shrugged and tried to sell me a cell phone.
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to go to VOIP to have usable phone service. Thankfully, the downtown area h
as 1Gb fiber internet at a good price.
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The on hook voltage often dropped to a little under 4VDC. It was rarely abo
ve 30VDC. The techs that came said the entire subdivision had very old unde
rground cable and over half the pairs were open. A few homes were fed from  
two pairs, each with an open wire. The line was always noisy. I only kept i
t, because cell service and internet went down during heavy storms and hurr
icanes. Cell service here has improved quite a bit in the last 20 years.

Re: Verizon Telephone Ringer ISSUE (land line)

You need to make sure that the connecting cable is also different.

Also be aware that the telco repair person might not be knowledgeable eithe
r.

I asked the repair person that came out for a service call should the cord  
from the jack to the wall be straight or crossed.  He said he taught techni
cians and the cord should be straight-thru which is the wrong answer.

Only patch cables should be straight-thru.

Most modern phones don;t care if the wires are crossed or straight and, it  
appears, that neither do the phone technicians.  Old bell touch tone phones
 must have the polarity to work for the keypad to work.

The "protector" and the interface (jack and 1/2 ringer) can also be a sourc
e of potential problems.  There also might be two protectors.  One in the N
ID and one inside from old wiring.  

The 1/2 ringer can sometimes be removed when you have DSL.

Wet spider webs have been the big issues for me as well as connections from
 the CO.  One guy came back and said I just removed 1000 feet from your ser
vice,  Another guy came back with a foot of spliced cable where the insulat
ion was removed in places and said this was your problem.

The telco guy typically deals with the naked pairs and removes the NID from
 being the problem.

Re: Verizon Telephone Ringer ISSUE (land line)
On Sun, 12 Jan 2020 07:17:46 -0500, snipped-for-privacy@verizon.net wrote:

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     MORE UPDATE:

       A service man did NOT come.

       Verizon is still working on the problem.  I was told by a tech support
person that they are working on the cable (not outside my house).

                 John



Re: Verizon Telephone Ringer ISSUE (land line)
On Wed, 15 Jan 2020 07:24:52 -0500, snipped-for-privacy@verizon.net wrote:

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If it is a high resistance short they may find it after a time. Bitchy
to find.


KenW

Re: Verizon Telephone Ringer ISSUE (land line)
On Wednesday, January 15, 2020 at 7:25:32 AM UTC-5, snipped-for-privacy@verizon.net wrote:
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Last mile. between your DEMARC and their SLIC where up to 16 lines are multiplexed to a single pair o the C. O. More lines, if it s Fiber Optic to the C.O, They work from the SLIc towards your house, looking for problems.

Re: Verizon Telephone Ringer ISSUE (land line)
<SNIP>

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      FINAL UPDATE:

       On Wednesday, 2 Verizon service men showed up. They did some testing at
the pole first, and concluded the problem is in the house.

       Note: The previous owner of this house had two phone lines coming in
from the pole, and several lines inside the house.

        The service men rewired the main jack, and removed the MOVs surge
protectors (I installed years ago).   They ran more ringing tests and since
then, the telephone ALWAYS rings when someone calls.

        I tested the MOV surge protectors and they "clamp" at 250 volts.  Even
though they seem to be OK,  I am going to order new ones.  

      FYI: Ringing voltage is about 90VAC (20HZ) unloaded (no devices on
line).  This is RMS voltage with a PEAK voltage around 127VAC.

              Thanks again to everyone,  John



Re: Verizon Telephone Ringer ISSUE (land line)
On Fri, 17 Jan 2020 10:21:50 -0500, snipped-for-privacy@verizon.net wrote:

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Is your phone connected to your modem or are you still on ADSL?

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