OT: Sewing machine repair question where

The various sewing machine manuals often have timing adjustment instructions which include troubleshooting. A maker and model number would be helpful:

Sewing machine repair:

Sears:

Brother:

Various video:

If you're fixing an industrial sewing machine, the procedures and tolerances are quite different. Whatever you do, get the manual on the machine, even if you have to beat up on the manufactory. I ended up with a Brother machine which was not on their support web pile. An email got me a scanned manual.

Drivel: I fished this machine out of a dumpster: This one came from a flea market for about $15: Both are my "practice" machines.

So, what are you working on and what is it doing wrong?

I've got manuals for both, but they don't touch repairs at all. They're bot h domestic machines.

Bernina 121, 1944-54 and overly basic. Top tensioner refused to grip the th read at all. I got it to do so by removing a washer as a temporary measure

- that's not how it should be, but there we go. Now when the thread lifting arm goes up it doesn't quite pull the thread up far enough to get it fully out of the bobbin area, and snarlup quickly follows. It's not a valuable m achine, I won't be getting parts for it but it ought to be something fairly straightforward. I've set the bobbin & top tensions. I suspect the top ten sion release mechanism is stuck. I'll take another look but didn't say any ready access to that area of internals.

Bernina 530-2 circa 1960. A nice high quality machine with a range of decor ative stitches & lots of accessories. 2 problems. Applying power & operatin g the control results in current flow but no movement. The machine turns bu t is rather stiff - I suspect the motor's just stalled. I'll oil the whole thing & see if that sorts it. The other problem is the decorative stitch se lector won't move at all. Another lever also wouldn't move but a bit of per sistence & persuasion got it to. I suspect all round oiling may be the solu tion, will know later.

I've gotten tired of googling only to find idiot advice like 'have you put the thread in the right end,' 'don't forget to set the bobbin tension' and 'ooh you need to take it to a dealer' type stuff.

NT

got it to. I suspect all round oiling may be the solution, will know later.

I inherited my mother's old machine that had not been used for years. The zig-zag adjustment had stuck and I could not get at the bearing to free it up. Success with sticking the whole machine in front of a domestic fan heater until it was nicely warmed up!

Mike.

ecorative stitches & lots of accessories. 2 problems. Applying power & oper ating the control results in current flow but no movement. The machine turn s but is rather stiff - I suspect the motor's just stalled. I'll oil the wh ole thing & see if that sorts it. The other problem is the decorative stitc h selector won't move at all. Another lever also wouldn't move but a bit of persistence & persuasion

r.

put the thread in the right end,' 'don't forget to set the bobbin tension' and 'ooh you need to take it to a dealer' type stuff.

I like that. Once I've got them oiled I can try the oven at 40C - I think i t goes that low. Cheers. I do now suspect both of them are suffering the sa me seizure problem, just of different bits of the mechanism. I know almost nothing of their history post-purchase, but the 530-2 with the stuck select or does have a repair tag from 1977 saying stuck stitch selector.

NT

Most common (as in many made) machines have service manuals on-line. But th ere are two (2) keys to sewing machines that 99-44/100% of their owners (es pecially guys) do not understand:

a) Lubrication: Sewing machines used to be sold with a can of oil for a rea son. To prevent wear - especially on critical cams and cam-followers - they must be checked and lubricated about every 30-40 hours of use *at least*. Oils are better today and if one uses a high-tack PTFE-impregnated oil, tha t time may be extended to perhaps 60 hours. OR, every 60 days if not used often, or before each use if stored for long periods. WALK the machine thro ugh its movements by hand first before applying power.

b) Cleaning: Lots of flakes and fluff is generated by sewing - so a can of dust-off is your best friend - again, something not available back in the d ay.

If you have worn down a cam or cam-follower, short of replacement you will have problems. On thread-tensioners, there is often (or was at one point) a felt washer to maintain a gentle pressure on the thread that has some give to it. Look to see if that washer is missing.

Is a source for an exploded diagram for your earlier machine. Do a search o n the second - model number followed by "Exploded Diagram", and you will g et the next one as well.

I do the maintenance for my wife's machine. It 'purrs like a kitten', despi te its advanced age.

Best of luck with it!

Peter Wieck Melrose Park, PA

there are two (2) keys to sewing machines that 99-44/100% of their owners ( especially guys) do not understand:

eason. To prevent wear - especially on critical cams and cam-followers - th ey must be checked and lubricated about every 30-40 hours of use *at least* . Oils are better today and if one uses a high-tack PTFE-impregnated oil, t hat time may be extended to perhaps 60 hours. OR, every 60 days if not use d often, or before each use if stored for long periods. WALK the machine th rough its movements by hand first before applying power.

f dust-off is your best friend - again, something not available back in the day.

l have problems. On thread-tensioners, there is often (or was at one point) a felt washer to maintain a gentle pressure on the thread that has some gi ve to it. Look to see if that washer is missing.

on the second - model number followed by "Exploded Diagram", and you will get the next one as well.

pite its advanced age.

I've had the chance to clean & oil them. The 530-2 now sews, but 3 adjuster s are still jammed, and the whole mechanism is much stiffer than it ought t o be, though not as bad as it was.

The 121 I'll try a new needle with. I didn't think of that. A look at the m echanism reveals there is no upper thread tension release mechanism, it's j ust fixed tension. So I'm a bit puzzled why a washer needed removing to get that to work, or why the washer was there in the first place. I am only a bit wiser there.

I didn't think of exploding them. I googled but no such diagrams for either machine found.

I've been contemplating putting ammonia into the seized bits to cut through the oxidised/polymerised oil, not sure if that would be a good idea or not . The seized mechanicals are all steel.

NT

The Bernina 121 similar to the 125, which adds zig-zag but is the same as far as thread tensioning. It was also sold as a Husqvarna Zig-Zag. This should be useful:

I don't know exactly what's wrong, but you have the right idea. Take it apart, clean everything, reassemble, lubricate, and adjust the tension. I don't see how you can successfully adjust the top thread tension, and then claim that it doesn't grip the thread at all. If you've removed washers, you probably took it apart and cleaned it, so I'll assume the center shaft was clean. I normally do not oil the tension disks, so if they've been oiled, that might be the problem.

If the machine has been infrequently used, is dirty or dusty, or was lubricated with 3-in-1 oil, you might consider cleaning with solvent and some new oil.

Incidentally, that may not be a "valuable" machine, but it might be quite useful. Such all-metal machines are prized for sewing leather and heavy canvas.

The stuck stitch selector knob is an important clue that the machine needs cleaning and lubrication. Take the belt off and try to turn it by hand, but don't force it. If it's stiff, then you get to clean out the gum with some solvent and lubricate from scratch. If it moves freely, look at the motor. If you see blobs of oily lint, sticky goo, or rust on the shafts around the moving parts, there's the problem.

Too much oil is just as bad as not enough. Same with using the wrong type of oil. You want oil that doesn't evaporate and maintains a fairly constant viscosity over temperature. I would go easy on "oil the whole thing" and try to isolate the cause of the drag. Adding more oil to a dirty or dusty machine just creates more sticky goo.

If you specific advice for your specific problem, it's really helpful if you would supply specifics. A photo of the guts is very useful as many problems can be visually seen. Some history of the machine is always helpful.

I'll spare you the rest of the lecture. I'm out of time. Good luck.

Years and years ago I used to maintain industrial sewing machines. By far lubrication problems were the major cause of machine malfunctions. Dried up lube, the wrong lube, lube that had started to polymerize, contaminated lube, etc. Lube problems can cause adjustments to move because of increased friction. After lube problems was debris. Dust from thread and the fabrics being sewn gets everywhere and clogs stuff up. So give the machines a good cleaning and lubing first and then see if more work needs to be done. Eric

Hi Jeff,

Hate to ask (I can see an oil thread looming (sorry)) but what do you recommend for oil? I figure a non-detergent 20w oil is good for most small mechanical machines lube points, and have tried synthetic oils on tiny motors (CD spin motors) with good success. I have to assume there is no ideal oil though.

Have you a preferred link for an online page that gives a good description of oils and what jobs they are best for?

WD-40 is, of course, of little use when something is seized and there are far better and cheaper solutions than WD for that problem. The best appearing to be old style ATF fluid and acetone.

Thanks, John :-#)#

ewsgroups are near dead and lacking this sort of info, and it's not an elec tronic problem

Thanks - I'm convinced that's the entire problem with the 530-2. It probabl y hasn't been lubed in decades. What do you reckon I should use to remove h ardened oil from within parts? The only chemicals I'm thinking that could a ttack this effectively are ammonia & bleach, but am hesitant to use those w ithout knowing if it's ok to.

NT

GRUMP!!!!

OK, this is 2017. What this means is that there are lubricants and solvents out there that are beyond the wildest dreams of those machine designers.

First, invest in some KROIL - this to saturate everything in preparation fo r a massive cleaning. Kroil will loosen skunge and penetrate bearings so th at you do not gall anything by moving it by force. Kroil is meant as a pene trating oil, NOT as a lubricant, restorative nor anything else than what it is designed to do.

Then, when clean and re-assembled:

Where oil is required. Cams & cam-followers and such.

Where grease is required - gears, open shaft bearings (on the shaft and in the bearing prior to reassembly) and such.

Ancient oil & grease formula polymerized with heat and pressure. Modern syn thetics will not. That puts you way ahead of the game moving forward. And t he specific materials cited have a very high film strength and do not attra ct dust as much as non-synthetics.

Sewing needles have a 'sense', Typically the haft is D shaped. Make sure th at the flat side is in the correct orientation, or you will break/bend it e very time.

Remember, you are undoing years and years of neglect. If you work on the th eory that I use - every machine needs a certain amount of maintenance over its life. And the real time required increases in geometric but inversely r elated to the timeliness of that maintenance. So, you have a number of hour s ahead of you before everything will be 'right'.

I expect that the persnickety level of maintenance required is why new mach ines get sold despite the vast number of vintage ones out there.

Peter Wieck Melrose Park, PA

Not high enough.

First, a little background and drivel. My father owned a women's wear (mostly lingerie) factory in Smog Angeles. I got plenty of experience building, fixing, and adjusting industrial sewing machines and making attachments. Then, I discovered electronics and largely abandoned sewing machinery. Lately, I've become rather bored with electronics, computing, and some of my other activities, and though it might be interesting to do sewing machine repairs on the side. Big mistake, but I won't bore you with the problems I created. Meanwhile, I've collected a small collection of older machines, most of which are being slowly repaired and sold. Not the best credentials but perhaps good enough for the basics.

Oil for sewing machines, microscopes, guns, and clocks all have two requirements that must be met. The oil should not evaporate and should remain at a constant viscosity over the working temperature range. That's because these devices rely on residual friction of the lubricant to control the movement of mating parts. Changes in this friction will result in undesirable changes in timing and adjustment.

Big industrial sewing machines solve the gum and evaporation problems by using an oil sump and splash lubrication. It won't turn to gum because additional oil just washes away the gum. It can evaporate, but with so much oil in the sump, it's unlikely to ever be run without oil. Too bad it makes such a big mess. I've also never seen an oil sump on a home type sewing machine.

Another way is to do it like an automobile engine, and pump oil down an oil gallery into mating surfaces via holes in the bushings. That works, but is too complicated, expensive, and messy for a home machine.

So, what's left? Felt oil pads is what most home machine use. That works, but requires much better oil than the previous 2 methods of lubrication. That is why you don't use engine oil, WD40, penetrating oil, or home brew in a sewing machine. None of these oils are constant viscosity or even close to the viscosity specified by the sewing machine design. Even clock oil is marginal, because clocks are not designed to handle the rotational speeds and reciprocating pounding found in sewing machines.

So, what works? Ummm... sewing machine oil perhaps? They're largely all the same stuff different in viscosity for different manufacturers. Ok, so you're not going to buy it by the gallon, but the specs are the same as what you get with retail overpriced sewing machine oil.

No, but I'll see if I can find something. I doubt if anyone can get all the various types of lubricants on a single web page. In general, the lube selection pages of the major oil companies do better than the specialty oil formulation pages. For example start here: I'll see if I can find some more links later.

We had this discussion in some newsgroup recently. The consensus among those that tried acetone and ATF as a penetrating oil varied radically from it works great, to it sucks. Several people discovered that there are different types of ATF, one of which wouldn't even mix properly with acetone. I'll see if I can find the thread.

Please note that penetrating oil is not a lubricant.

The 125 is worth something, the 121 I doubt it. I don't plan to keep it, I' ve got far more capable machines. If I can get it going without hassle it'l l bring in double what I paid for the pair & be useful to someone. It's the 530-2 I'm willing to spend more time on.

interesting, but that's all

the lack of thread tension puzzled me. It works just fine with one washer r emoved, so it's a low priority issue.

Yes... question is which solvent. White spirit? Paraffin/kerosene? I've got those. Also have ammonia & bleach if they'd attack the crud without causin g damage.

Ten a penny I think.

I've not psoted pics because I don't believe they'd be in any way helpful. The mechanism is quite dense. Looking at the thing IRL it's hard enough to see what's going on with moving one's vision at all sorts of angles, I can' t see a photo being comprehensible. I'll see what I can get tomorrow but I doubt it'll give much away.

History is unknown, I got them at a clearance for peanuts. The lubrication disaster tells me they've either not been used in a long time, or had no ca re taken of them at all.

NT

ts out there that are beyond the wildest dreams of those machine designers.

for a massive cleaning. Kroil will loosen skunge and penetrate bearings so that you do not gall anything by moving it by force. Kroil is meant as a pe netrating oil, NOT as a lubricant, restorative nor anything else than what it is designed to do.

n the bearing prior to reassembly) and such.

ynthetics will not. That puts you way ahead of the game moving forward. And the specific materials cited have a very high film strength and do not att ract dust as much as non-synthetics.

that the flat side is in the correct orientation, or you will break/bend it every time.

theory that I use - every machine needs a certain amount of maintenance ove r its life. And the real time required increases in geometric but inversely related to the timeliness of that maintenance. So, you have a number of ho urs ahead of you before everything will be 'right'.

chines get sold despite the vast number of vintage ones out there.

I see you like to spend :) I use baby oil on sewing machines, it's a light petroleum derived clear oil with a trace of perfume. Whether babies were ha rmed in it's making remains to be seen.

These machines don't have any felt pads, oil just hangs around in the movin g parts by surface tension. They're certainly not high speed mechanisms, th ey're overengineered to be just about bombproof.

The 530-2 runs stiffly but it runs & sews now. But frequently the mechanism stiffens a good bit & motor speed drops right down. Hopefully paraffin wil l help. There are also still key parts that remain stuck. 15 minutes in th e oven at 50C freed up 3 controls, but 2 remain well stuck so far. Paraffin is next.

NT

You're hard to please.

It may have been disassembled and then put back together incorrectly.

Oh, that's easy. Anything that will dissolve the original sewing machine oil. Even if it's dried out or turned to goo, it's still the same oil, which can be dissolved by anything from paint thinner to kerosene. I wouldn't go any higher up the chlorinated hydrocarbon tree because those tend to dull or eat plastic parts. I tend to favor kerosene (lamp oil) for loosening up machine parts. If I'm lazy, I just dump some more sewing machine oil on the part, which will dissolve the gum, but not the stuff that has hardened. As little scraping with a piece of wood or plastic (not metal) will expedite things.

What's the story behind using ammonia and bleach? I've never heard of that concoction.

The reason I want a photo is because I've seen a few Frankenstein monsters assembled from parts from different machines. I've also spent an inordinate amount of time digging out information on what turned out to be the wrong model number. Trust, but verify.

Thanks for the details. Some of mine were left outside in the rain. Rust everywhere. I think you have the right approach. Clean, lube, adjust, and try again.

On Tue, 18 Jul 2017 14:48:05 -0700 (PDT), snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote as underneath :

snip

I would try naptha (lighter fluid) first as that will be compatible with the petroleum oils originally used. C+

:) If there's anything online about actual repairs to Berninas I've not found it.

Probably so. I'll recheck the central split threaded rod for blockage. I reckon I know how to sort it now.

Kerosene it is. Scraping is mostly not viable, taking the whole mechanism apart is not on the to do list, only 2 bits have scrape access.

Either can tackle congealed oil. Ammonia is the more effective & antisocial. Don't mix them.

Yup. Will get some pics. Cheers.

NT

For jobs like yours I like to use kerosene. Actually, I use "Lamp Oil". It's the stuff made for oil burning lamps and candles. I get the unscented stuff. I like it better than kerosene mainly because it doesn't smell bad. It doesn't dissolve hardened oil as fast as other solvents but then it doesn't tend to harm things either. Sometimes all you need is for the hardened oil to be flushed from the mechanism. Then there is this soft goo that oozes from bearings and the like. This goo can be removed by whatever is most convenient. After the lamp oil has started to flush the old oil out just follow with new oil. After you are sure the new oil has flushed out the lamp oil wipe up any excess oil that has run out of the bearing surfaces. Eric

Ammonia is alkaline enough to saponify oils, at least to some extent. I doubt it would dissolve the gum as well as a light petroleum solvent would, but one might use it as a final cleaner to remove all traces of the old (dissolved) lubricant before re-lubricating.

I don't think that chlorine bleach (sodium hypochlorite) would be a good choice. It also is alkaline and might saponify the oils but the free chlorine could attack all sorts of things in the equipment, including the service technician.

Ammonia and bleach as a "concoction" is one of those things that the labels on both products warn you quite sternly NOT to do. When mixed, these chemicals react to create chloramine gas (a mixture of NH2Cl and NHCl2), which is a severe respiratory irritant.

Unless you're fond of recreational edema and emergency tracheostomy, I'd avoid this "concoction" as if it were poison :-)