Microscopic Solder Job

My Android Motorola G5 plus phone decided to take a dive into the washing machine for 20 minutes. I'm looking for somebody to repair and transplant my old memory chip into a new duplicate phone of the same model.

Or, if they can repair the phone itself to where it will boot up that's fine too, it just seems like it would be more of a headache. I replaced the battery and did a very light iso cleaning on the board.

It will require both equipment and experience out of my knowledge base. Anybody who has suggestion I would appreciate it. Whoever can take on this project will be compensated via PayPal.

Reply to
davepekarski
Loading thread data ...

I don't know anything much about this place, but have seen some youtube videos by her and microsoldering when I was teaching myself to so some hot air soldering.

formatting link

Reply to
Ralph Mowery

Until you're sure the phone is dry, do NOT let it have a battery! The battery will create corrosion.

Yank the battery, consider rinsing inner parts in isopropyl alcohol (it's slightly drying), then air-blow or blot all the liquid out, and let it air-dry for a few days, before you even THINK about applying power.

Reply to
whit3rd

Also, place this into a container with a desiccant (rice will work as well) This will absorb any remaining moisture.

To the original posting: It is possible to move the chip, but any residual current anywhere can cause the memory to change. This should be done in a static free environment with the appropriate equipment. Even so, there is a risk of losing the contents.

Dan

Reply to
dansabrservices

Per snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com:

Somebody, somewhere, suggested soaking it in distilled water prior to those other steps.

--
Pete Cresswell
Reply to
(PeteCresswell)

(PeteCresswell) wrote on 1/20/2018 9:02 AM:

There is a lot of "information" about this sort of thing that is crap. Regular water is used to clean PCBs when made to wash off the residue from soldering. Water is not a problem other than when the unit is turned on, any remaining moisture acts to short out the signals. It doesn't fry chips or cause permanent damage unless it gets into the display or is left long enough to cause corrosion.

The only real problem is residual water that gets under the ICs and other components. There can be a space as small as 5 thousandths of an inch which is not so easy to clean out. If you want to use anything to clean the board of water you can wash it with acetone, but NOT the stuff used for nail polish removal, it has oil in it. Get some from the paint department. But even that is not needed, nor are desiccants or rice. Unless you live in a very humid location the unit will dry out in a couple of days. The best spot for it is near the vent from your furnace or AC. That air is very dry and having moving air around the phone helps to move the moisture away quicker. Probably not the best idea to put it on top of the vent as it may get too warm, but unless you have a gas or oil furnace that isn't likely to happen, still give it a few inches.

--
Rick C 

Viewed the eclipse at Wintercrest Farms, 
 Click to see the full signature
Reply to
rickman

Per rickman:

IIRC, the rationale was that different water has different amounts of dissolved salts... and the salts can cause electrical problems even after the board is dried... so the distilled water would dilute any salts that might be present.

--
Pete Cresswell
Reply to
(PeteCresswell)

(PeteCresswell) wrote on 1/20/2018 5:31 PM:

Yes, I suppose if you drop your phone in salt water, that could be a different problem.

--
Rick C 

Viewed the eclipse at Wintercrest Farms, 
 Click to see the full signature
Reply to
rickman

correct, and of course nearly all water has some salts in. And it also ought to be obvious that there is always powered circuitry in all modern phones.

NT

Reply to
tabbypurr

Why is power relevant? We are talking about drying a phone. The battery will be out, the SIM card will be out and of course the cover is off. What is the significance of either the tiny amount of "salts" in typical water. Actually, the phone was run through the washing machine. The soaps/detergents in the water are much more of a factor than the latent dissolved solids in the tap water. I would recommend the OP rinse the phone under running tap water for five or ten minutes to get all the wash water out. The tap water won't hurt *anything* in comparison, in fact it will be like a person going to the spa.

--
Rick C 

Viewed the eclipse at Wintercrest Farms, 
 Click to see the full signature
Reply to
rickman

at

.

one

be

Ricky!!

Are you trying to be obtuse, or is it your natural state? Tap water:

Up at our summer house, the tap water is from a shallow well, from an aquif er that is about 8' deep during a dry summer, and filtered through many fee t of ground on the 'fill' side of a fast-running, rock-bound creek. Effecti vely, that means "Coarse sand to China". There are very few dissolved miner als nor much of anything else in that water. We filter it for silt, and we use a carbon filter 'just in case'. Year after year after year (now over 30 ) it tests negative for bacteria and so forth. Rinsing something in that wa ter would be relatively low risk.

At home, the water is 10,000 year old deep-well water provided by the local utility mixed with Schuylkill River water, with a varying hardness from ab out 6 grains to 16 grains per gallon. 3.5 - 7 grains is considered moderate ly hard. 16 is 'cut it into chunks' range.

Using this water from the tap would be dangerous in the extreme.

Going to a Spa: If the two hot tubs we keep are any indication, that water will be highly mineralized - WAY up there in calcium. This is done to prote ct against corrosion amongst other things. Water from such a source would l eave a white film when it evaporates - which would be mostly calcium. We ch oose to use calcium as when we drain the spa, it is not harmful, and happen s to be good for certain types of native trees that are now stressed in Pen nsylvania. pH neutral, highly mineralized water happens to be good for huma n skin, but would be pretty wretched for cell phones.

Sources of "power" in cell-phones with neither batteries nor chips:

Can you say "electrolysis"? And if you can say it, do you understand how it works, at least in theory? And, past the theory, do you have the capacity to conceive of how it might be a factor in a device with many different typ es of metals, surrounded with a highly salted electrolyte?

An aside to that - does anyone here remember the old-fashioned electrolysin g humidifiers? Basically a Mason Jar with a plug-in Bakelite device on top that relied on the conductivity of the water to operate?

formatting link

These do not work at our summer house - and work fine at home.

Just like you jumped into the discussion on UV and eyes, with a "look-at-me , aren't I smart" - that was not, this is another similar 'contribution' bo rn of a fundamental lack of knowledge and a need to play 'me-to'.

God help anyone that takes your advice to heart.

Peter Wieck Melrose Park, PA

Reply to
pfjw

Thanks Peter, saved me saying much the same thing as indeed not all tap water has not the same conductivity.

Rats, I did say it.

John ;-#)#

Reply to
John Robertson

At my last company, I spent the better part of my last 4 or 5 years dealing with water conductivity issues. We produced machines that electrolyzed wat er into base and acid components in order to produce cleaning chemicals.

I visited customer sites all over the US and in several foreign countries i n order to deal with water conductivity issues. Water conductivity is measu red in micro-siemens. The lower the number, the less conductive the water. Distilled water was generally (not always) in the neighborhood of 1 to 10 m icro-siemens and was our baseline for this work. Normal tap water could eas ily range from 50 - 70 micro-siemens to many hundreds of micro-siemens, or even greater.

The highest (natural) conductivity we encountered was in a Home Depot wareh ouse in upstate New York, where the building was drawing it's water from a well, and the well was basically under a catch basin for road runoff. If I recall correctly, the level in that installation was on the order of 9000 m icro-siemens. You could literally taste the salt. And on top of that, they had installed a bleach injection system in order to keep the fixtures from getting stained, and the water from stinking. Don't drink that water.

I had designed the circuit board that electrolyzed the water, and had done so to accommodate a wide range of conductivity, but the challenge was alway s at the extremes. Too conductive, and the system would go over current and shut down. Not conductive enough, and we couldn't pass enough current thru it to cause electrolysis effectively. I developed solutions for both extre mes, but at operational trade-offs of course.

Interestingly, when we analyzed water samples, the source the conductivity was frequently different from site to site. And what we think of convention ally as "hardness" didn't always correlate to conductivity.

Reply to
Terry Schwartz

ng with water conductivity issues. We produced machines that electrolyzed w ater into base and acid components in order to produce cleaning chemicals.

in order to deal with water conductivity issues. Water conductivity is mea sured in micro-siemens. The lower the number, the less conductive the water . Distilled water was generally (not always) in the neighborhood of 1 to 10 micro-siemens and was our baseline for this work. Normal tap water could e asily range from 50 - 70 micro-siemens to many hundreds of micro-siemens, o r even greater.

ehouse in upstate New York, where the building was drawing it's water from a well, and the well was basically under a catch basin for road runoff. If I recall correctly, the level in that installation was on the order of 9000 micro-siemens. You could literally taste the salt. And on top of that, the y had installed a bleach injection system in order to keep the fixtures fro m getting stained, and the water from stinking. Don't drink that water.

e so to accommodate a wide range of conductivity, but the challenge was alw ays at the extremes. Too conductive, and the system would go over current a nd shut down. Not conductive enough, and we couldn't pass enough current th ru it to cause electrolysis effectively. I developed solutions for both ext remes, but at operational trade-offs of course.

y was frequently different from site to site. And what we think of conventi onally as "hardness" didn't always correlate to conductivity.

I'd be interested to find out about the production of the cleaning chemical s.

NT

Reply to
tabbypurr

NT, feel free to google Orbio and Tennant ECH2O. Email me with questions if you'd like.

Terry

Reply to
Terry Schwartz

A large percentage of modern phones (and cameras, and similar devices) no longer have a removable battery.

I know several people who have run a phone or a fitbit through the wash machine. None were able to save it.

Is there any paper inside a phone, like there is in a computer or a keyboard?

Reply to
Tim R

longer have a removable battery.

As a vintage radio hobbyist that also dabbles in vintage audio, when it com es to some specimens, the Bosch dishwasher (made in Tennessee, USA) has bec ome my best friend. Items that have been flooded, moused or otherwise damag ed often respond very well to the process. As Bosch uses an indirect heatin g and drying system, there is no direct exposure to the heating element. So far, several tube TransOceanic radios, a few solid-state tuners and other electronics flooded at our summer house, and any number of vintage radio ch assis have gone through with only good results. Paper items and speakers ar e removed, IF transformers are flushed and sealed prior to the start and if there are wax-covered coils the unit goes on the top rack.

But, none of this stuff uses SMT technology with extremely dense multi-laye r boards as are most cell-phones and other wearable technology.

We are in a throw-away world, where the skills necessary to repair somethin g like a FitBit exceed its value. Often by a considerable margin. I think t hat is what is most frustrating to the average user here. No amount of huma n skills or repair-bench tooling is going to equal what a robot can pack in to a few square millimeters of board, much less be able to repair/replace i ndividual components within that board.

Peter Wieck Melrose Park, PA

Reply to
pfjw

I can tell you it wasn't from electrolysis of water. That produces hydrogen (H2) and oxygen (O2), not acid and base. Anything else would have to come from additives to the water.

--
Rick C 

Viewed the eclipse at Wintercrest Farms, 
 Click to see the full signature
Reply to
rickman

it's saltwater.

I'm curious when this was patented, if it was.

NT

Reply to
tabbypurr

Not really. All water has contaminants. The water he has mentioned was fresh water with more or less contaminants. Still, it wouldn't be described as electrolysis of (salt)water if the interesting part was the contaminants. It would be described as the interesting bits dissolved in water.

--
Rick C 

Viewed the eclipse at Wintercrest Farms, 
 Click to see the full signature
Reply to
rickman

ElectronDepot website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.