Dell PowerConnect fan question

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As anyone who owns one knows, the fans in a Dell PowerConnect 5324  
network switch are horrendously noisy. Therefore, following the  
suggestions I see all over the 'Net, I bought a pair of Sunon  
KDE1204PKV3-MS.AF.GN fans.

One of the two new fans keeps the "Fan OK" LED green but does not spin.  
The other one spins but activates the red "Fan Error" LED.

Is there any simple explanation for this? With the original Delta  
screamers, the red LED switched on only when a fan was disconnected or  
prevented from turning.

Anybody else here done this fan substitution? Does a "working" (i.e.,  
spinning) Sunon fan activate the green fan LED rather than the red one?

Perce

Re: Dell PowerConnect fan question
On Sat, 14 May 2016 21:31:48 -0400, "Percival P. Cassidy"

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I haven't done the fan transplant on a 5324 but have done it
successfully on other switches.  There seems to be something fishy
about the 5324 connector wiring.  See the video starting at 7:05.  
<
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WkMBa2yfW4o

My guess(tm) is that you have the RPM sensor wire going to the wrong
pin.

In the comments under the first comment by Brad Poulon is:
  Muhammad Khan1 year ago
  I installed the same fans on my PowerConnect 5324 as well, they  
  are not whisper quiet and the front FAN led blinks red. Did you  
  do the wire hack shown in the video? and also where did you get  
  the fans from? Much Appreciated!!?


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Re: Dell PowerConnect fan question
On 05/14/2016 10:14 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

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I switched the connections around the same way as the original Delta  
fans: Red, Yellow (the originals were blue), Black, instead of the  
Black, Red, Yellow sequence with which the new fans came.

I do see one difference between the fans I bought and the ones referred  
to in Brad Poulton's comment on YouTube: mine are KDE1204PKV3-MS.AF.GN,  
whereas he mentions KDE1204PKV3-MS.AR.GN

Perce




Re: Dell PowerConnect fan question
On Sat, 14 May 2016 23:22:15 -0400, "Percival P. Cassidy"

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methinks that is just direction of airflow.

RL

Re: Dell PowerConnect fan question

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Wrong.  See Pg 08
<https://media.digikey.com/pdf/Data%20Sheets/Sunon%20PDFs/Maglev%20Catalog.pdf>
to decode the part number.

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Re: Dell PowerConnect fan question
On Sat, 14 May 2016 23:22:15 -0400, "Percival P. Cassidy"

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Yep.  That's correct and required.  However, if wired correctly, the
fan should spin even if the RPM wire was disconnected.  I smell a
defective fan.  Try powering the red/black wires with an external 12V
source.  If the one that doesn't spin continues to fail to spin, it's
a bad fan.  The other fan seems to act like the RPM wire is
disconnected, not sending a signal, or sending the wrong signal.  Two
defective fans?  

Did you notice in the YouTube video that the author had to replace the
fans twice?  The 2nd time, the vendor shipped him 2 out of 3 defective
fans.  

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I Googled for what the various dealers are selling in the way of
replacement quiet fans.  1300 hits for AR and 2300 hits for AF.  

Ah, found the catalog page:
<https://media.digikey.com/pdf/Data%20Sheets/Sunon%20PDFs/Maglev%20Catalog.pdf>
See bottom of Pg 08.
MS = Maglev
GN = RoHS compliant
AR = Autorestart + 3rd wire with rotation detector waveform
AF = Autorestart + 3rd wire with frequency generation waveform
Well, there's the difference and possibly the culprit.  Check what the
original Delta fan is putting out on the 3rd wire and buy whatever fan
is compatible.  I think you can take it from here.

I still think your fan that doesn't spin is defective.

2:30AM.  Maybe I should get some sleep...

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Re: Dell PowerConnect fan question
On 05/15/2016 05:39 AM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

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I did satisfy myself that the non-spinning fan was in fact defective,  
and the seller (in China) refunded my money for that one fan. And as far  
as I could find out, the 3rd wire on the original Delta fans put out a  
"spinning" signal.

I now have a couple of KDE1204PKV3-MS.AR.GN fans from a different vendor  
(nothing against the first one, but he didn't have the "AR" ones), and  
they spin just fine, but the fan LED is reddish with flashes of green  
rather than steady green. I guess I'll just put up with that.

Perce


Re: Dell PowerConnect fan question
On Monday, June 6, 2016 at 4:19:18 PM UTC-6, Percival P. Cassidy wrote:
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Did you ever do the pin switch as shown in this video:  
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WkMBa2yfW4o


The guy in the youtube comments says the KDE1204PKV3.MS.AR.GN w/ the pin swap works great.

That pdf posted does not help decode these part numbers heh:
KDE1204PKV3.MS.AR.GN
vs
KDE1204PKV3.MS.AF.GN

Also here:  http://www.jonkensy.com/quiet-down-your-homelab/



Re: Dell PowerConnect fan question
Here is another quote:

"Just a note to add that if you use the version of those Sunon fans with th
e "F" 3rd wire output (frequency or "tacho" output) then the switch will re
gister a fan fail - you need the version that has the "R" (Rotation) type 3
rd wire output which is a basic constant 5v or 0v output depending on wheth
er the fan is stalled or running"


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_dM0pBRfOI&t=0s


Re: Dell PowerConnect fan question
On Sun, 28 Aug 2016 09:59:44 -0700 (PDT), snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

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Well, that's your answer on the part number.  

However, you can probably simulate the "R" type by simply integrating
the frequency output of the "F" type with a large capacitor.  To the
Dell switch, the pulse train would look like a DC voltage.  It's easy
enough but I don't want to recommend a circuit until I see what kind
of load the Dell represents (TTL, CMOS, transistor circuit, etc) and
what levels it expects.

F versus R type:
<http://www.sunon.com/uFiles/file/03_products/07-Technology/005.pdf

You could also just pull down to ground the 3 fan sense wires on the
Dell. (see waveform on the R type above).  There would not be any
indication of a fan failure, but it would work.

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Jeff Liebermann     snipped-for-privacy@cruzio.com
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Re: Dell PowerConnect fan question
On 08/28/2016 12:55 PM, snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:
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Yes, I switched the pins, and, as I said, the LED is mostly reddish with  
flashes of green. I guess it's just no spinning fast enough to keep the  
Dell circuitry completely happy.

Perce


Re: Dell PowerConnect fan question
On Sun, 28 Aug 2016 09:55:32 -0700 (PDT), snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

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Nope.  However, I just inherited a Dell 5424 that could use a fan
transplant.  I might try it eventually, but not in the immediate
future.  It's going into a mount top site where there's nobody to
complain about the noise.

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Looks good.  It took him a few tries to get the power polarity
correct.  The open question is whether the fan sense wire wants a DC
level to represent fan speed, or if it generates pulses.  I still
don't have an answer and suggest you use an oscilloscope on the sense
wire to see what it's doing (with the original noisy fans).  I can do
it in about a week (I'm on vacation this week) or I might sneak into
the office for one day this week.

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Dunno.  All I have to work with on decoding the part number was on my
previous posting.

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Same thing.  Just juggle the wires and it should work, assuming that
you got lucky with the sense wire.

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Jeff Liebermann     snipped-for-privacy@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D    http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
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