Debug advice Kenmore coldspot 106-59422801 stopped refrigerating

"not found" is what the web page says.

--
. 
Christopher A. Young 
 Click to see the full signature
Reply to
Stormin Mormon
Loading thread data ...

I added a g to the end of the URL, and got a picture. I can't comment on that, until you answer my question.

--
. 
Christopher A. Young 
 Click to see the full signature
Reply to
Stormin Mormon

I was wondering what his suggestion had been. He kept saying I was ignoring him, but I never saw (or remember seeing) his suggestion. Maybe it's there. Probably is.

Anyway, as a Hail Mary play, I tried the Supco RC0410 1/4-to-1/3 HP 120VAC "3n1 Start" Solid State Relay Overload Start Capacitor Combination (6.8A Maximum Continuous Amps):

formatting link

  1. It easily hooked up to the refrigerator, and, in fact, was far easier than making the test jig (so, in hindsight, forget the test jig - just hook up one of these 3n1 Start combos):
    formatting link

Good news and bad news.

A. The first time I connected it, the compressor RAN! B. The second time I connected it, the compressor kicked off after 20 seconds (and the power cord got hot).

When it was running, the Ammeter read 1.5Amps!

formatting link

I let it run for about two minutes, and I could feel the output (thin) discharge tubing getting hot to the touch. The input tubing didn't get a chance to change temperature.

I told the wife it worked, so I unplugged it to show her that it starts up, and guess what?

The second time I plugged it in, the overload kicked in after 20 seconds, and the cord got noticably hot.

If I was confused before - I'm doubly confused now.

I'm gonna let it cool down a bit,

Reply to
Danny D.

I think I tried *every* suggestion ever made in this thread.

Here's yours, but I don't remember it being suggested until today.

formatting link

Reply to
Danny D.

Funny thing is that the Sears country-wide prices are *far* (far!) lower than the prices at the local appliance shops here in the Silicon Valley!

formatting link

The run cap is $17.39 in that Sears USA parts diagram, but at the local San Jose parts stores, it was between $45 and $65 for those who had it in stock.

Interestingly, the relay is $45.17 in that Sears US diagram, and it was about $60 to $75 at the local parts stores that had it in stock.

Meanwhile, the Supco RC0410 1/4-to-1/3 HP 120VAC "3n1 Start" Solid State Relay Overload Start Capacitor Combination should be around $10, but I paid $29.50 for it at the local Appliance Parts Store.

formatting link

What do you make of this? a. The first time I plugged in the RC0410, the compressor started! b. After about two minutes, I wanted to show teh wife, and, in her presence, the second time I plugged it in, it overheated and turned off.

formatting link

Heh heh. It "is" more. In San Jose at least. I paid $29.50 for it today.

Ah, but what if the compressor starts the first time, and then fails to start the second time?

I'll try to get a video of this - but I am waiting for it to cool down (and for the wife to go to bed so she doesn't influence the test results).

formatting link

Reply to
Danny D.

On 7/12/2016 10:56 PM, Danny D. wrote: ...

That's fantastic!

Refrigerators and AC's need to rest before being restarted. I think that the pressures in the system have to equalize, so that the compressor is not trying to start against too large a "head".

Normally this happens because when the thermostat turns it off, it's a while before the thermostat tells it to turn on again.

Reply to
Bob Engelhardt

I asked two Appliance Parts Stores, and they agree that they're one and teh same, so, the guy who said that they're not in that thread must be wrong:

formatting link

It worked the first time! Then it failed the second time. :(

formatting link

I'm more confused now than ever, but I will try again after it cools down.

Actually, it was $29.50 here in San Jose:

formatting link

Reply to
Danny D.

Thanks for answering so quickly, as I had egg all over my face after telling the wife that I was a veritable genius and that I fixed it for less than thirty bucks!

I'll let it cool down, and plug it back in, with the ammeter connected, and check the current. If it starts, I'll leave it running for a few hours!

I must admit - the information is conflicting - so I'm confused. Very confused.

a. The old equipment tested good (as far as I could tell) b. The jumper rig should have bypassed the relay (but not the OEM cap) c. All this 3n1 "hard-start kit" did was replace those two things

Maybe it's a "bigger" capacitor?

formatting link

There's no mention on the package of how big the cap is, but physically, the combination unit is far beefier than the OEM unit. So I dunno...

formatting link

Do you think it could be as simple as the compressor just needed a "beefier" cap?

Why would it need a beefier cap?

Reply to
Danny D.

Ooops. Mea culpa. Sorry about that missing "g".

It should have been:

formatting link

Ummmmm... what question?

But I have a question for you. How do you respond so quickly?

I have to sit down at the computer to even see a message, so, I don't see them in real time. Do you have something that goes to your phone?

Reply to
Danny D.

On 7/12/2016 11:16 PM, Danny D. wrote: ...

A more-capacitance cap would have a lower impedance and allow more current to flow. More current in a motor means more torque.

There is still the possibility that the original cap is defective. That the parts-place check did not measure capacitance, or if it did, it wrongly concluded that the capacitance that it measured was the needed value.

Reply to
Bob Engelhardt

Also, IIRC, users' manuals for AC's say to wait 3 minutes before trying to restart.

Reply to
Bob Engelhardt

You never answered my question, and I never made any suggestions what to do. Other than suggesting you answer my question so we can move on.

--
. 
Christopher A. Young 
 Click to see the full signature
Reply to
Stormin Mormon

Coincidence. I'm on the east coast, and spend a bit of time on the computer in the evenings.

What question? I only asked twice.

--
. 
Christopher A. Young 
 Click to see the full signature
Reply to
Stormin Mormon

Not that Danny reads my posts, you see.

--
. 
Christopher A. Young 
 Click to see the full signature
Reply to
Stormin Mormon

As others have said you must let it set for about 20 minutes for the pressure between the high side and the suction side to equalize. Also, if the kit uses a PTC starter, that also must cool down to room temperature.

Reply to
tom

Good news, and odd news.

  1. I let it cool down for 1/2 hour and then when I plugged the Supco RC0410
1/4-to-1/3 HP 120VAC "3n1 Start" Solid State Relay Overload Start Capacitor Combination unit in to the mains, the compressor started again!

  1. I left the connections to the motor where they were, which seemed to match our assumption that the top was the COMMON, and the forward-facing bottom was the START and the rearward facing bottom was the RUN/MARK connection.
    formatting link

  2. You'll notice I am not using the original power cord, so I have the rest of the frig (including condenser the fan) on its own power supply and the Supco RC0410 hard-start cap on its own power cord.
    formatting link

  1. With the Ammeter on the 15Amp scale, when the compressor was running, the current on the black COMMON lead was about 3 amps.
    formatting link

  2. To doublecheck, I checked the current on the input cord neutrals, which was also 3 Amps (not surprisingly):
    formatting link

  1. When the compressor was starting, the current on the START lead jumped a bit (maybe double the 3 amps?) and then instantly settled down to zero amps (or very slightly above zero amps).
    formatting link

  2. Then the compressor ran for about 10 or 20 minutes, getting very hot to the touch, where the output (thin) line was hot enough to burn my fingertips and even the input (thick) copper line was warm to the touch (and the refrigerator began to get noticeably cooler inside the doors).

  1. After 10 or 15 or so minutes of running, the compressor began to hum instead of work causing 11 amps to flow through the COMMON lead, and then the relay clicked off (is that supposed to happen?).
    formatting link

  2. Then the compressor turned back on, after about 10 minutes, and worked for a much shorter period of time, before turning off again (maybe fewer than five minutes).

Is it normal for a compressor to shut off after getting very hot after working for only about 10 minutes?

Is it OK to have the frig temporarily on two power cords? a. One for the fan and the rest of the frig b. One just for the compressor

Reply to
Danny D.

Did you remove all the dust from the condenser coil?

Reply to
tom

Here's the sound of the compressor running with the hard-start capacitor hooked up, sinking only about 3 amps through the COMMON terminal:

formatting link

Here's the sound of the compressor turning off, after running for about 20 minutes or so, sinking about 11 amps through the COMMON terminal:

formatting link

Reply to
Danny D.

The capacitor on that hard start kit may be too large and cause overheating. Why don't you go ahead and get the correct part specified for the unit you have?

For the last time, did you clean the dust off the condenser coil? That's important.

Reply to
tom

Given that the compressor is clearly working (at least for a short period of time), it seems that I have to go back and figure out what's bad.

Seems to make sense to replace the cap, even though 3 tests showed it to be good.

I was throwing away the frig as of this morning, so, there was no need to clean the condenser coil. I guess I'll clean it now - although do you really thing *that* is what is making the compressor cycle?

Reply to
Danny D.

ElectronDepot website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.