Vampire Appliances

In article , snipped-for-privacy@earthlink.net.invalid mentioned...

Well, with all those followups, I've yet to see an answer to my original Q, above. Like, nowadays, is the cost electricity a dollar a kWh?

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Don't be ripped off by the big book dealers.  Go to the URL
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In article , snipped-for-privacy@earthlink.net.invalid mentioned... [snip]

I remember back in the late '70s and early '80s there was a guy who put an air filter from a car on the back of his S-100 system. It worked well, but looked odd with the dinner-plate sized chrome cover and wing nut. ;-)

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My email address is whitelisted. *All* email sent to it goes directly to the trash unless you add NOSPAM in the Subject: line with other stuff. alondra101 hotmail.com Don't be ripped off by the big book dealers. Go to the URL that will give you a choice and save you money(up to half). You'll be glad you did! Just when you thought you had all this figured out, the gov't changed it:

In article , snipped-for-privacy@earthlink.net.invalid mentioned...

If you were really moving in relatiistic terms, the Doppler effect or red shift would make it necessary to view the screen with IR sensitive eyes. Not to mention the problems with the TV RF signal..

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goes directly to the trash unless you add NOSPAM in the 
Subject: line with other stuff.  alondra101  hotmail.com
Don't be ripped off by the big book dealers.  Go to the URL
that will give you a choice and save you money(up to half).
http://www.everybookstore.com  You'll be glad you did!
Just when you thought you had all this figured out, the gov't
changed it: http://physics.nist.gov/cuu/Units/binary.html@@t@h@e@@a@f@f@l@u@e@n@t@@m@e@e@t@@t@h@e@@E@f@f@l@u@e@n@t@@

Depending on your location, the cost can vary from about $0.02 ( two cents ) to about $0.20 ( twenty cents ) per kW/hr. This is for most parts of North America. You should check on your power bill for the cost that they are charging to you, or call them.

Many power companies pro-rate their pricing. As you use more, the price will drop, as per volume discounting. In some regions where they want the customers to use less, they pro-rate the cost in the opposite direction. Some power distributors, want to give preference to industrial users, therefore, they charge higher rates, as the user consumes more power. This is known as "reverse pro-rated costing".

To know your rates, and how they work from your power distributor, you should call them and ask.

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Greetings,

Jerry Greenberg GLG Technologies GLG ========================================= WebPage

Electronics Instruments =========================================

Well, with all those followups, I've yet to see an answer to my original Q, above. Like, nowadays, is the cost electricity a dollar a kWh?

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My email address is whitelisted. *All* email sent to it goes directly to the trash unless you add NOSPAM in the Subject: line with other stuff. alondra101 hotmail.com Don't be ripped off by the big book dealers. Go to the URL that will give you a choice and save you money(up to half). You'll be glad you did! Just when you thought you had all this figured out, the gov't changed it:

It was a kila-watt clone, which is a little device you plug into the socket, and then plug your device into. The reason is that it wants to keep practically all of the circuitry active, in order to recieve software updates, keep track of program listings, and look for signals to kill the viewing card.

Relatively cheap, though very inaccurate on some loads.

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http://inquisitor.i.am/    |  mailto:inquisitor@i.am |             Ian Stirling.
---------------------------+-------------------------+--------------------------
Two fish in a tank: one says to the other, "you know how to drive this thing??"

The cable TV amplifier is drawing current. The meter you used probably cannot measure it because of its load characteristics. A simple DVM or home type Amp meter is not sophisticated to take accurate readings on devices that are very reactive, or non linear in their power consumption rate. But, you have a very good idea of what is going on, according to your descriptions.

Your cable TV amplifier should be drawing about 0.8 to about 1.5 Watts on the average. If your GE TV is an old set without remote control operation, then it would be using a hard power switch, and draw no power when off. It would normally be pulling about 3 to 6 Watts on the average in the OFF mode, if it is a modern set. Due to the characteristics of the power supply, your meter is not measuring it properly. Check the specifications in the user booklet that came with the set. Usually for most models they will indicate the power off, power consumption.

You can put external power switches to devices, but their internal processors will stop working. If you have pre-set memories and etc, these will be lost after some time. Some units will loose these in about 20 minutes or so. Others with backup batteries will hold it much longer, but you will be changing the batteries from time to time. This has an added cost. If these units are using internal batteries on the circuit boards, you will be in for some extra maintenance work, that will also be more costly in the end.

In a home that we tested we have a number of devices that are pulling current when off. We have done a number of homes for power consumption evaluation. This is a typical family home. We have about 7 months a year where heating is required, and about 3 months a year where a lot of air conditioning is required. There is about 2 months of the year where the temperatures are moderate, and heating and air conditioning costs are low. We have been doing power evaluations for homes, and below is a typical medium family home. You would be surprised with all the modern type appliances, what the actual power consumption is. If you add up the whole country, this is a very large number for all the devices when turned off! Maybe we should go back to the 1960's type design without the computer controlled options...

4 TV sets 20 Watts 3 Computer monitors 15 Watts 1 Short wave radio 3 Watts 2 Cable TV amplifiers 2 Watts 3 Computers 30 Watts 5 Electric Clocks 12 Watts 1 Microwave Oven 6 Watts 1 Electric Stove 6 Watts 1 Fax Machine 5 Watts 1 Alarm System 15 Watts 4 Cordless Telephones 15 Watts 1 Sound System 20 Watts ( all units together ) 1 Cable TV Decoder 40 Watts 2 VCR's 16 Watts 1 DVD Player 10 Watts

This list does not cover the cost of cooking, freezers, refrigerators, air conditioning, lighting, washing machine, dryer, and heating. The refrigerator, freezer, air conditioners, furnace, and washing machine, are the most costly devices in the home when evaluated over a long duration. Since the freezer, furnace, air conditioner, and refrigerator use microcomputer controlled electronic thermostats instead of the mechanical ones (like 20 years ago), they each also pull about 5 Watts of power on the average when in the standby mode.

The list above, not including the major appliances, heating, air conditioning, and lighting, gives a total of 215 Watts for standby power devices. The rate is about $0.05 US Kw/Hr, pro-rated to $0.07 US Kw/Hr. In our area, this evaluation example would cost $0.0129 US per hour average. This is $0.31 US per day, or $9.28 per month average. At this rate, nothing has been turned on yet.

This household has an average power bill of about $130 US per month when including the usage of all the utilities. This is $1560.00 US per year. In relation to running a complete household, I would not complain about the standby costs.

We found that using compact florescent lamps give a big cost savings for power consumption. Some people do not like the type of light they give off. They are more expensive to purchase, but they do make up in the final cost over their lifespan. The best buys are the ones that go on sale from time to time. In the fall we generally see them reduced in purchase price by about

30%. This is the time to stock up on them. The brand name does not make much difference, since it is only a few companies producing them, and they all must meet the UL and CSA standards.

A 12 Watt compact florescent will give off nearly the same amount of light as a 60 or 70 Watt incandescent lamp. This gives about a 4 times savings in the power consumption. The only drawback with these is that most types cannot be used on a dimmer, if you want dimmers. The dimmer type models are much more expensive, and then there will be a much less cost savings. In areas where the lights are left on very often, such as the kitchen, hallways, outdoor address box, and other similar places where there are no dimmers installed, are the ideal places for these types of lamps.

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Greetings,

Jerry Greenberg       GLG Technologies GLG
=========================================
WebPage         http://www.zoom-one.com
Electronics        http://www.zoom-one.com/electron.htm
Instruments       http://www.zoom-one.com/glgtech.htm
=========================================


"default"  wrote in message
news:7mk3ov0otg2k5lj606ijooo2uabedjsei8@4ax.com...
On Mon, 6 Oct 2003 06:21:42 -0700, Watson A.Name - "Watt Sun"
 wrote:

>I was watching the local ABC News and they had a piece on vampire
>appliances.  They said that an appliance could be using about 5 watts
>when it's turned off, and that's about $4.00 a month.  This sounded a
>bit high to me.  But since I don't get an electric bill, I have no way
>to tell.
>
>5 watt-hours times 730 hours a month is 3650 watt-hours or 3.65 kWh.
>
>More than a dollar a kWh?
This is probably good info. if they mean average wasted power around
the house as a result of power supplies idling without doing any work.

I opened up my typewriter some years ago and was surprised at how hot
it was inside.  I got my clamp on ammeter and went around the house
measuring everything.  Here's some of what I found (calculated on 120
VAC):

CD player OFF   10 watts
Cable amplifier ON:noreading
Cable convertor OFF 16.3 watts
GE TV OFF: no reading
Microwave OFF: 4.3 watts
Sony TV OFF: 12 watts
VCR OFF  14 watts
Computer printer OFF  9.6 watts
Word Processing TypeW 10.0 watts
Police Scanner OFF 3.0 watts
Computer scanner OFF 5 Watts


It amounts to ~$5+ a month for the stuff that doesn't provide any
useful function when off. I think that is significant.

Worth installing a switch for things one uses infrequently.

Wonder how much power that amounts to nationwide?


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Please re-read the OP below. He says he doesn't get an electric bill.

[snip]

Well, with all those followups, I've yet to see an answer to my original Q, above. Like, nowadays, is the cost electricity a dollar a kWh?

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where there is no possessive sense, as in ~tea's are served here~;
(ii) there is no such word as ~her's, our's, their's, your's~.

Confusions: it's = it is or it has (not 'belonging to it'); correct
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I bought some batteries, but they weren't included,
so I had to buy them again.
-- Steven Wright

FOR SALE: Nice parachute: never opened - used once.

(Problem) Evidence of leak on right main landing gear
(Solution) Evidence removed

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On Tue, 7 Oct 2003 10:14:57 -0400, "Jerry G."

It was probably below the current I could measure with the clamp on. I wound a 25 turn coil for the clamp on, and routed one side of the power line to it. The most sensitive range is 6 amps full scale, and .6 amps is the first full hash mark. 1.44 was about the minimum calculated power I could see that way.

I had a few things that would be below that Like the aquarium air pump, LED night light, etc.

The GE TV is an old set WITH a remote control.

Only my scanner has a volatile memory that requires batteries. In the case of the word processing typewriter - shutting the power off eliminated a problem that would occasionally crop up. The typewriter has no batteries. Cable box looses the parental guidance programming, but that isn't a problem for me. I use the scanner infrequently so pulled the battery out.

Wow! that's a big waste of power.

I did measure all the useful loads to see where to save money. I figure these aren't "vampire" loads since they do useful work.

It would be good to know what the power meter bias is doing to your minimum load. From what I understand (from talking to the woman at the customer service desk of the power company) my 200 amp service has its meter calibrated at 30 amps and 5 amps. They use a traceable calibrated standard, but the meters themselves are not 100% linear.

I can see your point. Living alone with time away from home, and a really frugal lifestyle, my bill averages ~$18/mo winter and ~$24 summer. I got up to ~$48/mo before deciding to do something about it.

Called the power company, learned how to read the meter and went around adding switches and changing my lifestyle. Every day I read the meter and plug the number into a spreadsheet and notebook. Things like leaving the fridge door ajar, a long hot soak in the tub, making beer or baking bread show up the next day. Feedback.

I'm a believer in the compact florescent lamps.

The only incandescent lamps I have, are in places where the lights don't stay on for very long. I even replaced one of my "circle line" florescent lamps with a pair of compact high frequency florescents (the circular replacements were costing $24 each and the 12W compacts cost $4 each)

One of my biggest cost savers was to turn off the hot water to the kitchen faucet and add a power switch to the water heater. I turn it on for 5-10 minutes a day in winter (very low flow shower head) and heat dishwashing water in a large stainless "bain marie" on the stove.

Power saving number two was to start cleaning the compressor coils on the fridge once a year.

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New Fridges run 460 to 525 KW a year (~50kw/month), almost 2/3 of what a 20 year old unit will do.

Cheers

year old unit will do.

Er, you mean kWh, I presume..

--

----------------(from OED Mini-Dictionary)----------------- PUNCTUATION - Apostrophe Incorrect uses: (i) the apostrophe must not be used with a plural where there is no possessive sense, as in ~tea's are served here~; (ii) there is no such word as ~her's, our's, their's, your's~.

Confusions: it's = it is or it has (not 'belonging to it'); correct uses are ~it's here~ (= it is here); ~it's gone~ (= it has gone); but ~the dog wagged its tail~ (no apostrophe).

----------------(For the Apostrophe challenged)---------------- From a fully deputized officer of the Apostrophe Police!

I bought some batteries, but they weren't included, so I had to buy them again.

-- Steven Wright

FOR SALE: Nice parachute: never opened - used once.

(Problem) Evidence of leak on right main landing gear (Solution) Evidence removed

F o d d e r

f o r

s t u p i d " n o t

e n o u g h

i n c l d u d e d

t e x t " e r r o r

m s g .

I've found a significant saving can also be to add a tiny AC fan across the fridge motor, if it's not very well ventilated, to keep hot air from pooling.

Also, a couple of inches of insulation foam on each side of the fridge can cut its energy use significantly.

--
http://inquisitor.i.am/    |  mailto:inquisitor@i.am |             Ian Stirling.
---------------------------+-------------------------+--------------------------
Things a surgeon should never say:
Better save that for the autopsy.

Just don't do this on freezers that have the condensor coils buried in the sides of the unit.

I did that with a small fridge I used for beer. Wired a receptacle to come on when the compressor did and used cheap 6" desk fans to cool coils.

I have a hotpoint (will never buy another) the coils are under the unit. A fan draws air across them from floor level (and every bit of dust it can suck in) and deposits the dust on the coils. Most of the heated air is ejected from the front adjacent to where it sucks it in, passing the drip tray on the way.

Cleaning coils is a matter of shutting it off, pushing bottles towards the back of the shelves, pulling the refer forward and tipping it back at a 45 degree angle then getting down there with a brush, damp rags, vacuum cleaner, and air compressor. My girlfriend has an Amana with the coils just under the outside skin, lot of surface area, no way for dust to clog them up. Seems like the way to do it to me.

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Some refrigerators use their sides as the heat emitting surface. In that case the efficiency would drop precipitously & damage may occur. Easy to check for, anyway. If the sides are warm during normal operation, don't insulate them!!!

Cheers, John Stewart

Stirling.

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