xilinx pricing discrepancy

FX12 in 100k is defenetly not 112USD the 29.99 for FX12 sure sounds like really nice price..

try direct contacts for 100k volumes you must get better pricing for sure unless you are asking for largest package fastest speed industrial temperature..

the advertized pricing is always the lowest price for given part smallest pack, slowest speed, commercial temp, etc

Antti

Headline pricing often has a date sometime in the future against it. There are also price variations against package. The headline price will also usually be done on the cheapest package and speed grade. I'm guessing that you are using the FF668 package by the prices you have.

What you need to do is to talk to your FAE who may be either at distributor level or if you are a big account it will likely be Xilinx or the country rep. Depends where you are and who you are. Alternativly some Xilinx partners like ourselves, or even large assembler operations, can be used as negotiators of price as we know reasonably well how to drive the system and what can be attained in a project with a tight budget.

John Adair Enterpoint Ltd. - Home of Raggedstone1. The Low Cost Spartan-3 Development Board.

Is it possible to get Xilinx to just tell me what the cheapest V4FX device is possible for 100k units? The device also has to be easy path compatible as the eventual product is going to be very price sensitive.

Thanks, Clark

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You really need to get a FAE involved and to check both the Easypath availability and the charges and NRE for using those parts too. The 100K volume market is for Xilinx, and all the other vendors for that matter, a market that they are seriously interested in. My educated guess is that the SF363 will be the package that is cheapest but there will be other considerations such as board layout that you should consider on this package at the same time. I also don't know Easypath status for that package so that needs to be checked.

John Adair Enterpoint Ltd. - Home of Broaddown2. The Ultimate Spartan3 Development Board.

I agree with John, you need to talk with a Xilinx FAE/Sales Manager and they will be able to address your pricing concerns. BTW, the lowest cost V4FX will be the FX12 that you have selected with some modifiers due to package (small) and speed grade (medium).

If you are having problems getting through to someone from Xilinx, drop me an email and I'll get it taking care of.

Ed McGettigan

-- Xilinx Inc.

This question arises from time to time; here's my take:

Bob Perlman Cambrian Design Works

On the otherhand there are strong truth in advertising laws in many states, including Calif. So if they quote the price and product, one can issue a PO based on those terms and start designing, targeting that delivery date. So it might not be a dream price after all.

The DA where I used to live in Calif yanked advertising privs from a company for a year that was doing bait and switch that way after a few complaints. A lot harder to stay in business with only walk in traffic and poor word of mouth reputaion.

Ed McGettigan wrote

In the far off days of the XC3000, Peter wrote that the uplift was around

10% per speed grade and 10% per package size (if memory serves.) You could start negotiating from these figures, though who knows whether they still apply - we aren't in the 68-pin/84-pin world any more ;-)

John Adair schrieb:

But they keep publishing the press release on the website, that's enough for legal action:

Apparently:

1. An FX20 did cost 50$ in 25k quantities in december 2005
2. Xilinx has been shipping 10gbps MGTs as early as June 2005.

Now, my FAE tells me that there never have been any Virtex-4 with 10gpbs MGTs. So Xilinx should really modify that web page.

Kolja Sulimma

You have a touching notion of how widely these laws extend (if they exist at all). The general rule is "caveat emptor" and, in general, no contract is made until a clear offer has been both made and accepted.

Instead of playing amateur lawyers, engineers should look to practical means to keep component costs under control. Suppliers are dismayed most (and hence most flexible) when they know you have other options. This is the best reason to keep proprietary aspects of your design to a minimum.

Howdy Kolja,

While the page is "on the web", I wouldn't call it an active page - you are looking at a historical document (clearly dated June 2005) about the current state (as of June 2005) and a future predicted price (as of June 2005). I think it would difficult to find any evidence that they are still making those claims, although I suppose you could argue that since there is no newer *published* information, by default one would easily assume that to still be accurate.

Note that I'm not defending these nearly useless press releases, which are purely a marketing ploy to get an absurdly low price in the minds of engineers, 99% of whom will never be able to get anywhere close to that quantity (and therefore, that price).

It depends on what he means by "never" :-) They were never shipped as generally available product to any customer that wanted them (lots of us wanted them, and still do!). But I assume that Xilinx had 10 Gbps prototypes working, and even shipped some of those prototypes to customers as early as June 2005. None of these statements, however, mention anything about general availablity or being in full production. They could have shipped just a few parts to a few alpha customers and that would have fulfilled the statements made. Unfortunately, these types of press releases are all too common in the technology world (actually this one isn't as bad as some, where press releases are put out for products that aren't even designed yet).

Again, in this particuar case, it's a press release, which is historical documentation of a public statement. You can't go back and change them - the best you could do would be to put a notice at the top saying that it had been superceeded by something else, or remove it completely.

Have fun,

Marc

This newsgroup is not the substitute for a request for quote sent to the appropriate sales channel. That sales channel would also have told you that the V4FX12 is too small to be a candidate for EasyPath. There are proper ways to get this information, without abusing the newsgroup, where you started a rambling discussion, without ever revealing your Anonymous identity, or even the details of your request or complaint. Most of us have better things to do than engage in these wide ranging speculations. Peter Alfke

(a) It wasn't anonymous I said my name was Clark. I assume fpga_toys is his christian name? Did you need a home address? (b) I think the article I linked to did specify the device details.

No controversy was intended. I see an ad that says $29.99 for fx12 in quantity 50K. I get an answer back from my purchasing department that says about $112 for quantity 100K. I'm merely trying to figure out what the disconnect is.

-Clark

Hi, Clark The difference between the two prices is very large, as you correctly stated. But you never provided details for the device you want, obviously not the simplest and cheapest.: What speed grade, what package, what temperature grade? These factors can each raise the price. But I still think the $112 quote looks like an attempt not to bid for your business. BTW, no EasyPath for a device this small. In order to achieve a lower price, the device must be bigger, so that Xilinx has a way to save cost through higher yield and shorter test time. For small devices, that saving is insignificant (for large die the saving is substantial).

Peter Alfke

Thanks. I've actually turned it around on them and asked them to tell me what the cheapest FX device they can give me in 100K quantity. We'll see what they come back with.

-Clark