How to get lowest price for a ModelSim license?

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Hi,
We want to buy a ModelSim license.

1. Buy Xilinx-ModelSim version license from Xilinx website shop for
$1150 with dongle and 1 year expiration limit;

2. Buy ModelSim PE version from one of agents we contact: $3K for
perpatual license.

Both versions will work and make no differences to our applications.

Does anyone knows a better way to buy a ModelSim license with lowest
price except the above two options? For a start-up, we prefer lowest
price, of course.

Thank you.

Weng


Re: How to get lowest price for a ModelSim license?
you can try lattice semi for a fraction of cost, only restriction is
you have to use their FPGA, but not bad at all.

Weng Tianxiang wrote:
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Re: How to get lowest price for a ModelSim license?
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ModelSim is included with shipments of Lattice's ispLEVER base
software, which you can purchase (Windows part number:
LS-HDL-BASE-PC-N) from the Lattice online store for $495 at
http://www.latticesemi.com/store/software.cfm

Regards,
Bart Borosky, Lattice


Re: How to get lowest price for a ModelSim license?

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if you use verilog I suggest you to try icarus verilog
:http://www.icarus.com/eda/verilog .
and the wave viewer you can use wave 1.0 : www.iss-us.com
I think they are quite good.
They are free and in my opinion they are veru good.

Francesco


Re: How to get lowest price for a ModelSim license?

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I wanted to use Icarus but I was confronted to a big problem (as a user
of Xilinx): in the simlation libraries there are specify blocs and
Icarus verilog doesn't support them and there are no shoft term plans
to support them. Great was my deception (as open source enthusiast) but
now I'm obliged to use a commercial simulator.

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I used gtk-wave for that.

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Re: How to get lowest price for a ModelSim license?

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There was a bug in the unisim libraries at one point which make ghdl
(rightfully) choke: an element of an enum had the same name as a
variable or a type IIRC. Maybe that is your problem?

Cheers,
  Colin

Re: How to get lowest price for a ModelSim license?

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I'm talking about icarus verilog ... not about ghdl!!!
Cheers


Re: How to get lowest price for a ModelSim license?
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GaLaKtIkUs™ wrote:

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It doesn't matter. The specify blocks are ignored and simulation
works just fine. You will not be able to do back-annotated post-
par timing simulations, but functional simulations work just fine.

I (and my day job co-workers) use Icarus Verilog for Xilinx work
all the time.

- --
Steve Williams                "The woods are lovely, dark and deep.
steve at icarus.com           But I have promises to keep,
http://www.icarus.com and lines to code before I sleep,
http://www.picturel.com And lines to code before I sleep."
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Re: How to get lowest price for a ModelSim license?
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  Interesting - can you give some comments on the relative speed /
reliability /size of the present Icarus release ?

-jg


Re: How to get lowest price for a ModelSim license?
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Jim Granville wrote:
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I can say with certainty that a licensed Modelsim simulator is
faster. Others will be able to say how much faster. I do image
processing in a 1/3 full XC2V3000 w/ SDRAMS, and I can simulate
plausible jobs. Sometimes I even do simulations on my 1.3GHz
Powerbook G4:-)

Now when you say "present Icarus release", there are the current
snapshots and there is the v0.8 stable branch. The stable branch
is a little faster in some cases, but is not as complete in others.
The stable release is "stable", but the snapshots are getting the
bug fixes and new features.

- --
Steve Williams                "The woods are lovely, dark and deep.
steve at icarus.com           But I have promises to keep,
http://www.icarus.com and lines to code before I sleep,
http://www.picturel.com And lines to code before I sleep."
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Re: How to get lowest price for a ModelSim license?

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Could you write your own code
and not use the libraries?

  -- Mike Treseler

Re: How to get lowest price for a ModelSim license?
Rewrite the whole libraries, which model Xilinx primitives for all
Xilinx FPGA/CPLD families and all speed grades?
:-S


Mike Treseler wrote:
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Re: How to get lowest price for a ModelSim license?
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No.
Leave the primitives to synthesis.
Leave the timing to STA.

    -- Mike Treseler


Re: How to get lowest price for a ModelSim license?

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STA?

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Re: How to get lowest price for a ModelSim license?
Static Timing Analysis.

It's nearly impossible to prove that a design will work with
simulation.  Static Timing Analysis is a simulation-less proof
mechanism.  The tool uses clock periods and setup and hold times and
propagation delays of the hardware to prove it a design will meet a
specified timing.

A digital design flow should go basically like this:
12E% Specify and make list of features.
22E% Implement RTL.
32E% Write functional simulations to test features exhaustively.
42E% Test features.
52E% Write design constraints.
62E% Synthesize.
72E% Run Static Timing.
82E% Do timing fixes if necessary, go back to step 4.
92E% Tape out or do whatever you need to do with your complete design.

The point is you should never need to run timing sims.  That said, I've
never worked on a chip that didn't need them.  All I can say is that
you almost can't guarantee a circuit to be working through timing gate
sims.

-Arlen
GaLaKtIkUs99% wrote:
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Re: How to get lowest price for a ModelSim license?
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Why not just rewrite the ones you need, instead of ALL of them?


Re: How to get lowest price for a ModelSim license?
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Ugh! There is no need for that. As I said already on this thread,
Icarus Verilog will (should) parse and ignore specify blocks and
the end result is a perfectly good simulation. All you miss in this
context is back-annotation support.

Any other problems simulating with Xilinx models should be posted
in the bug tracking database. I *will* fix such bugs, because I
do Xilinx work with Icarus Verilog regularly.

--
Steve Williams                "The woods are lovely, dark and deep.
steve at icarus.com           But I have promises to keep,
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Re: How to get lowest price for a ModelSim license?
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Hi Weng,
I guess from 'start-up' you are talking commercial use. If, however, you
are an academic user, you might want to talk to europractice.

http://www.msc.rl.ac.uk/europractice /

Andy

Re: How to get lowest price for a ModelSim license?

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Quartus FIXEDPC $2k license covers windows modelsim
for vhdl or verilog.
One year limit only applies to updates -- tools keep working.
 From distributors only.

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Quartus FLOATLNX $3k license covers linux modelsim
for vhdl or verilog.
One year limit only applies to updates -- tools keep working.
 From distributors only.

   -- Mike Treseler


Re: How to get lowest price for a ModelSim license?
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Are you sure about that Mike, I thought they changed the licencing
model a while ago so Modelsim only works for 18 months now.


Nial.



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