Ulf, what of these new AVRs? :)

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The other week I was downloading the ATmega128 datasheet to check
something and I noticed the mega640/1280/1281/2560/2561.

Any idea when these are going to be available? Digi-Key shows the 2560
and 2561 but zero stock; the others don't show up at all.

Are the 128K flash variants going to be cheaper than the ATmega128L?


Re: Ulf, what of these new AVRs? :)

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They are called vapourware. They are available when
they are available. Whatever this means.

Rene

Re: Ulf, what of these new AVRs? :)
Hello Rene,

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You mean testing market interest without having any product? That would
be a recipe to alienate the customer base. With TI's MSP430 at least
they usually have samples when they post the specs. Sometimes even
before the specs are complete.

Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com

Re: Ulf, what of these new AVRs? :)


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Pity, because the 256 price is approx. the price of the old mega128L -
which makes me hope strongly that the 1280/1281 will be cheaper.


Re: Ulf, what of these new AVRs? :)
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  You can both be right :)

When they are (eventually) released, you can expect them to be cheaper.

  Higher code sized AVRs are also under price pressure from the many
ARMs.

  -jg


Re: Ulf, what of these new AVRs? :)


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I was looking at this very issue the other week for a project that is
currently in a mega128 at 8MHz. I need more CPU horsepower, and more
RAM would be very helpful; I was going to just zip up to 16MHz but
looked around for other options. I'm currently paying this:

ATMEGA128-16AI 128K flash/4K RAM/4K EEPROM/48 IO/10ADC/16MHz
$15.05 qty 1
$8.75 qty 100

I can buy:
AT91SAM7S256-AU-001 256K flash/64K RAM/32 IO/55MHz
$12.04 qty 1
$7.28 qty 100

or
LPC2129FBD64-S 256K flash/16K RAM/46 IO/10ADC/60MHz
$10.68 qty 1
$8.52 qty 100

The cost difference at the qty 100 price is almost all eaten by the
need to buy external EEPROM or ADCs, plus the different code density
means I don't get 2x advantage out of the 256K flash.


Re: Ulf, what of these new AVRs? :)
larwe escreveu:
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why not the LPC213x? for the specs you gave they're cheaper....
Or the TMS470?

Re: Ulf, what of these new AVRs? :)
larwe escreveu:
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Are you using that much FLASH for data or code?
If it's for data (const tables, strings and so on...), maybe you could
use something like an LPC2103 + M25P40 or something similar...

Re: Ulf, what of these new AVRs? :)


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It's code. Ideally I'd like 256+K of flash, at least 6 slow A/Ds, 16K
of RAM and hardware SPI and I2C (both usable simultaneously, not muxed
onto the same pins).


Re: Ulf, what of these new AVRs? :)
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How about the LPC2146 ? - Shows at Digikey $10.68 1+, and it has
256KF / 40K (!) RAM, Dual i2c, Dual SPI, Dual UART, 16 ADC, 1 DAC and
you can just pretend it does not have the USB block :)
[Tho I'm sure you can find _some_ use for it, even if it is just product
testing or debug...]
-jg



Re: Ulf, what of these new AVRs? :)
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You should be able to order samples of the ATmega2561 though...

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The AT91SAM7S128/256 will do all of this (64 kB of RAM).
The SPI is running at the same clock as the CPU up to 30 Mhz or so.
If you are code size limited, and thus want to run in Thumb Mode you are
faster than the LPC.
2 clocks flash access vs 3 clock access in non-sequential fetch and random
data accesss
Both support 1 clock cycle in sequential fetch.



--
Best Regards,
Ulf Samuelsson
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Re: Ulf, what of these new AVRs? :)


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Yeah, right. I never heard of anyone in anything less than a Fortune 50
company getting samples out of Atmel. You can order until your fingers
are worn to the bone, but you won't get so much as an email.

You're correct that _I_ could go to my day job and call the Atmel rep
and say "I've got a personal project that could use a few samples".
However I don't mix business and pleasure like that - I keep my
personal fun projects at a very distant arm's length from my employer.

The average small person has more chance of being elected President
than of getting a single ATtiny11 sample.


Re: Ulf, what of these new AVRs? :)
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Can't comment for Atmel U.S. but I order samples to customers frequently.
I don't worry too much if it is a homebrew or Fortune 50.
The Atmel sample system seems to work much much better now than 15 months
ago
so if your experience is from that time, then you might want to retry it.

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I think I read somewhere cost George Bush $100M to get reelected.
I am sure that just a couple of M$ would get you a tiny11 sample.


--
Best Regards,
Ulf Samuelsson
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Re: Ulf, what of these new AVRs? :)
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I have found that business users have no problem getting samples. As you
say you could call from work and get a sample.

Why would Atmel (or anyone ) supply free chips to home users?  You can
buy them through Maplin etc

Just because you won't use your work address to get a sample (like
everyone else does) don't complain that the rest of the world will not
change the system just for you.

Samples are there to generate business not to save money for hobby
people.

--
\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\
\/\/\/\/\ Chris Hills  Staffs  England     /\/\/\/\/
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Re: Ulf, what of these new AVRs? :)

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I wasn't "working from home."  It was serious business.  But Ulf does
say that there were systemic problems, then.

Jon

Re: Ulf, what of these new AVRs? :)


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I wasn't asking for "free chips to a home user". It was a contract job.
I was trying to decide which part to design in for a client's project
with an estimated production volume of ~1500 per year and a production
life of 3 years. Not an enormous volume, to be sure, but not a hobby
project either. And those volumes were disclosed on the sample request
form.

When I want chips to play with for my own projects, I pay for them;
stop leaping to conclusions.

As a side note, I will point out that Freescale, Microchip, TI and
Analog Devices at least have been very generous with samples on parts
considerably more expensive than the micros in question, even when my
sample request is clearly labeled as a hobby project.

I don't want to talk to the reps at my day job about hobby projects
because I don't want to create a possibility of being accused of any
kind of conflict of interest when designing in parts. Work stuff is
work stuff, out-of-hours stuff is out-of-hours stuff. I find it hard to
believe that nobody else follows the same principle.


Re: Ulf, what of these new AVRs? :)

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I was pretty sure this would be your case, started to say so, and then
decided to let you speak for yourself on it.

My quantities were noted as between 2000-5000/yr, so in your ballpark.
We had an existing project we were converting that was already selling
at 5000/yr so the numbers were 'strong.'

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I looked back and can see the text you wrote that _might_ have led
Chris to assume otherwise -- though I have to admit that having read
it I didn't make that same assumption about you and don't know why he
chose to.

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Indeed.  I also had some Analog Devices chips shipped in packaging
designed to keep humidity out that was probably way more expensive
than the chips themselves, too.  It was surprising to see so much care
just in packing them.  Never have I had the kind of grilling I got
from Atmel, though.

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I don't talk to reps about my hobby projects, at all.  Period.  I talk
to friends, read, use my own experiences, etc.

Jon

Re: Ulf, what of these new AVRs? :)
Sorry about late answer but the NEWS provider I use can suddenly
enter a mode where it refuses to accept posting.

There has been very limited engineering samples of the new mega128x/256x
during 2005 while the parts have been debugged.
I think about 80% of the parts I got went to distribution customers.
There are still a number of people waiting for samples.

I am holding my thumbs for february when rev E is out.
If everything works out OK, there should be plenty of samples by then.
ATmega1280/1s should also go into general sampling by then but production is
later.



--
Best Regards,
Ulf Samuelsson
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Re: Ulf, what of these new AVRs? :)
On 14/01/2006 the venerable Ulf Samuelsson etched in runes:

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Ulf, please tell me where in the UK. I requested samples of ATmega2561 from G D
Technik in June
last year and there's still no sign of them.

.
.
.


--
John B

Re: Ulf, what of these new AVRs? :)
On Sat, 14 Jan 2006 14:06:03 +0100, "Ulf Samuelsson"

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See:
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.arch.embedded/browse_thread/thread/ccaa0d693e88256f/4cb66603ea73c24f?hl=en#4cb66603ea73c24f

Do engineers have long memories?  Yes.

--- Posted in January, 2005:

Some time ago, in a case of regarding Atmel samples when I was wanting
to evaluate their use, I actually ordered two samples from Atmel of a
new part through my local distributor.  In this case, I explained our
estimated volumes and general application area to both the distributor
as well as to our local Atmel FAE, directly.  I had already read that
Atmel (on their site) was nearly ready for sampling on the
AT91FR40162-66CI, so although I expected some delay I didn't expect
the 10 months I experienced.  My request letter went to All American
in late February, that year.  The response from Atmel (looking up my
email now to refresh my memory), a few weeks later, said,

   "Atmel's AT91FR40162-66CI will be available as samples
    sometime in April or May."

In April, I was told by my distributor,

   "Atmel came back on the AT91FR40162-66CI and advised that
    samples would be available sometime in May."

On the phone, in late May, I was told that it wouldn't be until late
July.  And then in June, I was told in writing,

   "I was advised this morning that the production schedule
    slipped and the samples will not be available around the
    24th of July."

July became August, August became September, and then in late
September, I spoke again with the FAE after some phone calls on my
part in early September.  This time, the FAE started grilling me even
more on our application details and wanting to know "numbers" and how
"certain" I could be of them.  More, he was now also asking if I
really needed them before November.

By this time, I have to admit I wasn't really caring nearly as much.
We were near the end of September and I had pretty much set the
possible use of their chip aside.  It was still remotely possible we
could use it for a different project, though, so I told him that I'd
prefer it before November and disclosed my frustrations up to this
point in time.

Keep in mind that I *had* disclosed to them an expected annual
purchase, early on, of about 5000/yr.  This was a pretty accurate
figure, since we were already shipping those quantities for a version
we were replacing.

I finally received the two parts in December, shortly before
Christmas.

Needless to say, I've not specified any Atmel parts and I'm not
planning to.

---

Jon

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