Is the Raspberry Pi real at that price? - Page 2

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Re: Is the Raspberry Pi real at that price?
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I reject the argument that you will not be able to provide any
functionality because parts of the SOC hardware are not open.  They
provide drivers for them, they just don't release the source for the
drivers.  I don't get source for Windows either and yet I can write
all the code I want for my app.

This has been bashed about in the rPi and other forums quite a bit and
no one has been able to show significant limitations that using a
closed source GPU driver provides.

I doubt I will bother with the rPi.  I'm more of a hardware guy and
the rPi doesn't provide much opportunity for that compared to the
BeagleBone.  They don't recommend that the BB be used for "commercial"
designs, but it is much better suited than the rPi, mostly for
mechanical reasons.  How the deuce do you mount the rPi in a box?  No
mounting holes, all edges have components overhanging... I guess you
could use hot glue!

Rick

Re: Is the Raspberry Pi real at that price?

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3-D printer fans -- this is their bread and butter.  At least one is going
to wind up clamping the board between two halves of a clamshell case, with a
post or two to keep it from sliding around.

As a single system, BeagleBone is a more convenient package.  I see the rPi
price point enabling scaling like nothing else.  A couple of kids with part-
time jobs or (more likely) doting grandparents could put together a 20-host
Bluetooth mesh with money they already have.


    Mel.

Re: Is the Raspberry Pi real at that price?
 > You can argue this point until you are blue in the face. None of what
 > you are talking about will have any real impact on the sales or
 > utility of the rPi for its stated purpose. As a teaching tool I would
 > not expect it to be without some sort of trade offs.

 > In this context, I don't care about the issues of FOSS, this project
 > is not about FOSS, it is about the rPi which happens to make some use
 > of FOSS. It does not live an die by FOSS.

That's also /exactly/ what was said back just before the OLPC project
tanked, after years of hyping-to and rallying-up the FOSS community to
get behind it...

--
Chris

Re: Is the Raspberry Pi real at that price?
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Didn't you see the word "die" in my statement?  Do you really think
that the death of OLPC solely depended on FOSS?  Yeah, right.

I suppose the financial crisis was because of not using FOSS in our
banking system too?

Rick

Re: Is the Raspberry Pi real at that price?

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The crisis did come about because of "financial products" that were
completely intransparant. It is not software but the mechanism of not
really knowing what is going on (apart from a small group that did and
made huge money from it) is indeed quite comparable.

Rene

Re: Is the Raspberry Pi real at that price?

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Huh?  Is it possible to do _anything_ that isn't completely trivial
without using a closed single-sourced chip?  I've been doing
microcontroller based products for 30 years, and all the major ICs
have always been closed and single-sourced.  There simply aren't any
open, multi-sourced chips with any significant functionality.

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--
Grant Edwards               grant.b.edwards        Yow! FROZEN ENTREES may
                                  at               be flung by members of
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Re: Is the Raspberry Pi real at that price?
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Wow, you managed all that, without a single device data sheet ?!

You rather missed the point, which is a complete LACK of information.
That is what closed means.

I am sure you had information on ALL those parts you had to use, and heck,
probably even an errata sheet to two... ?

Re: Is the Raspberry Pi real at that price?
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You're right.  I completely misunderstood what you meant by the word
"closed".  I understood it to mean you didn't have access to the
"source" for the part (masks, Verilog source, schematics, etc.).

--
Grant Edwards               grant.b.edwards        Yow! This PORCUPINE knows
                                  at               his ZIPCODE ... And he has
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Re: Is the Raspberry Pi real at that price?
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That is the misinformation.  Broadcom IS providing info on the
peripheral I/O which is what you want from them.  The ARM is the same
as everyone else's ARM.... because it's an ARM.

Don't blow the issue out of proportion.  I bet the rPi gets a lot of
use and a lot of cool stuff will be developed with it just because it
is so cheap and everything other than the GPU is open.

Rick

Re: Is the Raspberry Pi real at that price?
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probably even an errata sheet to two... ?
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hello Rick,

I took a quick look at the "documentation" from Broadcom and it was a
joke. 120 pages for a device of that complexity ! It's not just the GPU
that is not described there was nothing about Ethernet. Things may
change but I doubt it - Broadcom have a weird attitude to small customers.

This thing is a very poor choice for a learning platform in the sense it
has been touted (ie as a modern take on the ZX Spectrum etc.). All the
talk I hear about it is as a Linux platform or a media centre etc.

I can't see Farnell and RS saving its bacon either - if (as it seems)
the RP people can't manage production then they needed a manufacturing
partner but Farnell and RS are distributors with no mass production
experience.

Any one remember the Nascom 2 computer .........


Michael Kellett


Re: Is the Raspberry Pi real at that price?
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Farnell and RS are not manufacturing partners - they are a way to handle
sales and distribution.  As Raspberry began to realise the level of
demand for these boards, they realised they could not distribute them
themselves - at least not at this stage.  So they got Farnell and RS to
help them.  And the demand was so high it brought Farnell and RS's
websites to a standstill.

They don't need someone like Farnell and RS to help with manufacturing.
  I don't know who is doing it at the moment - some company in the far
east, as they failed to find a more local company that could manage the
numbers within a short time.

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Re: Is the Raspberry Pi real at that price?
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From <http://www.raspberrypi.org/archives/723 :
"For those of you just joining us, we have entered into licensed manufacture
partnerships with two British companies, Premier Farnell and RS Components.
They???ll be manufacturing and distributing the devices on our behalf, and
handling the distribution of our first batches as they arrive in the country."

-a

Re: Is the Raspberry Pi real at that price?

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Depends.  If you talk to people like me, you hear about Linux platforms or
media centers.  If you talk to people like this

<https://www.adafruit.com/blog/2012/02/25/adafruit-in-the-new-york-times -
wearable-electronics-are-making-a-statement-nytimes/>

I don't know what you'll hear.

    Mel.


Re: Is the Raspberry Pi real at that price?
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companies, Premier Farnell and RS
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at $25, then how much did it cost
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may be very wrong with this deal?
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selling for more than $35, so their
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Thanks Jim, so the $35 price it is openly advertised at, is the wholesale price,
not the retail price?
Who else advertises like that to the public?

http://au.element14.com/raspberry-pi/raspbrry-pcba/sbc-raspberry-pi-model-b/dp/2081185
I kept getting forced to the local AU site, however with local dollar
conversion, the $38AUD retail becomes $40.77USD

So that is $5.77USD profit. A markup margin of 16.49%.

Perhaps someone can do the sums from a US site.

Cheers Don...

==============================


--
Don McKenzie

Dontronics: http://www.dontronics-shop.com /

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Re: Is the Raspberry Pi real at that price?
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 It's a little loose, but hey, this project is in a state of flux.
The price is still what I'd call good. (but no, it is not $35)

I see this info now on their website :

["They92%ll be manufacturing and distributing the devices on our behalf, an=
d handling the distribution of our first batches as they arrive in the coun=
try. We continue to make a small profit from each Raspberry Pi sold, which =
we92%ll be putting straight back into the charity."]

 I wonder what that means, to their earlier claims/plans to publish the CAD=
 files for Schematic & PCB ?

Re: Is the Raspberry Pi real at that price?
 Don> Thanks Jim, so the $35 price it is openly advertised at, is the
 Don> wholesale price, not the retail price? Who else advertises like
 Don> that to the public?

How about actually bothering to read the RPi website and finding out
what it's about? It's not Yet Another Garage Businessman effort.

--
Chris

Re: Is the Raspberry Pi real at that price?

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   All I found there was a message that the site was down, and to follow
them on Twitter. No thanks.  I have an Arduino Mega 2560 and the TI
Launchpad to keep me busy for now.  Both were under $35.  The Launchpad
was $8 and change, delivered.


--
You can't have a sense of humor, if you have no sense.

Re: Is the Raspberry Pi real at that price?
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I did that Chris, and this is what it says about price:

How much will it cost?
The Model A will cost $25 and the Model B $35, plus local taxes.

==========================================

The text that you quoted of mine above, was brought about by another poster in a
previous message, that suggested this
was the wholesale price, and the dealers would put their margin on top.

I suggested back to the poster that no one advertises at a wholesale price to
the public. I also suggest you read the
message and quote me correctly including the text of the original poster, and
please don't make up a version to suit
yourself.

I am not whining about the device, it looks good, but I am allowed to ask
questions, or are questions banned these days.

Here is the feed back from potential Element14 customers:
http://www.element14.com/community/thread/17002?start=0&tstart=0

and from Raspberry Pi:
http://www.raspberrypi.org/archives/723#comments

You will see that the comments on each group are almost the opposite.

Cheers Don...

========================


--
Don McKenzie

Dontronics: http://www.dontronics-shop.com /

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Re: Is the Raspberry Pi real at that price?
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 > I did that Chris, and this is what it says about price:
 > How much will it cost? The Model A will cost $25 and the Model B $35,
 > plus local taxes.

You missed the part about the RPi Foundation being a non-profit
educationally-motivated effort, hurr.

Which'll trash the rip-off fake-Arduino you're trying to flog in your
latest get-rich-from-home scheme. Go whinge elsewhere.

--
Chris

Re: Is the Raspberry Pi real at that price?

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No I read that Chris.

The Raspberry Pi Foundation is a UK registered charity (Registration Number
1129409)

Who controls Rasperry Pi?
Who controls Rasperry Pi foundation?
Who controls the CPU chip manufacturer?

Answer: Broadcom

That is the way I read it Chris. Please tell me if I am wrong.

Cheers Don...

====================

--
Don McKenzie

Dontronics: http://www.dontronics-shop.com /

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