How workable is Vista?

I have been looking to buy a new computer for a bit and I had just about decided on a Windows XP based system from Dell. Today I called them and found that not only are they not going to sell XP machines after tomorrow, but the orders are flooding in! It seems pretty crazy to me that if XP is still that popular, they would stop selling it. Is this something mandated by MicroSoft?

So the question is, is Vista ready for prime time? I have heard nothing but bad about it and I know that a lot of software vendors have yet to support it... at least the last time I looked. Are the rumors true of Vista being a PITA or just plain incompatible? Is it time to switch to Linux?

What experiences have people had with Vista?

Rick

Reply to
rickman
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Vista is OK performance wise but it is incompatible with older programs like Visual C++ 6.0.

You do need at least 2 GB of RAM for decent performance.

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Reply to
EventHelix.com

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Quote: "After June 18th you have the option to purchase Windows Vista Business or Windows Vista Ultimate with a downgrade service to Windows XP Professional."

So it seems not all is lost.

I don't have any because I opted not to use Vista. Heard and read about too many incompatibilities WRT legacy software, DOS full-screen and such. Also, I've heard of people who bought a stash of XP licenses just in case.

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Regards, Joerg

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Reply to
Joerg

I do a bit of "computer doctor" on the side for extra dosh. I hate hate hate hate hate hate when I'm presented with a Vista machine. It's an absolute hog of an operating system, ridiculously slow and full of all sorts of "features" that hinder your every attempt to productively use a computer. A lot of applications that worked perfectly with XP simply won't work with Vista, even simple applications like Collins English Dictionary. Plus it's slow, real slow. Plus Control Panel has been given a disgusting overhaul so that even the most mentally retarded people can use it, which is detrimental to the power user.

Avoid Vista like the plague. If you can't get XP on the machine, then just get Vista and then do one of the following: 1) Pay extra for the super duper version of Vista, because with the super duper version, Microsoft will give you a free license for Windows XP if you decide to downgrade. 2) If you're "honest": Get normal Vista, then go out and buy XP, wipe the machine and install XP. 3) If you're "dishonest": Get normal Vista, then download the corporate version of XP via bittorrent. The corporate version works with a universal CD key, and works perfectly without restriction.

I got a laptop with Vista on it because the price was right. Two guesses which of the above options I chose.

As for Linux... well at the moment I've got Kubuntu and Backtrack installed. Linux is still a long way away from replacing Windows, and both sadly and frankly, I don't think a free operating system can ever replace a paid-for one. Don't get me wrong, there's bucketloads of fantastic free software out there, OpenVPN for example, but when it comes to a great big operating system, you need to pay the lads.

A friend of mine switched to Mac a couple of years ago and never looked back. He was a power user of Windows, knew his way around the system registry, did some programming with the Win32 API, but he still hasn't looked back even though he had to start from scratch with Mac.

I'd switch to Mac myself but I'm just a bit... eh... set in my ways. I tried to switch to Linux but I jut got pissed off with the bugs and lack of functionality and now I've pretty much given it the boot. There's projects running at the moment where people are trying to get Mac OS to run on normal IBM-compatible machines that normally run Windows. I might give it a go at some stage... but for now I'm more than happy with my heavily customised installation of XP.

Reply to
Tomás Ó hÉilidhe

I think I've said this before - get Ubuntu. Free cd at:

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 [mail]: Chuck F (cbfalconer at maineline dot net) 
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Reply to
CBFalconer

Here's a list that I found:

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That's reason number xx why I don't have Vista. It's pathetic to need so much RAM.

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Regards, Joerg

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Reply to
Joerg

Wait 2-3 years till MS will release several service packs for Vista.

  1. Vista is incompatible with many older softwares, such as VDSP 4.0, for example.
  2. Vista is incompatible with many older drivers, such as dllportio. So forget about the legacy hardware and the JTAG simulation on the parallel port.
  3. Vista is slower then XP regardless of the amount of memory. With all bells and whistles switched off, the speed of the execution is somewhat
30% slower on the dual core machine.

Only if you are enjoying working on computer instead of using a computer for work.

Vista works, however it doesn't offer any advantages over XP.

Vladimir Vassilevsky DSP and Mixed Signal Design Consultant

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Reply to
Vladimir Vassilevsky

Linux makes a fine 2nd OS -- I have one on my "traveling" PC, which gets used for presentations, email, numerical analysis with Scilab, and playing solitaire.

It helps that I do documents on OpenOffice, which works just fine and dandy under Linux.

For everything else, I use XP (and I hope that Microsoft feels pressured into continuing to maintain it; they've withdrawn it from the market twice already to my knowledge, and have been forced to put it back).

Personally, I think that if Microsoft continues to jam Vista down the collective throats of the world you'll see a lot more interest in Linux and in Mackintosh. I doubt that they've gotten quite that stupid yet, though.

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Tim Wescott
Wescott Design Services
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Reply to
Tim Wescott

Not quite.

I recall some legal cases, where Microsoft was forced to sell older OS versions (as a downgrade) to avoid obsoleting perfectly good hardware, and so adding to the global waste pile.

In other words, if you have paid for a newer Microsoft OS, you have a legal right to 'old-grade' (it is NOT really a down-grade:) ) to an equialent OS. You do NOT have to pay Microsoft twice, to get ONE operating system.

That is likely also the legal framework, behind the note Joerg found :

Quote: "After June 18th you have the option to purchase Windows Vista Business or Windows Vista Ultimate with a downgrade (sic) service to Windows XP Professional."

-jg

Reply to
Jim Granville

But that means you have to pay for Vista *and* you have to pay for XP. They call this *Vista Bonus*... talk about a marketing scheme!

I have a problem with paying Microsoft twice for an OS on the same machine. This really is putting me off the whole idea of buying a windows amachine at all. We'll see if it can actually push me over the edge to Linux though.

Rick

Reply to
rickman

No, this is what they call "Vista Bonus" which is the most expensive version. In essence, you are paying for both versions of the OS.

Rick

Reply to
rickman

I would be happy to consider the Mac if it would run the software that I use. But the FGPA vendors don't support it and the PCB layout software I like doesn't run on it... at least I haven't heard that it does. Will the Mac run PC software like Linux does using something like WINE?

Rick

Reply to
rickman

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Reply to
MC

There are several ways:

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*-reduced-CPU-performance+reboot+Windows-license+*-*-*-license-*-*-*-required&strip=1

Reply to
JeffM

... snip ...

See for yourself:

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Reply to
CBFalconer

Sorta. You can dual-boot Intel Macs to Windows - but this puts you back in exactly the same position of needing to acquire a Windows license. You can also use virtualization software like Parallels Desktop, but (a) you still need a Windows license, and (b) my experience at least is that a fair percentage of embedded dev hardware doesn't work in virtualization. Some does, some doesn't, it's very hit or miss. Currently I do about 60% of my work on a MacBook in MacOS; the remainder is split between Linux and WinXP. I was given a free Vista Professional license by Microsoft, but I haven't got a machine that's capable of running it, due to missing drivers. Really, I don't think it's missing drivers, I think it's that none of my machines have graphics cards that support Vista's DRM requirements, but whatever - the installer complains and I haven't bothered to go further and see what happens.

Software vendors are starting to take more notice of MacOS. The usual route is for the Linux version to be rebuilt as an X11 binary for MacOS, since that's not much work. Ugly, but serviceable. The next step is for it to be rebuilt as a native app. EAGLE has taken that route (yay! V5 is MacOS native!)

BTW you haven't yet mentioned the fact that 60% of the drivers for embedded dev hardware are unsigned. Vista 32-bit will not by default allow you to load unsigned drivers (though it is possible to coerce it). Vista 64-bit will not load unsigned drivers, period.

Reply to
larwe

My first-hand experience with Vista is fairly limited - it came with a laptop I have, and I was not impressed. If I had wanted a toy, I'd have bought a playstation.

For each generation of windows, MS have been trying to make the OS easier to use for common tasks. The problem is that it's only *their* definition of common tasks, and it comes at the expense of making less common things harder.

People often say that Linux has a steep learning curve compared to Windows. That's not actually a very accurate picture. It's more correct to think that Windows has a steep learning curve, but fairly low offset - it's easy to get into, but hard to do more advanced stuff. And it's getting steeper all the time. Linux, on the other hand, has a much flatter learning curve, but a higher offset - once you've got the basics, you can get a lot further more easily. And the offset and start curve are getting easier all the time.

This all depends on your use. For an experienced "power user" on windows, it's hard to move to Linux - things don't work as you expect. It takes time to re-learn things. I use XP for my main desktop, because it is what I am most familiar with - but I have kubuntu on a Virtual Box machine for when I need something windows can't provide (such as the occasional application, better networking, or more convenient software installation). I also use kubuntu on my laptop.

For an everyday user of OpenOffice, FireFox and Thunderbird, the change is barely noticeably - my wife and kids have no problems using the kubuntu laptop.

And for server usage, Windows has a very long way to go before it can come close to the power, flexibility, convenience, manageability and value for money of Linux.

Reply to
David Brown

I don't think you are paying for both versions of the OS - you are paying MS for a single OS license, and you are paying Dell for the "downgrade service". At least, that's how I interpret the wording.

You can also think of it as a simple price increase - after all, XP is worth a lot more than Vista.

Reply to
David Brown

Hi,

by chance have you tried the Codewarrior Suite from Freescale with Parallels (and/or Bootcamp)? It's is working? and what about the USBTap and USBtoSerial adapter?

Another thing: some of you is using Altium Designer with a Mac (through Parallels or Bootcamp)?

Thanks

Bye Jack

Reply to
Jack

For small values of "perfectly" where special hardware is involved. The MSP430 Windows USB-JTAG drivers, in particular, cause a kernel panic when you attempt to use such hardware within Parallels or VMWare.

Reply to
larwe

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