FT JOB: Embedded + Windows + FPGA + Los Angeles, CA - Page 2

Do you have a question? Post it now! No Registration Necessary

Translate This Thread From English to

Threaded View
Re: FT JOB: Embedded + Windows + FPGA + Los Angeles, CA

Quoted text here. Click to load it

Don't want to get into it again (brings back bad memories and got to get
work done).  The terms "spamming" is pretty well defined to mean "mass
unsolicited email".  The fact that people modify the term to have it mean
"anything that bothers me" is well and fine, but in legal terms, these
definitions are not supportable.  People have gotten sued for spamming.  It
is a big deal and, aside from the annoyance, it costs the Internet
infrastructure a great deal of money due to the load this junk imposes upon
the systems, not to mention all the other issues.  A message that I may not
like, or that may be innapropriate or contrary to a newsgroup charter is not
spam, it's just something that shouldn't have been posted.

I did quite a bit of research back then, even going as far as corresponding
with some of the "fathers" of the Internet.

Quoted text here. Click to load it
spam.

The problem with that definition is that, while it is very easy to apply to
your personal email account, it does not translate to USENET very well.
Virtually threads started on USENET are unsolicited.  And, "unwanted" is
much more ellusive.  I may not care for a discussion on using 8085's in
embedded systems.  That's an unwanted message for me.  However, it is not
spam.  I know, that example is a stretch, but, you get the idea.

I think that on USNET spam is pretty well defined and we've all seen it.
It's mostly mass marketing of all sorts of things, from illegal software to
drugs.


With regards to job ads, I find a strange dychotomy at play.  Specialized
newsgroups are places where people converge to talk about their field,
learn, grow, help others and generally form a community around their topic
of interest.  Now, presumably, a good deal of these folks are employed in
this field of interest.

However, for some strange reason, in some groups, having someone say "I like
the sort of people who meet here.  I have a job that I'm trying to fill and
this is exactly the sort of person I'm looking for" seems to be regarded as
a serious insult rather than what it is: recognition for the efforts and
quality of the individuals who make the NG what it is.

Now, I understand that signal to noise must be maintained for it all to
work.  And I also understand that postings by head-hunters or agencies can
be problematic because some of these folks will abuse the medium.  On the
other hand, an honest post coming directly from an employer sholdn't be a
problem.  Particularly at a time when jobs are not plentiful.  In my case, I
have two positions to fill.  I don't forsee looking for another engineer for
another year.  So, one or two messages it is and that's it for a year.


--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Martin Euredjian

We've slightly trimmed the long signature. Click to see the full one.
Re: FT JOB: Embedded + Windows + FPGA + Los Angeles, CA

Quoted text here. Click to load it

Er, this is the defination today.  But in the past it was not defined
this way, and it was common to see it used to apply to any sort of
constant background noise (ie, before the days when email spam really
took off).  The term was definately used if the same recruitment add
show up once a day, or if a single recruiter posted multiple separate
listings at once.

--
Darin Johnson
    My shoes are too tight, and I have forgotten how to dance -- Babylon 5

Re: FT JOB: Embedded + Windows + FPGA + Los Angeles, CA
I do understand everyone's position.  But it is a bit like letting the
nose of the camel into the tent.  Where do you draw the line to keep the
camel out?  My concern is not how often you post, but how many like you
might post.  

Also I think it is a bit of a reach to expect 100's or even 1000's to
read the message when it is tied to a geographical location that a very
few of them might be interested in.  

Aren't there newsgroups just for jobs?  I am sure I have seem groups
full of ads for engineers.  What about using Monster or the other job
web sites?  Are they terribly expensive?  


Martin Euredjian wrote:
Quoted text here. Click to load it

--

Rick "rickman" Collins

snipped-for-privacy@XYarius.com
We've slightly trimmed the long signature. Click to see the full one.
Re: FT JOB: Embedded + Windows + FPGA + Los Angeles, CA
Quoted text here. Click to load it

I'm not sure about the effectiveness of the job newsgroups for these
specialize fields.  I've never even lurked at one of them, so I don't know.
Monster and the other services are fine sources of good people.  I'll
probably start checking out a couple of these sites next week.

I see your points.  You are probably right.  It's far to easy to think "it's
only me, one message" when, if everyone in the world looking for people
posted just one ad per month you'd probably be overrun with messages.

In twenty years of being online this is my second try at posting a job ad in
a forum such as this one.  I don't think I'm going to do this ever again.  I
have not had any seriously bad responses, it seems to me that the nature of
some of these usenet groups is that people just want to discuss their topic
and go look for work elsewhere.  I can understand that.  For what it's
worth, I am getting a good deal of response from good people interested in
the job.

Thanks,


--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Martin Euredjian

We've slightly trimmed the long signature. Click to see the full one.
Re: FT JOB: Embedded + Windows + FPGA + Los Angeles, CA
On Wed, 22 Oct 2003 21:14:59 GMT, "Martin Euredjian"

Quoted text here. Click to load it

In professional newsgroups, such problems tend to be self-correcting.
The tolerance of the readers can change, and the de facto standards of
the group along with it. In other words, if a previously accepted
practice starts drawing protracted flaming sessions, it's time to
quit.

What's considered topical and acceptable not only varies between
newsgroups, it can depend on who introduces the topic. In many
newsgroups, a respected regular can go off-topic in a way which would
bring flames and dire threats of excommunication if a newbie did it.

--
Al Balmer
Balmer Consulting
We've slightly trimmed the long signature. Click to see the full one.
Re: FT JOB: Embedded + Windows + FPGA + Los Angeles, CA
Quoted text here. Click to load it

The trouble with the various jobs groups (I have been watching
jobs.ct and jobs.me) is that they are totally jammed with
headhunter parrotings, almost always specifying 10 years
experience in MS .NET or something equally ridiculous.  In many
months I have found only one or two postings to which I responded,
and the result was dead silence.

Quoted text here. Click to load it

I would say the safe method is to participate in the newsgroups of
interest, allowing the users to evaluate you, and vice versa.  You
can limit advertising to the sig line, and I greatly doubt there
will be any objections.  But make sure the location is available.

--
Chuck F ( snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com) ( snipped-for-privacy@worldnet.att.net)
   Available for consulting/temporary embedded and systems.
We've slightly trimmed the long signature. Click to see the full one.
Re: FT JOB: Embedded + Windows + FPGA + Los Angeles, CA

Quoted text here. Click to load it
<snip>

Chuck, I agree.  I have a post on co.jobs right now and I think of the 250
or so current postings I am the only non-hh in the bunch.

I posted a job for an embedded sw position there a year ago and got about a
dozen fairly qualified responses in a couple of days.  I have reposted there
again a week ago and have only one response.

For those interested here is the current post.  I have been watching this
thread and haven't yet decided whether to post here.  Right now my thinking
is yes, so maybe later today or tomorrow...
---------------
We are looking for software engineers with 5+ years experience in Embedded
Software / Firmware Development  using C, C++ and assembly language.
Ability to read and understand schematics and technical device databook
documentation a must.

Safety-critical product development and familiarity with avionics or medical
documentation and test requirements a plus.

Non-smoking environment.  Part time telecommute possible.   Located in
Lafayette, CO.


For all positions forward resume (preferrably in Word format) to
snipped-for-privacy@exotech.com.
Principals only, no agencies, no calls.

www.exotech.com




Re: FT JOB: Embedded + Windows + FPGA + Los Angeles, CA
...snip...
Quoted text here. Click to load it

Doh!  That was the worst thing you could have said... ;)

--

Rick "rickman" Collins

snipped-for-privacy@XYarius.com
We've slightly trimmed the long signature. Click to see the full one.
Re: FT JOB: Embedded + Windows + FPGA + Los Angeles, CA
Quoted text here. Click to load it

This is a fairly unreasonable position, given that the subject clearly
states the geographical area.  Anybody not interested does not have to
read the article.

Back in the bad old days before it was always September on the net, you
had to put geographical limitations on each post, and verify that yes, you
really did mean for this post to go outside your state.


Quoted text here. Click to load it

Head hunters, trolling, generally.  The noise to signal ratio is very
high, even assuming the posters are bright enough to find the right group
(which must happen at least 10% of the time).


--
#include <standard.disclaimer>
 _
Kevin D Quitt  USA 91387-4454         96.37% of all statistics are made up
We've slightly trimmed the long signature. Click to see the full one.
Re: FT JOB: Embedded + Windows + FPGA + Los Angeles, CA
Quoted text here. Click to load it

Ok, correct my post to say "reading the header".  I don't consider
having to ignore a lot of messages a trivial task.  That is why I hate
the SPAM in my mailbox.  It only takes a second to see the header with
gobbledy gook, but that is a second too long.  


Quoted text here. Click to load it

But aren't those the jobs that people are looking for?  Is it better to
have them post here?  

--

Rick "rickman" Collins

snipped-for-privacy@XYarius.com
We've slightly trimmed the long signature. Click to see the full one.
Re: FT JOB: Embedded + Windows + FPGA + Los Angeles, CA
Quoted text here. Click to load it

Not really.  The chances of finding a job posted in the correct group are
vanishingly small.  There's so much crap it's hard to see the good stuff.  I'm
not saying that this is the right place for it, but I don't think the occasional
job post, by the principal, is not out of line.  Besides, it's not a violation
of the charter.


--
 _
Kevin D. Quitt              91387-4454             snipped-for-privacy@Quitt.net
           96.37% of all statistics are made up

Re: FT JOB: Embedded + Windows + FPGA + Los Angeles, CA
Quoted text here. Click to load it
occasional
Quoted text here. Click to load it

But that is the sticky wicket, isn't it?  If it is "occasional" then it
is not a problem.  But if it is encouraged or even tolerated, then it
can get out of hand and overwhelm a group.  I cite the embedded Yahoo
mail list as an example.  That group has more recruiting messages than
engineering related messages.  



--

Rick "rickman" Collins

snipped-for-privacy@XYarius.com
We've slightly trimmed the long signature. Click to see the full one.
Re: FT JOB: Embedded + Windows + FPGA + Los Angeles, CA

Quoted text here. Click to load it


Which amuses me, both when people say "an history" aspirating the h, and
when people admonish you for dropping the h, which is as old as English.
Brought up in Lancashire, where the initial H is de rigeur for the
middle classes, even in words like haspidistra, but taboo for us lower
orders.

Is thread drift a problem in the cotton industry?

Paul Burke



Site Timeline