I need a full development set for a ColdFire 5282 project. Price is secondary to quality, support, flexability.
Software toolchain including IDE, compiler, linker, etc., Evaluation board, JTAG emulator.
I am aware of the Metrowerks Code Warrior, and I presume there is a GNU set (not sure about the 5282). I know this question has shown up before, but my local newsserver doesn't go back that far.
Please supply comments, gripes, recommendations, etc.
Scott
Check out
/jan
Not Really Me schrieb in im Newsbeitrag: eHuub.570$ snipped-for-privacy@news.uswest.net...
set
my
We use the GreenHills compiler. You get C & C++ compilers for your money, including EC++. It generates reasonable code. Has a horrid IDE (especially for the debugger) and support is distinctly hit and miss.
We use WindRiver VisionIce II and VisionProbe II with VisonTrace. They are pretty good tools, apart from having to deal with WR. Support has improved in the last year or so.
We started off with the Macgraigor Wiggler. It was unreliable, overheated, and was generally a pain to use.
We looked at the Noral debugger - it looked pretty good, but our existing GH toolchain didn't generate ELF format (it does now) so we couldn't use it. I believe it had a trace option - can't remember it was 4 years ago - it may not even be in production anymore.
I've heard very good things about Lauterbach Debuggers, saw one demoed at a show this year and was impressed - if price is no object you may want to look at them.
Green Hills debugger is also available. No trace option.
Cheers TW
Take a look at
Paul (I work for NetBurner)
pbreed@THE_COMPANY_I_WORKFOR.com
cheaper than anyone else.
I had a look at your site recently - I have nothing but that information to go on, but it certainly looked like a solid setup, especially if you are looking for only a few boards (in which case the software licence comes with the boards). For very large volume products, it also looks like a good deal. But for small or medium (depending, of course, on how these terms are defined) volume, it is definitely expensive. I have no way of judging the quality of the software or its support, having never used it, and I can quite see how it might fit a "price is secondary to quality, support and flexibilty" buyer. But how do you come up with claims of being significantly cheaper than anyone else? You can get tools (gnu) and software (ucLinux, ecos, rtems) for free. You have to pay for professional support if you want more than newsgroups and email lists, but I doubt that the cost comes close to your price. If you want to claim that your software is so much easier or more reliable than free alternatives, or that your support is so much better, that even small volume customers will end up with cheaper developement, then that's fair enough. I just feel that a blanket claim like yours needs justified if it is to be taken seriously and not just as some marketing line.
set
my
1)Low volume there is no question for $499 you get ready to use hardware and software. No competition. 2)Medium volume our modules are $99.00 in quantities > 100 less for more than 1000 pcs. At 1000 or less pcs you would be hard pressed to actually design, build and test modules for less than $99 if you truely account for your production engineering costs, setup costs, material acquisition costs etc... 3)Higher volumes ucLinux, ecos, rtems etc.... Our site license is $24500 for 1)Known working hardware design. 1a)All hardware design materials. 1b)Design review by NetBurner of any changes you make. 1c)Assistance with production test and bring up code etc... 2)Windows hosted Tools are all built and integrated. Just install from CD. 3)Many ready to use examples. All examples are ready to build run and modify right out of the box. 3a) See:
Average senior embedded systems engineer = $100K/year Costs company about $140 with benifits. This equals: 2.8K / working week.
Fill in your own numbers: 1)Develop working hardware schematic. 2 Wks. 2)Have prototype hardware design built into PCB chase parts etc.. 1 Wk 3)Have boards built and assembled $5K 4)Bring up boards 1Wk 5)Find and organize "Free Tools" 1Wk 6)Build free tool set 1Wk 7)Write and or modify board support package and port tools to your platform.
1Wk 8)Develop device discovery, initial configuration setup, and in the field code update and tools 2 Wk 9)Port Open SSL, CMU SNMP, webserver command parsers etc... 1WkucLinux Code footprint is >1M for anything useful.
Our SSL server with HTTPS, RTOS and 20K of Webcontent is about 130K Saving in flash cost $3.00 per board
Total all of this 10Wks 28K + 5K setup and at 6K parts cost adder. (assuming 2K units per first year)
Your free license now costs 39K. I think my time numbers are reasonable, maybe even optimistic, but even if I am off by 50% (5Wks not 10) then it is a break even.
You will also have to keep and or retain the person that setup all of these tools forever, or loos the ability to develop or modify you environment.
We recently had some experience where a cosultant using our stuff was competing against a consultant pushing uCLinux.
The consultant using our stuff brought a working prototype to the presentation. The uCLinux guy spent the whole presentation on"Linux is free, it won;t cost you anything." The company choose the ucLinuix guy. It is now 4 months later and they have more than $40K spent on the uCLinux guru and still don't even have the basic hardware and development environment running. Its a great deal for the uCLinux consultant because he has written himself a permanant consulting gig, not so good for the company.
Paul
Works for NetBurner. pbreed@THECOMPANY_I_WORK_FOR.com
...
The version of the tools you are using is at least 4 years old. The current version is 4.0. Does the 4.0 version still have a "horrid IDE" in your opinion?
Mike
I didn't know about the medium volume solution you had - I had only noticed the low and high volume prices. You've given a lot of useful information, and a pretty solid justification for the "cheaper than anyone else" claims - I'll keep it in mind when looking at networking in the future.
professional
that
and software.
than 1000 pcs.
etc...
modify right out of the box.
field with only an ethernet connection.
to modify these tools for your own use.
Makefiles linker scripts etc are complete.
platform. 1Wk
code update and tools 2 Wk
(assuming 2K units per first year)
I am off by 50% (5Wks not 10)
these tools forever, or loos the ability
competing against a consultant
presentation.
cost you anything."
have more than $40K spent on the
environment running.
a permanant consulting gig, not so
How on earth do you know what version of GH tools we're using?
We are currently using V3.5 which so far as I know is the latest version of CF compiler - if it isn't then thats another example of the quality of GH support.
The V3.5 IDE is every bit as nasty as the V1.8 one was IMO.
Cheers TW
cheaper than anyone else.
I see something about 14K to 19K Dollars in your weird price-list. Do you call this cheap ?
-- 42Bastian Do not email to bastian42@yahoo.com, it's a spam-only account :-) Use @epost.de instead !
said for all posterity...
1000 pcs.etc...
The problem in my case is that we have to have custom hardware, but our quantities are only about 200-300 units. We can't use your modules because of our hardware design requirements, but the site license ($24,500) is prohibitive for our low-cost product.
Casey
I drive way too fast to worry about cholesterol.
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