ng Handbook are probably more useful in this context, however.
ame composition, 0.9558, or 95.58% ethanol). That is my target.
Even just at 79.8 degrees, less than 2 degrees above 78.15, the ethanol composition has dropped to 83%. So the dessicant step later on has to wo rk that much harder to make that ethanol dry. (Trying to make a fuel her e, not planning to drink it.) As temperature rises to 95.5 degrees, well , you basically just made a single-stage distiller. A beer mix will dist ill at around 95 degrees. It's about 5% ethanol. The vapor will be 34 % ethanol or so, not quite concentrated enough to catch fire with a match.
How do you measure the ethanol fraction? (density?) Seems to me you need to feed that 'signal' back to the thermal control loop.
Say, isn't it legal to distill some of your own hooch in the US? Maybe you need a permit/ license?
ring Handbook are probably more useful in this context, however.
same composition, 0.9558, or 95.58% ethanol). That is my target.
Even just at 79.8 degrees, less than 2 degrees above 78.15, the ethanol composition has dropped to 83%. So the dessicant step later on has to w ork that much harder to make that ethanol dry. (Trying to make a fuel he re, not planning to drink it.) As temperature rises to 95.5 degrees, wel l, you basically just made a single-stage distiller. A beer mix will dis till at around 95 degrees. It's about 5% ethanol. The vapor will be 3
4% ethanol or so, not quite concentrated enough to catch fire with a match.
For now I go by temperature, and whether it passes my "flame test" (put abo ut a mL in a saucer and see if it ignites). Yeah density works too, but I collect so little, maybe 10 mL per half-hour.
Dunno, for the tiny (mL) volumes I'm making.
I saw maggots growing in my fermentation tank. No way I'm drinking that st uff.
Hehe. I think 250 gallons would be enough to keep in storage, I suppose. Might be the best way to go. I could set up an above ground 250 made of food-grade steel and store it there. I just don't like that much ethanol in one (explosive) place. And I'm not sure what products might form over time, inside. (I remember vividly a refrigerator door blowing off the refrigerator in front of my face when just barely being opened, due to a small can of ethyl ether exploding. Afterwards, I learned about what products gradually develop inside and that I shouldn't keep ethyl ether for longer than about 6 months, to be sure about it. Each molecule and storage method leads to different results, of course, but I'm a little uncomfortable about 250 gallons of long-term stored ethyl alcohol. I'd rather distill to need and merely maintain that equipment than store the stuff for the "apocalypse." I also prefer to learn to fish, than to be given fish,1 in such cases.
I'm already aware of methyl alcohol contamination problems, though I'm NOT well aware of how best to deal with it. That's something else I will need to gather up, I suppose. Same with the other alcohol byproducts, such as amyl alcohol. I will have to learn how to both test for and remove them if I ever get started on something like this. I'm dragging my feet because there are so many other pressing issues and I don't really like betting on horrible disasters in my future. I don't mind the learning process, though, which is why I was so interested here. Learning goes into my head, takes up no space, keeps for a long time, doesn't go stale, and can get brought into use when needed. Actual physical stuff costs money, takes up room, can get broken or lost, needs maintenance, etc.... even when it isn't needed or being used.
But my wife may want me to at least "demonstrate" some capability here, someday. I simple chem lab experiment I can do to show that I can get from A to Z, if needed someday. Then I can just drop it and wait until "the apocalypse" happens, if ever. And I will like knowing how, anyway. So I'm not opposed. But you have taught me well just how much is involved even doing just that little bit, so I will be spending more time learning before I go jump off this cliff, for sure.
When I decided to make rocket fuels as a teenager, I spent many many hours studying chemistry manufacturing books on the
5th floor of our local 4yr university's library before taking on ANY of the fuels at home. I never had a single dangerous event take place. And I made mercury fulminate, nitroglycerin, potassium nitrate and sugar glass, used potassium chlorates (still have some), potassium perchlorates (also still have some), picric acid, and you name it almost (gunpowder, of course.) Made lots of fireworks, including exploding rocket flares. Just getting a handle on making the potassium nitrate and sugar melts required careful study, as it needed to be melted at higher than 300C but had a flash point at anywhere above about 400C. To achieve that on my meager budget, I had to discover that H2SO4 boils around the right temperature for my project and to set up a condensing double boiler to avoid "hot spots" that might cause an explosion. But of course I also had to worry about what might happen, anyway, and if I were anywhere near an exploding beaker (I used a florence flask and beaker system) of pure, very hot H2SO4. So I used sand bags to protect me. Worst moment of this experience was having to leave that protection long enough to remove the florence flask (I hadn't figured out an automated way I could afford, then.) I moved quickly, of course.
I will take far less chances now and do far more research first. And I can afford better arrangements, too.
I think I'll enjoy this experience even more, now that I realize just how interesting it really is. It's harder, but much more interesting and educational than I'd imagined before.
Hmm... I'm not sure either. If it's 100% ethanol, airtight, I can't imagine any bugs being able to grow in that...
Ah yes, ether is a special case. Our Organic Chemistry professor warned us that ether forms explosive shock-sensitive peroxides over time. A can of ether at a university lab killed a few medical students, IIRC.
Commendable.
Yeah. Oh, and I was telling my buddies, once Obamacare kicks in there will be a lot of unhappy people, so maybe that's apocalypse enough for ya. (Riots, riot police, possible martial law...)
That's amazing! You could create some jobs here in the USA with that knowledge! (Are you sure you went into the right field? Hahaha)
I did a little informal reading on the web about this question (as regards the US, of course.) So take my tentative conclusions with a huge grain of internet salt. ;)
It appears that federal law trumps state law (from what I gather) and rules over this issue. Because of political pressures, beer and wine makers were able to secure exceptions under federal law for making home brews and wines.
Taxes on beer and wine are low, compared to taxes on distilled liquors, I gather. So it may also be that it was less of a loss for Congress' tax collection revenue stream allowing that, as well, and so easier to secure exceptions. Taxes on distilled liquors produced billions of dollars more tax revenue, I gather, and arguments about the potential harm from methanol and amyl alcohol and lead poisoning (metal parts welded together, etc, assuming that a moonshiner would use cheaper, more readily available materials instead of getting appropriate laboratory equipment and/or teflon and food grade stainless) allowed legislators to justify keeping a strong hold on the tax revenues for hard liquors.
I found nothing yet about port, which is a fortified type of usually blended wines. It may have it's own exemptions (in either direction) on this issue.
What I did find is that if you are a "moonshiner" then you need to secure at least one federal permit and pay taxes on what you produce, even if only for personal use. I would assume that if you sell any of it, that would be at least one more permit, probably more fees, and probably inspections and fees for that and who knows what else (appropriate bribes, etc?)
Basically, if you distill for food purposes, you need a federal permit. I don't know about "fuel purposes," though. Congress appears to have given away huge subsidies for ehthanol production for fuels, while insisting on retaining huge tax revenues for food ethanol distillation. So it's possible the laws are quite different. Or, it is possible that to avoid people making "fuel" which they then drink, that they've done something to close that loop, too. I have come up with nothing on that particular topic (mostly because I didn't dwell on it.)
I also just read that in 2007 the feds collected an excise tax of $2.14 for every 750 ml bottle of 80-proof spirits. This compared with $0.21 for a bottle of wine (of 14% or less ethanol) and $0.05 for a can of beer. To put some numbers to it.
They summarize the situation by saying that it's "impractical" for a home brewer to produce distilled alcohol for personal use because of "excise taxes", "extensive application work", a required "bond" to be posted, owning adequate equipment for required measurements, suitable tanks and pipes, providing a separate building for the purposes (required), detailed record keeping, and regular reporting all required in 27 CFR Part 19.
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They add that "spirits may be produced for non-beverage purposes for fuel use only without payment of tax, but you also must file an application, receive TTB's approval, and follow requirements, such as construction, use, records and reports." I've read elsewhere (Title 27, Part 19, subpart X, section 19.678) that this also requires a bond to be posted, though. Not sure about fees yet.
I did a brief bit of research from ATF last night too, and noticed they cla ssify a Small Plant as 50% ethanol, but when I tried to dry it in a jar of anhydrous magnesium sulfate, to my surprise and horror the MgSO4 absorbed the ethanol as well as the water (liberating quite a bit of heat as it did so), and now it's all a solid mass. In the future I should probably add th e MgSO4 slowly into the ethanol, as we did in organic chemistry class decad es ago.
Ultimately the ethanol is intended to be an intermediate. If I get it anhy drous I can use it to make biodiesel. So that throws another monkey wrench into the works.
I finally found some translations in plain English.
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"To produce alcohol fuel, the only requirement is a simple permit issued by the Alcohol and Tobacco Tax and Trade Bureau. It costs nothing and we know of no one ever being turned down."
That is what I wanted to hear.
This is the site that first inspired me to proceed (they make ethanol from prison scraps):
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and here is the form:
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It is rather odd that on Question 11 they would ask for the capacity. How would I know what the capacity is unless I build it? Oh well. I can make about 10 mL in about half an hour. They want a 24-hour period? 0.1 gallon s it is, then. I would put 0.127 but I fear some nitwit will read that as
127 gallons.
But a FREE form? Didn't think such a thing was possible.
I still think there is a bond required and other requirements. But I guess the form is free. ;)
I remember seeing a "one gallon" capacity threshold being mentioned somewhere in my searches. I think here, under the heading of "Americans":
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They say, "Americans can own a still, but it must be no larger than 1 gallon, and may only be used for water purification or the extraction of essential oils from plants." My purpose is exactly for the extraction of essential oils.
This legal morass is getting complicated to navigate. Cripes.
"Small stills (with a cubic distilling capacity of a gallon or less) that are used for laboratory purposes or for distilling water or other non-alcoholic materials are exempt from our rules."
Not my case since I wouldn't be distilling water and wouldn't be distilling non-alcoholic materials."
"If you buy a small still and use it to distill water or extract essential oils by steam or water extraction methods, you are not subject to TTB requirements."
Not my case, as I'm not distilling water or essential oils by steam or water extraction." I'm using ethanol for the extraction.
"If you produce essential oils by a solvent method and you get alcohol as a by-product of your process, we consider that distilling. Even though you are using and recovering purchased alcohol, you are separating the alcohol from a mixture -distilling."
Which suggests to me that even if I go buy alcohol from a state licensed liquor store, pay all relevant retail taxes for it, and then use it in an extraction process that leaves the alcohol in the byproduct (tincture), then I need a license? Even when there is no distillation going on, at all??? Just the cold temperature use of alcohol for extraction?
Well, um... "A still is defined as apparatus capable of being used to separ ate ethyl alcohol from a mixture that contains alcohol. Small stills (with a cubic distilling capacity of a gallon or less) that are used for laborato ry purposes or for distilling water or other non-alcoholic materials are ex empt from our rules."
No idea what a "cubic distilling capacity" is. Do they mean "volumetric" d istilling capacity? Of one gallon per day? Per year? Or does the distill er occupy one gallon of volume?
Just from reading the above, it sounds to me like a laboratory-sized still, even if used for distilling ethanol, is exempt. That makes sense, if only to keep college chemistry labs from sending applications to the bATF.
Yep. It's a discrete-time model of an RC lowpass filter.
If K is 0.01, then the time constant is 100 times the sample interval. After the first sample, the output jumps to 1% of the input. The second time, it jumps 1%
*of the ramaining difference*, just like a real resistor-capacitor.
--
John Larkin Highland Technology Inc
www.highlandtechnology.com jlarkin at highlandtechnology dot com
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