Towards the *fully* 3D-printed electric cars.

How long does it take to clean after it cooks your evening meal?

Bullshit! Tell that to Hughes Aircraft Company. You're simply clueless.

--
Jim Pennino

So what? They don't need to be cheaper. People literally buy millions of items made out of aluminum and plastic every day and throw them out, the material is so cheap.

Such as? Seriously, you don't think new technologies and concepts are possible? Heck, if nothing else, you can design printers with multiple heads if you want to. Bam, you've nearly doubled printing speed for many items.

And as others in this thread have pointed out, "so what". Load up your materials, load the file, hit print and go to bed.

And yet, the industry is thriving and many people do.

Under $200, I don't think any of my friends are that cheap. The ones I know have opted for more expensive, more capable printers.

So, stop being a kneejerker.

--
Greg D. Moore                   http://greenmountainsoftware.wordpress.com/ 
CEO QuiCR: Quick, Crowdsourced Responses. http://www.quicr.net 
IT Disaster Response -  
https://www.amazon.com/Disaster-Response-Lessons-Learned-Field/dp/1484221834/

Well thanks but I'm having problems parsing extactly what it is you are agreeing with an what you are disagreeing with.

OK, fine, we both agree that the post that started all this was claiming people would be printing everything at home including cars.

OK, what part of I never said 3D printers are "the next thing" nor do I believe that do you have an issue with?

So what is the essential diffence between Damascus steel and 3D printing?

Both take chunks of a base material and fuse the chunks into a bigger object.

--
Jim Pennino

Exactly. Because people who claimed that "no one needs a computer in their homes" was basing the usage model on a very limited viewpoint of how computers were being used. But those "entertainment devices" are at their heart computers.

Which has jacksquat to do with what I said? What do teenagers have to do with my reply?

You keep doing that. I suggest you stop.

--
Greg D. Moore                   http://greenmountainsoftware.wordpress.com/ 
CEO QuiCR: Quick, Crowdsourced Responses. http://www.quicr.net 
IT Disaster Response -  
https://www.amazon.com/Disaster-Response-Lessons-Learned-Field/dp/1484221834/

I seem to recall the promotional videos said it does it's own cleaning. Here's the company web page:

Bob Clark

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Finally, nanotechnology can now fulfill its potential to revolutionize

21st-century technology, from the space elevator, to private, orbital launchers, to 'flying cars'. This crowdfunding campaign is to prove it:

Nanotech: from air to space.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So the raw material for 3D printing is more expensive than the raw material for legacy fabrication methods and my response was to the two sentences above mine. Try reading them before knee jerking.

As I have already said many times accuracy is directly related to layer thickness and layer application delay is directly related to layer "hardening" time.

As I have already said many times such is irrelevant for hobby applications.

The industry for both consumer and industrial 3D printers is tiny and few people do.

The fact that someone you know paid more than $200 for a 3D printer is irrelvant to the fact that such can be had for under $200.

I'm not the one with panties in a wad because 3D printers are not being properly worshipped.

--
Jim Pennino

Irrelevant to the point.

It would be primarily teenagers that would be interested in making essentially useless gadgets and jewelry.

Again, I know about a dozen people that own things like welders, milling machines, drill presses, and lathes but no one that owns a 3D printer.

All of these are middle aged or older adults.

When you stop knee jerking and read what was actually written.

--
Jim Pennino

They can reasonably be expected to become as fast as they need to be for home use. I don't need a replacement knife in 1/10 second; if could have one in five minutes, that'd be fast enough.

I think "the pencil" is pretty much a straw man here. Fabrication technology has already shown it's in the "continually improving" category.

Some technologies are better than others, and not all technologies are realistically constrained by those factors you describe.

"The result is 25 to 100 times faster than conventional printing. It also works with more materials, including the entire polymer family, and at a higher resolution than competitors, which build objects in layers?making CLIP ideal for custom commercial manufacturing. Now Carbon, the company DeSimone co-founded with chemist Ed Samulski, is partnering with BMW, Johnson & Johnson, and others to do just that."

"The BAAM was used to manufacture the first (almost) fully 3D printed car, the Strati, for together with Local Motors. With a deposition rate of up to 38 lbs of material per hour, it is possibly the fastest machine currently on the market."

Not really, it's an operation which people initiate with a few simple actions, but which might take significant time, which most people then leave to complete. Occasional snafus occur; which appears to be something you think is relevant; but people still use printers despite this.

I think the relevance is pretty clear.

Indeed, possibly because they're single use machines, and not very good.

It's fast enough. Nine pages/minute.

So the technology is getting better? Who would have thought.

Their capabilities include quickly and accurately placing varying materials on a

2-D surface which is how some kinds of fabricators work, and they've improved from "feedstock might catch fire" to cheap, fast and reliable.

I think you're making my point.

We're nowhere near those limits yet. "The BAAM was used to manufacture the first (almost) fully 3D printed car, the Strati, for together with Local Motors. With a deposition rate of up to 38 lbs of material per hour, it is possibly the fastest machine currently on the market."

Sales of 400,000 last year, projected sales of 1.2 million this one. Also appears to be non-linear.

But that it's tiny now is irrelevant. How many people had early telephones? Or TV sets?

Actually, no, they don't. What you are describing are later attempts to replicate Damascus steel by pattern welding that did not produce the same stuff at all. No one knows how to make the original Damascus steel.

As far as that goes, that's not what 3D-printing does, either, except at the very extreme that says everything is made that way.

--
"Some people get lost in thought because it's such unfamiliar 
 territory." 
                                      --G. Behn

I've worked on CAE software that's tightly integrated with CAD my entire professional life. Back in about 1988 our CAD/CAE software still ran on mainframes (IBM, DEC, and etc.) but the transition to Unix workstations was in its infancy. Back then, PCs were "toys" that quite simply couldn't handle professional level CAD/CAE software.

In the early 1990s Unix Workstations dominated for running CAD/CAE software. A good SGI "box" would run you about $20k in early 1990s dollars (about $33k today).

Today, you can comfortably run CAD/CAE software (at least the CAE pre/post) on a sub $2k PC running Windows OS. But many customers will go quite a bit over $2k with things like solid state drives and 64 GB or more of RAM coupled with the best professional graphics card money can buy (no, they're not quite the same as consumer/gaming cards). Still, the most "decked out" PC workstation today will still cost a fraction of what a Unix workstation used to cost in the early 1990s.

So again, we see yet another example of improving technologies driving down costs in a market.

Jeff

--
All opinions posted by me on Usenet News are mine, and mine alone.   
These posts do not reflect the opinions of my family, friends,  
employer, or any organization that I am a member of.

Do they have turntables and tube amps becuase of the "warm sound" because CDs are "harsh"? VHS tapes for movies? No? Then do they also have huge collections of CDs and DVDs? HD audio discs and BluRay discs?

These days, I keep most of my media on a 2TB server, and that is considered antiquated by people younger than me who simply use their phones coupled with streaming services to listen to music and watch movies and TV shows. The idea of "owning" music and movies is outdated to quite a few younger people. Why would anyone clutter their house with that crap when the Internet can provide anything you want, anywhere you want, anytime you want.

Technologies improve, costs go down, times change.

Jeff

--
All opinions posted by me on Usenet News are mine, and mine alone.   
These posts do not reflect the opinions of my family, friends,  
employer, or any organization that I am a member of.

No, that's exactly the point and you keep missing it.

As I've said, your experience is not mine.

And same with all the folks I know that own 3D printers.

I'm not the one knee-jerking or making unsubstantiated claims (such as only teenagers buying 3D printers).

--
Greg D. Moore                   http://greenmountainsoftware.wordpress.com/ 
CEO QuiCR: Quick, Crowdsourced Responses. http://www.quicr.net 
IT Disaster Response -  
https://www.amazon.com/Disaster-Response-Lessons-Learned-Field/dp/1484221834/

key to that is the higher level of integration on the PC Chips, more functions were pulled into fewer pieces of silicon. and the maturing of PC software, it was quite unstable, Win 3.1 ? etc... Win XP had good stability, not as good as Unix.

the Telcos ran Unix for decades, very reliable and hated PCs (unreliable)

Unix sort of split into Linux (low cost) and HP UNIX (high end, high cost on high cost hardware) Which slowly ran HP into the ground.

I was offered a mainframe computer with 8 remote stations, (1990's) but I had to haul it from a second story down, and in evaluating it, it had less power than a PC (AT) at the time, and custom software, custom software apps... I turned it down. Big Boat Anchor.

what is the material it is made from? Polyethylene? Milk Bottle Plastic ? crash safety ? leave it out in the hot sun in Aridzona in the summer ??

heads up,

digital storage has *major long term storage problems*, HDs last 5 to 7 years at best, they have many failure modes.

the technology improved, but the reliability went down.

Too easy to lose files now, or erase them.

silicon storage is not mature enough yet, it could last a long time, but many thumb drives get blown out as power comes on or goes off.

CDs are Al foil on plastic, and a drop of ketchup will eat a hole in the AL layer, making the disk usless. (my kid this this) Also, heat, age, UV will all seperate the AL from the plastic, destroying data. Very poor long term stuff, the AL layer also will oxidize on you.

(archival CDs disks have protective layer of plastic on it.)

storing it in the cloud is another problem, read the T+C's they are not responcable for your data, the company can go out of business, no data, or get sold and teh new company sells your files, as you gave them to them, so they own it, you gave that right up, like those photos you uploaded to Facebook, are not yours anymore.

Most 3D materials come in wire spools. So, it is too flexible for any practical purpose, other than just demo prototypes. We might try to feed it with harder plastic, with a custom melter/feeder.

Nope, what we see is yet another example of consumer demand driving down manufacturing costs by encouraging high volume, automated, manufacturing.

--
Jim Pennino