QM defeated, the cat's movement predicted and controlled

QM defeated, the cat's movement predicted and controlled

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Copenhagen is dead.

Reply to
Jan Panteltje
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Astounding. And they managed it experimentally, not just another theory on paper. Superb science, what can one say.

Dimiter

====================================================== Dimiter Popoff, TGI

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Dimiter_Popoff

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Hardly a cat,

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Reading.. over all gain of 10^12! If I'm reading that at all correctly, it seems that it takes some time to make a 'jump' and they can 'see' the in between state. That sorta makes sense in my limited understanding. (They had to pick states where the transition was slow enough to monitor.) pretty cool!

George H.

Reply to
George Herold

On a sunny day (Mon, 3 Jun 2019 13:29:27 -0700 (PDT)) it happened George Herold wrote in :

Ha! Thank for the link to the paper, could not find it last night they wanted 8$ or so from Nature..

Reply to
Jan Panteltje

In a search engine put title of paper in quotes and add arxiv after. George H.

Reply to
George Herold

On a sunny day (Tue, 4 Jun 2019 20:32:18 +0100) it happened "Kevin Aylward" wrote in :

Indeed.

It is very simple to me. electron orbits around an atom. some energy is added electron jumps to next higher orbit.

Electron is all the time locked to 3 microwave signals. JUST before it jumps to the next orbit the microwave detectors see an energy 'dip'. This signals that a 'quantum' (and that is where the word originates, in the interaction of the medium with the electron) jump is about to happen.

100% predictable. Also when they notice this, they can change the energy fed into the system by the microwaves so the 'quantum' jump does not happen. Super simple. Totally classical.

Just a few days earlier I explained here to look at it (the electron) as a ball connected to a pole in the ocean. I stated that EVERYTHING that moves in that ocean causes waves, and the sum of all those waves at the point where the ball is, determines if it will break the wire and is knocked lose.

100% deterministic classical mechanics.

Now ball -> electron, charge, microwaves control ball.

There is a smooth crossover of the electron orbits shown in this experiment, 100% controlled by the applied waves. No 'quantization'. Kids math Where is the problem?

It is a beautiful experiment that (hopefully) once and for all does away with 'you cannot ...' what QM is based on. waves, De Broglie, I like his viewpoint.

In a bigger view, it holds all over the universe, we know that electron 'jump' is controlled by the sum of all waves generated by moving charges all over the universe. Totally classical.

Its late more tomorrow,.

Reply to
Jan Panteltje

If the box isn't perfectly shielded then it's giving away state, and obviously the cat needn't be in a perfect superposition. Copenhagen isn't dead, they're just blasting it with microwaves.

Tim

--
Seven Transistor Labs, LLC 
Electrical Engineering Consultation and Design 
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Reply to
Tim Williams

On a sunny day (Tue, 04 Jun 2019 20:02:22 GMT) it happened Jan Panteltje wrote in :

OK, new day You might then ask: Why the 'dip'

This is simple, here we go with the ball on a wire example again. Now you have a ball with 2 wires, a short - and a long wire connected to a pole you hold. Swing it around your head, outside, start slowly, the ball will move in a circle, but not a perfect circle, it will also move up and down and have other aberrations caused by the wind.

3 dimensional if you will. Swing it faster, then there is a point where it will almost make a perfect circle, 2 dimensional. then increase power, the short wire breaks, and the ball will make a strong 3D movement and you have to re-adjust your swinging rhythm. as now the pendulum's resonance is lower.

The 'wind' is the sum of the waves from all moving charges in the universe at your location. You can now see that just before the transition to the next higher electron orbit (the short wire breaks) the orbit is very much 2 dimensional, the microwave detectors see the dip, alignment of circle to xyz detectors matters, but still there is a 'noise' dip.

Its simple.

Tim, the electron is ALWAYS affected by waves coming from all moving charges in the known universe, that is how radio works. just using locally generated microwaves makes measurement easier.

Simple.

Reply to
Jan Panteltje

snipped-for-privacy@giganews.com:

.electron orbits around an atom.

Still not clear on the points made here at all.

The "jump" in an electron going from from state to another is not the same "quantum jump" referred to in the Schrodinger cat problem. The electron "jump" described here is simply that the energy states are quantised. That is not what is meant by the "quantum jump". The "collapse of the wave function/quantum jump" cat problem is entirely a different issue. The terms are often confused.

The standard cat problem is that for example:

|psi> = |up> + |dn>

describes the probabilistic state function. Each term represents the

*probability* that |psi> will be measured as either as an exact "up" or "dn", and not both at once.

The "quantum jump" issue is, what makes the wave function collapse to one single value? Why is only one value ever measured? Its the "jump" of the

*wave function* from *probability* to *actual*, not that there are only discrete values allowed for observables.

Sure. Well known. Electrons and mass interact with all electrons and masses everywhere in the universe as the radius of the force fields are infinite.

However, an issue is, why are there correlations between objects apparently faster than the speed of light, such that such interactions shouldn't occur.

This makes no sense. The energy of the electrons will only be measured to have specific, quantum values. Any experiment that refutes this, would falsify QM completely, and would be such big news, it would be all over the news. Its isn't.

I will have to look in more detail to understand the point of the paper.

-- Kevin Aylward

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Kevin Aylward

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Jan, there was this piece on the same experiment. I thought he did a better job of describing what was done.

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GH

Reply to
George Herold

On a sunny day (Wed, 5 Jun 2019 12:39:04 -0700 (PDT)) it happened George Herold wrote in :

Interesting article. Thank you.

Copenhagen is dead :-)

Reply to
Jan Panteltje

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