OT: Takata airbags

A little old lady who lives near me owns a 2008 Mazda 6 where the driver's side airbag is affected by the massive Takata airbag recall. She's been getting notice after notice in the mail about getting it fixed, and has tried taking it to the local Mazda dealer. Unfortunately, she usually gets the same reply:

Her: Can you do the recall service on my car?

Dealer: Nope. No parts available.

Her: Will they be available soon?

Dealer: Who knows.

Her: Can you at least disable the airbag?

Dealer: No way.

Her: If my own mechanic can find the parts and does the work, will Mazda reimburse me?

Dealer: Probably not.

Anyone know if there is actually a parts shortage, or if she's just gettng the run-around?

Reply to
bitrex
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Den mandag den 10. august 2015 kl. 23.16.19 UTC+2 skrev bitrex:

let's try google ....

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-Lasse

Reply to
Lasse Langwadt Christensen

If your report of the dialog is true, the responses to her questions are completely unacceptable. She deserves an honest and detailed answer from the dealer for each of her questions.

Reply to
John S

Yeah, that was nearly three months ago, though.

Reply to
bitrex

There may not be much more to say than what they've said, if the info that Lasse posted is still the case now - the article says the full process may take years.

If a car manufacturer discovers an issue with the saftey equipment on a vehicle so serious that it essentially makes the car undriveable, and the manufacturer is unable to repair the issue in a reasonable amount of time, then IMO the car should be considered a total loss, and the owner should either be provided a loaner vehicle or reimbursed for the insurance value of the vehicle.

As if that will ever happen.

Reply to
bitrex

. Search on "wait".

The dealer should be putting her on a waiting list, then telling her exactly how far down she is and how long she has to wait. Since I'm a pushy bastard, if it were me I'd go in one more time with a note pad.

The first question I'd ask is "what's your name again?" then politely thank the guy as I wrote it down. Then I'd write down every question and every answer. If the answer to "can I get on your waiting list" is "no", or if the answer to "how far down am I on your waiting list" is "one" or "I can't say", then I'd follow up with a registered letter to the dealership inquiring about when my car was going to be fixed. I'd cc the letter to Mazda corporate and to my state's attorney general. If my state's attorney general didn't have a good record of helping consumers, I'd cc it to his closest democratic rival. I might cc the NTSB, or whatever federal group it is that deals with recalls.

If cc'ing the thing to God and everyone didn't get some response, I'd cc it to Facebook and every other social media outlet I could think of, so at least my friends knew what sort of rat-bastards everyone involved is.

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Tim Wescott 
Wescott Design Services 
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Reply to
Tim Wescott

This site and the wording of the letters from Mazda make it sound like it will be a day before forever when parts are available. I think the dealer may legitimately not have any idea of a firm date when the work could be done.

I think a car this old with a safety issue like that which can't be fixed in a reasonable amount of time should be written off and given a salvage title.

AFAIK federal law gives the manufacturer the option to either repair, replace, or refund. If they choose the repair option that's fine, but I have no idea if there's any time frame in the law. Saying "eh yeah we'll repair it but it may take us months or years to get around to it, just keep using it should be fine" IMO isn't an acceptable option and certainly wouldn't fly if it were any other consumer product.

Reply to
bitrex

The risk they continue to face is that of further injuries/deaths as a result of this known, highly publicized defect. I'd hate to be the lawyer trying to explain to a jury why his client (auto company) shouldn't pay *extra* for this "needless injury" (i.e., they screwed up in the first place -- defective product -- and now are continuing to propagate their error).

We've been shopping for a new car, recently. Bring up airbags and it's like talking about ABSTINENCE on a first date (with a hottie!).

Reply to
Don Y

On Mon, 10 Aug 2015 16:18:39 -0700 (PDT), snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com Gave us:

You're an idiot. Make some progress yourself.

Reply to
DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno

bitrex schreef op 08/11/2015 om 12:37 AM:

This old??? It's not even 10 years old! Even Hyundai does better! We had a 10 or 12 year old shitty He-young-die for a couple of months and it got fixed without questions when it was recalled (rust problem on the suspension).

Reply to
N. Coesel

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Well, the situation is that Takata and the car manufacturers are going to end up replacing practically all their front seat airbags in all the cars still on the road from 10 years of production! This is a HUGE-HUGE-HUGE recall, completely unprecedented. At least 5 major car makers are deeply involved, with some 33 MILLION cars needing to have air bags replaced! I am guessing it is going to take years to manufacture and replace all those air bags.

Jon

Reply to
Jon Elson

And bear in mind that at the same time Takata have to keep up production for new vehicle lines. Estimates range from 12 months to 2 years to catch up.

Reply to
pedro

I spoke with their service department manager this morning and tried to find out more information. What she told me is pretty much what they told my elderly neighbor. There's no waiting list, and they have no idea when they might get parts. I tried to ask whether we're talking a month? 6 months? year?

No idea.

They said that it "shouldn't really be a problem because it mainly affects areas that have high humidity". Very comforting. As if it doesn't get humid in Boston.

I ran my concerns about the car (from her perspective) being undriveable, and the fact that I feel that if a manufacturer cannot repair a serious saftey issue in a reasonable amount of time, then they should be obligated to refund the current value of the vehicle or provide a loaner.

She was as silent as a stone head on Easter Island.

So there we are.

Reply to
bitrex

Six deaths out of 33 million cars is pretty low risk, hardly "undriveable." These defective air bags are probably safer than no air bags.

--
John Larkin         Highland Technology, Inc 
lunatic fringe electronics 
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Reply to
John Larkin

If the dealer can't get bags and doesn't know when he can, what should he do?

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John Larkin         Highland Technology, Inc 
lunatic fringe electronics 
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Reply to
John Larkin

Den tirsdag den 11. august 2015 kl. 17.24.43 UTC+2 skrev John Larkin:

yeh, and since everything is produced just-in-time it wouldn't be surprising if coming with even a few years worth of production is nearly impossible

-Lasse

Reply to
Lasse Langwadt Christensen

If there is a critical safety issue that cannot be remedied in a timely manner, then the vehicle should be considered a loss and the owner compensated for the current value of the vehicle.

Do you think if a washing machine manufacturer made a defective product that in some cases spewed shrapnel at the user, and was forced to issue a safety recall, they could get away with saying to the customer "Uh, yeah, cant fix it, but just keep using it should be OK"?

In any other industry the manufacturer would recommend that the product be taken out of service immediately.

Reply to
bitrex

Times 33 million cars? People couldn't get 33 million replacement cars, either.

6 deaths out of 33 million cars is hardly a critical safety issue. That frightened old lady could wear a Kevlar vest and a helmet with visor if she's really afraid.

So quit driving the car, and sue the dealer.

--
John Larkin         Highland Technology, Inc 
lunatic fringe electronics 
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Reply to
John Larkin

Of course she's frightened - Mazda has sent her a half dozen letters over the past year or so with grim wording about how in a collision shrapnel could be spewed out of the steering wheel. _I_ know that the chances of being injured or killed by this issue are astronomically low, but she's not me.

And someone obviously thought it was critical enough to set the enormous process of this recall in motion.

It's not her or my _responsibility_ to sue the dealer or manufacturer. It's _their_ responsibility to _make it right_. That's their responsibility under federal law when a critical defect is discovered: to repair, replace, or refund. The repair option is fine IMO if it can be done in a timely manner, but there is an opportunity cost to having a car sitting around like that with a defect. It will be difficult for her to even sell it to a private party given that the problems in getting this issue addressed is known.

After however many months or years of not being able to do the work, 'repair someday' becomes unacceptable and the manufacturer should be required to select one of the other two options available under the law. I guess that might be expensive if they had to do it a lot. Toughies. Not my problem, or hers.

Taking into consideration some of your other posts, you seem to be of the opinion that since consumer goods are usually pretty decent these days, manufacturers should sometimes just be allowed to let crap slide and have it be the owner's responsibility to wear Kevlar vests or whatever, and hope that their class-action lawsuit winds its way through the courts in a couple decades. Because, hey, at least we're not living in East Germany in 1973.

Oh thank you, Mazda! Thank you for sometimes not making shitty, defective vehicles! Thank you sir, may I have another?!

Reply to
bitrex

On Tue, 11 Aug 2015 11:49:15 -0400, bitrex Gave us:

You're an idiot.

Coffee is hot.

3500 lb masses zipping around are hazardous to be in proximity to.
Reply to
DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno

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