OT: Swamp cooler question

Hey guys,

Thinking about installing a smaller unit, no chance to pipe in a big one because of the way the house is built. The instructions that come with units like this are paltry:

formatting link

Essentially just "hang it up, affix plumbing, turn on". Great. Our HW stores can only order them, you can't look at a unit. I want to place it on a deck and cut a hole into the wall. Questions:

Can they sit on a wooden deck or _must_ they be hung?

How far does the drain and overflow stuff stick out the bottom? They don't say, but I assume the unit must be raised for that and depending on how far I could either use or not use such a unit.

How are they powered? Power cord inside or on the outside part? Amazingly not one word about that in the installation guide. I thought this is kind of important ...

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
 Click to see the full signature
Reply to
Joerg
Loading thread data ...

formatting link

Reply to
GregS

I would not mind having one for the outside patio. As good as a mister. Maybe too much air flow.

greg

Reply to
GregS

No, for the price I would just use refridgerated air.

I run my house on a 2.5 ton unit. Compressor and condensor fan only draw 6 amps at 220. It cheap to run.

greg

Reply to
GregS

Funny that a more efficient systems draws more amps. The tighter compression is required on the most efficient coolant. Also thicker metal walls.

greg

Reply to
GregS

Hi Joerg, Looking at the parts list, I 'think' the cord goes inside, and the plumbing outside. I would probably allow at least six inches to reach under the unit to get to that drain area. I think I would put a hose on it, and run the flow out either below or beyond my deck. Maybe make a redwood frame to support it...

Charlie

Reply to
Charlie E.

Hi,

I have a large rooftop swamp cooler for my home.

For a side-discharge window unit I recommend using a wooden platform or other support structure (e.g. wall anchored metal bracket). The water drain hole must be left accessible, but it does not protrude more than ~1 centimeter below the bottom surface.

These units usually have a separate electrical outlet box inside the cooler with outlets for both the motor and the pump. The motor will have its own specialized plug while the pump will have a standard 120V or 240V plug depending on your model. This electrical box inside the cooler should be wired to the common AC cord (for 120 or 240 V depending on what you bought), and the cord will be plugged into an outlet close to the inlet window vent, inside the house. Beware -- if you buy a 240V unit, then the wall outlet near the window must support

240V.

A small diameter water line (plastic or copper -- I use plastic) must be plumbed from the fitting on the cooler to a water source. The instructions GregS linked-to explains this in detail.

The power difference between a window-discharge swamp cooler and a window-mounted refrigerated air conditioner is not that significant. For my whole house the difference *is* significant. I would need about 6 - 7 Tons of A/C for my house, which could draw in excess of

30A (120V), while my swamp cooler only uses slightly more than 5A (120V).

Tom P. Albuquerque

Reply to
tlbs101

formatting link

dus&catalogId=10053&productId=100143013&navFlow=3&keyword=WCM28&langId=-1&searc

hRedirect=WCM28&storeId=10051&endecaDataBean=com.homedepot.sa.el.wc.integration

That's what I have. Not much info in there.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
 Click to see the full signature
Reply to
Joerg

snipped-for-privacy@zekfrivolous.com

formatting link

dus&catalogId=10053&productId=100143013&navFlow=3&keyword=WCM28&langId=-1&se

hRedirect=WCM28&storeId=10051&endecaDataBean=com.homedepot.sa.el.wc.integrat

Well, our central A/C pulls in a whopping 7kW. Once your (smallish) monthly baseline limit is used up the cost per kWh can double and triple. In summer they really sock it to people. I knew a rather heat-sensitive elderly lady who regularly paid $1000/month.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
 Click to see the full signature
Reply to
Joerg

formatting link

6" will be tight. There's probably a beam underneath the window that I am not s'posed to cut into. Which I will only know after breaking into the wall.

What does one do in winter? The usual canvas cover doesn't sound like a great insulator.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
 Click to see the full signature
Reply to
Joerg

Thanks! Then I could raise it only a couple of inches and plumb in an elbow for drain and overflow, connect both below the deck so the drain shutoff could be there, and run a common PVC drain pipe from there. Or drill two holes and go through the deck.

This would be 120V. But we couldn't run the vacuum cleaner while this thing is running. It draws 4-5 amps off of 120V.

Yeah, that's easy (but a long run). I'd use 1/4" copper because it's nice and pliable.

I want to use it for the whole house. Realizing that it won't do the upper 2500sqft, the offices don't need much cooling. I'd just let the air back out there. If it cools the living room and open kitchen that's plenty for us.

Don't know the tonnage of our A/C off the top of my head but I know it draws 7kW, or around 240V/30A. So we set it to 85F, and only because our old Rottweiler can't take the heat anymore. I assume this little swamp cooler might do better than 85F if it's 100F outside, or at least match it.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
 Click to see the full signature
Reply to
Joerg

You might need to make a trip to AZ to avoid a Californicated unit :-)

They come side-draft or down-draft. You probably should get a side-draft body to make your duct-work easier. ...Jim Thompson

--
| James E.Thompson, CTO                            |    mens     |
| Analog Innovations, Inc.                         |     et      |
 Click to see the full signature
Reply to
Jim Thompson

formatting link

My comments are based on living with swamp coolers in Arizona for 40+ years.

Yes it can sit on a deck, or concrete blocks, a wood or metal frame, etc. It is not necessary to provide 100% support under it, a frame of

2x4's around the outside edge of the base is adequate.

The drain fitting sticks out the bottom less than 1" and is threaded for a garden hose. When installed the garden hose will stick straight down. You can install an elbow for tight installations. The overflow is entirely inside the cooler box. No drain shutoff is necessary. PVC pipe is ok for the drain line.

Installing a bleed off kit will extend the life of your pads and greatly reduce the calcium build up the metal parts.

formatting link

The unit you linked to will have 1 external electric cord with a standard plug. All other wiring will be factory installed inside the unit.

For winterizing: unplug the electrical, drain the water and wrap it with a tarp. If you have freezing temperatures you will need to purge the feed water tubing too. Insulation is usually done by covering the inside part with a cover of ones own making. Art

Reply to
Artemus

formatting link

Looked at it. Those are way larger and the only place I can reasonably put it is on the north side of the deck. That's where the deck is only

5ft deep and the typical large side-draft unit would cause a permanent road block :-)

The WCM28 is the only one that might fit.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
 Click to see the full signature
Reply to
Joerg

formatting link

Good, thanks!

Technically the overflow should never come on anyhow so if that oozes it's probably ok.

I think they should be bled weekly to avoid that "indoor swimming pool" smell. Maybe I just use the drain for that.

Darn. There ain't no outlet on the outside, and not easy to run power there.

That part will require some custom fitting anyhow. Seems they made the tunnel one piece, with flanges. That's unfortunate because I'll have to make the hole larger than it needs to be. Meaning a frame on both sides and then the inner one can hold a homemade wood cover with an acceptable WAF. Stained to match furniture, maybe.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
 Click to see the full signature
Reply to
Joerg

formatting link

The overflow is nothing more than a thinwalled PVC tube about 3-4" long stuck in the drain fitting on the inside of the unit. If the water level gets higher than the end of the tube it simply drains out. No moving parts. Remove the tube to drain all the water out.

Draining will not help that. The swamp smell is due to algae growth on the pads. New pads are treated to prevent this but the treatment doesn't last forever. Growth usually only happens with round the clock operation in higher outside humidity. This allows algae to grow on the pads. In low humidity, low teens and less, I've never seen algae growth. Turning the unit off and allowing the pads to completly dry once a day will also inhibit algae growth.

BTW. The aspen fiber pads are the best IMHO. They smell wonderful for the first couple of days and provide the best temperature drop. Paper ones are a so-so second choice. Plastic ones suck.

No problem. Pull the cord back inside the unit, drill a hole in the sheet metal duct next to the outside edge of the box, install a grommet, and run the cord through. The cord can them be run out the louvers inside the house, or through another hole drilled in the side/bottom of the duct.

Reply to
Artemus

formatting link

So you have to take a panel off every week? I think I am going to modify that :-)

Right now the humidity is 25%, temperature is around 100F. At night we sometimes have high humidity rolling in from the coast. It's 100 miles away but one never knows on which days this delta breeze will roll in.

Yes, that's what I heard and read. Many Australians seem to prefer the cardboard kind for some reason.

Well, if that's legal and would pass a home inspection some day it should be no problem.

[...]
--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
 Click to see the full signature
Reply to
Joerg

There's really no need to 100% drain it on a weekly basis. But yes, you will have to pull a panel to drain it. Pulling a panel is simple as it is held in by gravity and all you have to do is lift it up and out. Just don't plug or put a shut off in the drain line or the cooler pan will overflow in the event of a stuck float valve.

I have a chart somewhere showing the temp differential a swamp box can deliver depending on the outside air temp & humidity but I can't find it right now. When I find it I'll post it.

Unavailability of aspen ones down under?

It would be good idea to have spare pads on hand for a mid season change. In AZ they were plentiful and cheap in April-May but rare and cost more later on.

Art

Reply to
Artemus

Something's not right with these numbers. 2.5T = 30kBTU/Hr = 6.5kW. You're claiming 15kW (assuming perfect efficiency and unity PF), so that's a pumping "efficiency" of the entire system, from electricity (in VA, no less) to heat pumped of greater than 4.3. Looking at it another way, that's a SEER of 21, again assuming a PF of unity and no heat generated (excluding pumped heat).

Reply to
krw

View in fixed font Outside air temp in left column Relative Humidity 2% 5% 10% 15% 20% 25% 30% 35% 40% 45% 50% 75 -21 -20 -18 -17 -16 -14 -13 -12 -11 -10 -9 80 -23 -22 -20 -18 -17 -16 -14 -13 -12 -11 -9 85 -24 -23 -22 -20 -18 -17 -15 -14 -13 -12 -11 90 -26 -25 -23 -21 -20 -18 -16 -14 -13 -12 -11 95 -28 -27 -25 -23 -19 -17 -16 -16 -14 -13 -11 100 -31 -29 -27 -24 -21 -20 -18 -17 -15 -13 -12 105 -33 -31 -28 -26 -24 -21 -19 -17 -16 110 -35 -33 -30 -27 -25 -23 -20 -18 115 -37 -35 -32 -29 -26 -24 -21 120 -39 -37 -34 -30 -27 -25

At 100 degress and 30% you can expect the cooler to deliver 82 degree air into the house. The humidity of that air is going to be much higher than

30%.

Art

Reply to
Artemus

ElectronDepot website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.