One roll of duct tape

Just ask the lads on Apollo 13...

John

Do you need gorilla tape for advanced degrees? :-)

And one roll of green kynar bodge wire can make up for .....................

Must have been a really big mistake to require the entire roll of Duct/Duck Tape.

When an electronic engineer makes a mistake, only other electronic engineers can see the problem and offer a solution. When a mechanical engineer makes a mistake, everyone and their brother-in-law can see that it doesn't work, doesn't fit, is broken, does something undesirable, looks weird, etc. Of course, seeing the problem entitles the observer to an opinion as to how it should be fixed. Have some sympathy for mechanical engineers.

--
Jeff Liebermann     jeffl@cruzio.com 
150 Felker St #D    http://www.LearnByDestroying.com 
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com 
Skype: JeffLiebermann     AE6KS    831-336-2558

The current issue is microwave ovens. The complex electronics seldom fails, but the handles and hinges and covers do.

--

John Larkin         Highland Technology, Inc 

lunatic fringe electronics

That means that the electronics engineers are not doing their jobs properly. The goal of consumer product design is to make money for the manufactory. A consumer device is expected to fail after some well controlled interval (typically 5 years) or shortly after the warranty expires. If some sub-system, such as the allegedly complex electronics in a microwave oven, survives beyond the target replacement or warranty period, then it is over-designed and must be cost reduced until the sub-system fails at some point in the target period. Ideally, everything should fail at the same time, which demonstrates that everything was designed to the target specification.

Please note that there are numerous online appliance parts businesses that sell replacement cosmetic parts for microwave ovens and other kitchen appliances.

Incidentally, I've occasionally fixed microwave ovens for friends and customers[1]. The usual problems are the various components in the high voltage section and a shorted magnetron. It's not expensive or terribly difficult. The usual reason for repair instead of replacement is that the microwave oven was built into the kitchen cabinetry and a same size replacement oven cannot be found.

[1] Customers pay me. Friends do not. Otherwise, they're the same.

--
Jeff Liebermann     jeffl@cruzio.com 
150 Felker St #D    http://www.LearnByDestroying.com 
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com 
Skype: JeffLiebermann     AE6KS    831-336-2558

Den fredag den 10. november 2017 kl. 18.12.57 UTC+1 skrev Jeff Liebermann:

I've got 6 different colors here. Great stuff.

Yep, bad design. There should be a fish paper insulator between the two PCB's. Or, there should be some epoxy painted over the PCB fuses to prevent them from spraying molten copper on the nearby PCB. When I suggested that everything should fail at the same time, I didn't mean that it should be a chain reaction of cascading failures.

What would that cost? Maybe $0.10 parts cost for either method. I use 4.5 times parts cost to estimate cost to sales. If Panasonic made

1 million ovens, that's 1/2 million dollars in lost profits. Little wonder manufacturers cut corners wherever possible.

I happen to have a Panasonic Sensor 1300w Inverter oven. Working fine for about 3 years including setting fire to some yams, which made a mess.

"Fixing Panasonic inverter microwaves" (14:50) At 2:35, he mentions that there is 17Amps going through a 15A rated microswitch and 18awg wire which overheated the push-on terminal which then melted the microswitch. However, he was only able to measure 15A on 3 different inverter boards. So, the oven is operating right at the bitter edge of the maximum specified current handling capacity by melting the terminal, wire, and microswitch. Like I said, cost reduce the parts until they all fail at about the same time.

--
Jeff Liebermann     jeffl@cruzio.com 
150 Felker St #D    http://www.LearnByDestroying.com 
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com 
Skype: JeffLiebermann     AE6KS    831-336-2558

We figure about 3x over 'total' costs. total is parts and labor. It can take just as much time to replace/put in a $0.01 resistor as a $10 photodiode.

George H. If Panasonic made

The whole point of gaffer tape is that it has weaker adhesion.

NT

All mechanical engineers need is a few pieces of bent metal and some string.

All electronic engineers need is a 555 and some Rs and Cs.

We (engineering) give our raw BOM costs to sales, mechanical engineering adds theirs, then manufacturing engineering adds their costs from those BOMs. There _is_ a difference in manufacturing costs between the placement costs of differing components. SMT resistors and capacitors that are used in multiple places can be put on high-speed feeders, so their PnP cost is reduced significantly. Tubes and tray parts take more time, also, so their cost varies. BGA needs XRay inspection, etc. Manufacturing engineering knows all the details, so they're the ones to figure all that out from the BOM.

You misspelled "PIC".

And comes off without residue, even after being there for awhile. You can also tear it off with one hand while holding up the mike boom with the other. ;)

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs 
Principal Consultant 
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics 
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics 
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510 

http://electrooptical.net 
https://hobbs-eo.com

Nah, just a volunteer roadie / lights guy for a garage band back in me yoot.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs 
Principal Consultant 
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics 
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics 
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510 

http://electrooptical.net 
https://hobbs-eo.com

Sounds like you have experience as a Boom Op.

2.5x is our minimum multiplier over "direct cost", but 5x or 6x is better. We're selling IP, not parts on boards. But the thing that sets selling price isn't cost, it's competition and demand. 2.5 or 3x is just the don't-bother floor.

We do sell accessories, wall warts and cables and such, at small markup, to save the customer the hassle of cutting a separate PO to Digikey. Some people really rip off their customers for stuff like that.

FLIR wants over $250 for what is basically a laptop battery. So we just plug in our imager.

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John Larkin         Highland Technology, Inc 

lunatic fringe electronics