I'm thinking about letting the taxpayers subsidize me.

Please ignore previous numbers, Sorry, I read something wrong, changes made below. Hmm, turns out, changes didn't make much difference.

I just got the latest notice of increase on my non Obamacare healthcare policy. It is only 9% this year versus previous increases of

18.8%, 21% and 19.4%. I have a good policy, with a $10k deductible, if it wasn't good,I would have already been forced onto Obamamcare. The new premium is $8448 a year for a family of three. Comparing a similar Obamacare policy, the premium is $13,500. However, using an AGI of $63k to calculate the subsidy the generous taxpayers will give me $9,492, leaving me to pay $4,008. Saving me $4,440. The deductible increases from $10k to $12.5k, ($6.25k/6.25k). When it was a $1,500 difference I could ignore it, now it's getting to be a bit more substantial at $4,440.

There are several problematic areas. Will I really get all the $9,492k subsidy promised? How many years will the subsidy continue at this rate? My doctor doesn't support Obamacare, I have to do the paperwork. Will the Ins. Co. still play interference and negotiate prices? I don't like government interference, Obamacare, or being on welfare (the subsidy).

This sucks. Mikek

PS. Anyone here not get the subsidy promised and end up with a tax bill?

Holy crap! My employer doesn't pay that much for my insurance, with essentially[*] no deductable (I paid $250 of a $250K claim/$80K contracted payment, last year).

[*] There is a deductible but I'll be damned if I can figure out what it's for. There is a maximum, too, but with the above numbers I have no idea how I would get to $12K.

Principle has its price? ;-)

My doctor won't take Obamacare or medicare from other than his established patients. No new business from any of them.

Well, it was designed by Democrats.

What does that mean "My doctor won't take Obamacare"? How would he know you had that? "Obamacare" is just insurance through the standard carriers. Do you think there is a red flag on the insurance card? Even if that were true, how would the doctor know before you came in for the first visit? Do they see your card and cancel your appointment?

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Rick

Yes, that is one advantage of group policies. Also, if you run my increases, it doubled in 5 years

I'm figuring out my price. :-{

I have had an 87% increase since May of 2012 the year Obamacare regulations started. And still the premium is $5,052 cheaper than equivalent Obamacare policy. ie. an Obamacare policy is 60% more than a non Obamacare policy.

When you visit a doctor you have never seen before and it is not a referral (and often even if it is) they'll hand you a lot of paperwork to fill out. I just went through such a stack at a new dentist after my previous one retired even though we don't have dental insurance. They told me that if I had insurance I'd even have to fill in my SSN.

So, information about your insurance has to be entered there. And yes, the problems with Obamacare are very real:

The loudest complaints came (rightfully so) from people who signed up for Obamacare after seeing on the official list that their docs were "in network", only to later find out that they were not.

It would not be prudent to not give the information and then when they take your card they might say "Sorry, you'll have to pay cash because we don't take your plan".

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Regards, Joerg 

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

I don't know, when I ask, they said they don't file paperwork for Obamacare policies, and that I'd have to do it myself.

Mikek

Oh horseshit!

Nope. They ask for your insurance and check it before making the appointment.

Oh, sure. He'll take cash, 100% of the asking rate and you can get whatever you can back from Obamacare. Real insurance usually pays half that, with a $20 copay, or some such.

Obama can't get a group of people together?

Yes, I've been following your adventures in Obamacare.

Of course your doctor doesn't like Obamacare. At the moment he's got a lot of freedom to sell you expensive tests and treatments that aren't cost-effe ctive for you, but make him money.

Governments outside of America have got a lot of experience in persuading d octors to restrict themselves to cost-effective tests and treatments, and A merican doctors don't want to see themselves cut back less exorbitant - if still remarkably generous - incomes.

Few are as cost effective, or as Spartan, as the British National Health Se rvice, but in the advanced industrial countries they all seem to deliver be tter health care - as measured across the community - than the US system do es. Some of them deliver better health care to everybody than the US system delivers to the fully insured - the US doctor's habit of going for the mos t remunerative treatments does disadvantage the patient.

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Bill Sloman, Sydney

Insurance companies DO NOT negotiate rates, period.

t of freedom to sell you expensive tests and treatments that aren't cost-ef fective for you, but make him money.

doctors to restrict themselves to cost-effective tests and treatments, and American doctors don't want to see themselves cut back less exorbitant - i f still remarkably generous - incomes.

Service, but in the advanced industrial countries they all seem to deliver better health care - as measured across the community - than the US system does. Some of them deliver better health care to everybody than the US syst em delivers to the fully insured - the US doctor's habit of going for the m ost remunerative treatments does disadvantage the patient.

So how many U.S. doctors do you know?

Dan

lot of freedom to sell you expensive tests and treatments that aren't cost- effective for you, but make him money.

ng doctors to restrict themselves to cost-effective tests and treatments, a nd American doctors don't want to see themselves cut back less exorbitant - if still remarkably generous - incomes.

h Service, but in the advanced industrial countries they all seem to delive r better health care - as measured across the community - than the US syste m does. Some of them deliver better health care to everybody than the US sy stem delivers to the fully insured - the US doctor's habit of going for the most remunerative treatments does disadvantage the patient.

Well, one of my cousins got a medical degree, did a Ph.D. on the theraputic effects of lithium on the depressed, moved to the US, got lured back to a professorship in Adelaide, didn't much like what it offered him in practice (which was rather less than had been promised) and moved back to a profess orship the US. We were never all that close - his younger brother, the stat istician, was easier to get on with, and still lives in Australia.

Probably not a representative sample, but better than nothing. The comments on US doctor behaviour come in part from my younger brother, who is a medi co in Australia and fond of quoting Cochrane collaboration results, and in part from the usual comments about US doctors practising "defensive medicin e" and ordering every test that a lawyer might be able to claim to be relev ant.

A better question would be why you would want to tie the question to person al acquaintanceship, when it's a claim about statistical behaviour.

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Bill Sloman, Sydney

The price hike--that's why they call it 'affordable.'

Your experience is better than average. These guys are a big online broker, selling O-care under contract with HHS. They're policy and provider agnostic. Nice graphs.

Their average family premium has increased from $426/mo in 2013, before O-care's 'affordability' kicked in, to $1,091 today.

(That's for people who buy their own insurance, the people this was supposedly needed to help afford insurance.

People with employer insurance haven't felt it because all those provisions have been delayed and delayed, contrary to the law.)

YMMV.

Cheers, James Arthur

I may have an unusual doctor. My doctor is very frugal with tests, when I hurt my back, he had me make attempt a couple of moves, and said you have herniated a disc, we could get an MRI, but it would be a waste of money. A little over a year later, I ask for an MRI, I have a herniated disc. Head slap. Waste of $384. He searches out cheaper medications and gave me a RX coupon and suggested I try it and see if it gets me a lower price. I do get blood tests for cholesterol and something else, but it has been cheap ($10), I'll soon see what O'care has done to that. I had one prescription go from $10 to $28 after O'care reg's started.

restrict themselves to cost-effective tests and treatments, and American doctors don't

want to see themselves cut back less exorbitant - if still remarkably generous - incomes.

but in the advanced industrial countries they all seem to deliver better health care -

as measured across the community - than the US system does. Some of them deliver better

health care to everybody than the US system delivers to the fully insured - the US doctor's

habit of going for the most remunerative treatments does disadvantage the patient.

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http://www.avast.com

Well, call it what you want. I go in the doc, he charges me $85, the blood tests run $108, the bills are sent to BCBS. BCBS sends me notice showing the charges and what they allow. I pay their allowed amount. It creeps me out that the cash price for the blood tests is $108 and BCBS allows $10, which is what I pay. Something happens to the charges between my provider and my checkbook, I call it a negotiation. I know what is paid, because I have $10,000 deductible and the insurance company pays nothing until i hit that. However, Obamacare has changed that, I now get a free physical every year. So the insurance company does pay for that. Or maybe they profit from that, since the raised my premium about 85% since the Obamacare regulations started. Mikek

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I guess I don't see it as an "Obamacare" problem as such. Every insurance plan has participating doctors which limits your choices. I have had that problem myself with insurance from my employer. Every plan which is offered on the exchanges has different doctors. Doctors and hospitals don't participate in "Obamacare", they participate in individual plans... same as any other insurance. This is nothing new and I have personally been on the short end of that stick many times before Obamacare was available.

Your second link focuses on California where many doctors are not participating in the exchange plans and it gives the reason... "California offers one of the lowest government reimbursement rates in the country -- 30 percent lower than federal Medicare payments." That is not an Obamacare issue, it is a California issue. Put the blame where it belongs and hold your state legislators accountable rather than blaming something that is not responsible for the decisions made elsewhere.

Doctors join and leave plans all the time. Again, I have seen this problem with insurance from an employer many times long before Obamacare was even conceived. Rather than look at a stale list from the insurance companies, ask your doctors. If they tell you they will be participating then you can hold them to their word.

Jeeze, I don't get how people want to blame Obamacare for what your doctors do.

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Rick

One other point. The article mentions other facts about the payments. "In other states, Medicare pays doctors $76 for return-office visits. But in California, Medi-Cal's reimbursement is $24, according to Dr. Theodore M. Mazer, a San Diego ear, nose and throat doctor."

This is part of the incentives to encourage good outcomes. Notice the payment is for "return" visits meaning dealing with the same problem multiple times.

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Rick