?If you can go to a top 10 university or a universities participati ng in project 211 or project 985, don?t come to the US and settle f or a top 30 university,? Zhang said. ?You will find that th e quality of your classmates are generally lower, and your chances of makin g useful business connections are fewer.?
?You will never get to see what real elites are like and are not ab le to blend into the mainstream community in the US.?
So true of many of these cesspools ...
They don't want an education, they want to be buddies with what they think will be the US elite.
We may as well take their full-freight tuition, and show them some American culture.
Most college educations are mostly useless, just a very expensive obstacle course.
-- John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc picosecond timing precision measurement jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com http://www.highlandtechnology.com
ating in project 211 or project 985, don?t come to the US and settl e for a top 30 university,? Zhang said. ?You will find that the quality of your classmates are generally lower, and your chances of ma king useful business connections are fewer.?
able to blend into the mainstream community in the US.?
Seems these days they're lucky to get a job in retail or serving coffee in Starbucks. They've definitely been ripped off.
ating in project 211 or project 985, don?t come to the US and settl e for a top 30 university,? Zhang said
The original post is about university, not college; universities have gradu ate schools for advanced students. Obstacles, expense, just like any worthwhile ente rprise.
Some things, like the hard sciences and engineering, are OK, although you can get an engineering degree nowadays and not be much more than a code monkey. I've interviewed a lot of EE grads who no basically nothing about electricity.
Business, maybe. Lots of degrees, like sociology, psychology, art, English, ecology, geography, ethnic studies, are pretty much worthless, but do give a kid a leg up in getting that job serving coffee.
Economics? Don't know. Maybe that degree helps to get a start at a bank or something. The Brat has an MBA and she thinks some of it was useful.
-- John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc picosecond timing precision measurement jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com http://www.highlandtechnology.com
I use the term interchangably. I graduated from the Engineering college of Tulane University.
The "obstacle course" comment refers to cases where employers don't think course content will really help, but they may as well hire a kid with the subservience, grunt patience, and people skills to get a degree. It's a long, expensive IQ test.
-- John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc picosecond timing precision measurement jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com http://www.highlandtechnology.com
That's /always/ been the case. Our elders were having the same moan when we had just graduated.
We aren't unique and there's nothing new under the sun :(
Lots of nonsense. I have worked alongside Chinese students at universities and they love it. In the US they work on cutting edge research. For example at UC Davis which is not ivy league but a really good university and desired by foreigners, for good reasons.
Many Chinese I met only went back because they had to. Their studies were not funded by rich Ferrari-driving parents but by the Chinese government and then they have to show up back home by a pre-set date, degree in hand. If they are late that can mean harsh punishment.
In the end it doesn't matter. In hindsight I would not go the university route with masters degree and all again. Bachelor is fine, it suffices to get the first job and after that nobody ever asked anyhow.
Our university was known to wash out north of 80% of students late in their studies (when it really hurts) in test about Maxwell's equation applications and such. So to folks in the industry that meant that if you toughed that out and passed it without a major nervous breakdown or being washed out you had shown sufficient "manliness". Similar to how people have a lot of respect for a guy who served years in the Marines.
In Germany they called such people "belastbar" which loosely translated means they can stand a lot of stress without cracking.
-- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/
"Tough love" and imposing abuse/hardship simply for the sake of "it makes you tough" doesn't usually breed men who are actually tough, however. That sometimes comes from experiencing actual hardship that you got whether you liked it or not, less the kind you purposefully sign up for because you have something to prove.
I've noticed it is pretty good at breeding new whackoffs though - it must be the world is full of 'em. It's also good at making sure that narcissists/sociopaths rise to the top; it's no big deal for them as they don't really experience emotions like anxiety or fear the same way "regular" people do; there's nothing to "crack."
The university process is cruel; tell them how important it is, take their money, dump them, and tell them that they are failures.
Or take their money and give them a useless degree.
It's all about money.
-- John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc lunatic fringe electronics
Not in most of Europe where I got my degree. High wash-out rates can actually be detrimental to a university's financial picture because when less newbies sign up their fund allocation can drop. However, that didn't happen because the kids knew that if they went through that grueling process they pretty much had it made. It got you into the door a Siemens, Bosch, HP, BMW, Daimler-Benz and so on. Big companies regularly regaled us with pre-recruitment events at fancy restaurants. They were competing with each other for graduates. Except I never had any intention of working for a company with more than a few hundred employees.
-- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/
ating in project 211 or project 985, don?t come to the US and settl e for a top 30 university,? Zhang said. ?You will find that the quality of your classmates are generally lower, and your chances of ma king useful business connections are fewer.?
able to blend into the mainstream community in the US.?
College education is an expensive obstacle course. You can extract informat ion from it while scrambling over the obstacles - it involves going to the library (which every university has) and working out which books or journal s are relevant. The teaching staff will give you clues from time to time, i f you are of a mind to look for them - as John Larkin clearly wasn't.
One of the things it tests for is the capacity to learn while not being act ively spoon-fed.
-- Bill Sloman, Sydney
cipating in project 211 or project 985, don?t come to the US and se ttle for a top 30 university,? Zhang said. ?You will find t hat the quality of your classmates are generally lower, and your chances of making useful business connections are fewer.?
not able to blend into the mainstream community in the US.?
in Starbucks. They've definitely been ripped off.
But may know how to spell "know".
An impressive generalisation. I suspect that it demonstrates that John Lark in doesn't know anything about sociology, psychology, ecology or geography.
Economics is a subject that is much too interesting to rich people, and the y have the economic power to dictate a lot of what gets taught, while lacki ng the ethical capacity to realise that a theory that they like might not a ctually have predictive power in the real world.
Chiropractors and homeopaths also get well paid jobs, despite the fact that what they are taught is total nonsense.
-- Bill Sloman, Sydney
cipating in project 211 or project 985, don?t come to the US and se ttle for a top 30 university,? Zhang said
aduate schools
nterprise.
Self-contradiction there - IQ tests aren't either long, or expensive, and t heir results don't correlate too well with post-university success.
Graduate earn progressively more money than non-graduates, and, people with post-graduates degrees (the Harvard MBA excepted) earn even more.
So universities are the expensive and effective versions of what IQ tests a spire to be. They aren't perfect either, but decidedly better.
-- Bill Sloman, Sydney
IIRC China operates by a similar system where if you do well in higher education it's an automatic ticket to a top-tier job/having it made, but if you don't you lose the only shot you'll ever have at being white-collar.
That's why their system is so rife with abuse and academic cheating. At some point if you realize that you're not going to be able to handle the pressure there's no good reason at all not to engage in dishonest behavior, yeah you're f***ed if you get caught but you're f***ed if you don't pass also, so why not?
Which is why in some sense Chinese students have the right idea when tossed into a sink-or-swim education system like the former. Why not cheat? That type of system is going to f*ck you as soon as it gets a chance and they have the nerve to talk to you about "honor codes" and "academic integrity"?
In Germany that's different. Should you wash out at a university you have two other tiers open to you. One is called "Fachhochschule" which gets you something equivalent to a bachelors degree with a more practice-oriented tilt. The other tier is a traditional trade which is a formal education process over there. For example, if you want to become a licensed electrician or run a business in that field you must have passed all that. Trump is quite enthused about that system and rightfully so. It works.
The brutal side is or at least was that if you flunk, say, EE at a university you were then blocked from studying EE at any other German university. IOW black-listed. Not sure if they still do this though. If you really wanted to go the academic route you'd have to sign up with a university in another EU country. Which usually means another language. Though that wouldn't rarely make much sense because flunking means that academia just may not be your knack.
-- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/
IQ tests are mostly plain dumb. Just like lots of tests to determine whether someone is "management material" which can produce seriously wrong results.
IME many people who got a post-graduate MBA fared worse that engineers who took their hats right after graduating and then specialized. Post-doc jobs or institute jobs after a degree also aren't always helpful.
I agree there. They just teach too much old stuff and most professors are seriously lacking in knowing modern technology. Essentially you "learn how to learn".
-- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/
They don't want an education, they want to be buddies with what they
The teaching staff is often not the best avenue. I found corporate sources to be much better. And no, you will not find any of that at a university library which is why I rarely set foot in there (we had a huge one). However, I did rack up north of $300 in telco charges during my final project to get at that kind of information (pre-Internet days).
Why do you think he has started a company and made it a very successful one that provides stable employment for lots of people? Sorry, but some of your writing comes across as very arrogant and uncalled for.
I know lots of self-made engineers (no degree) who are excellent in that domain. Which is why I always tell HR folks never to weed out resumes of candidates who don't have the "required" degrees.
In contrast, I met scores of university students who wanted to be spoon-fed and were. "You need to read this, that and the other book for this course". Then that's what they bought and read, and no more. Whatever the professor or the academic director said was like gospel to them.
-- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/
The Republican party is enthusiastic about any educational system that's pitched as being able to manufacture more Republicans, that is to say no point at teaching anyone that hoity-toity book-learnin' stuff unless they absolutely need it for their required field.
And even in that case avoid things like the arts, humanities, literature, history, and other commie stuff.
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