EV charging price

What does any of this have to do with the issue? No one cares how many jou les are in a gallon of gasoline. The issue is how far can you go on it. M y car goes around 3 miles on a kilowatt, so about 30 miles per dollar. Oth er cars get around 30 mpg so 15 miles per dollar. I don't expect gas to re main at $2 a gal unless the lowering of demand from EV usage keeps the pric e low.

Even in Hawaii an EV will get over 2 miles to the dollar and the car about

2 miles to the dollar.

Did you have a point?

Rick C.

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Reply to
gnuarm.deletethisbit
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Yes, I wonder if being loaded means you have more than "quite wealthy" or less than "quite wealthy"? Mikek

Reply to
amdx

Your numbers are dead wrong, way off. Actual measurement with my Prius Prime plug-in shows that gas at $2.25 / gal is about equivalent to electricity at $0.25 / kWh, with identical miles traveled. Electricity wins on cost, but not by much at today's prices. It wins bigger on CO2.

But oops, when I run the heater on really cold days, the electric / gas equivalency goes out the window, and it's hard say who is winning. I would imagine gas, but the numbers seem not to show that. Either way, I put on my coat and hope to get to work or home, without running the heater, or just running it for a few minutes. Brrr!

So far I've gone 4.5 months and 2500 miles, with only one gas fillup and about 1/3 of a tank still available. Yes, it's a bit dumb to make a big deal over a few $$ worth of gas, but I love the quiet powerful electric motors, and it easily becomes an obsession to keep the gas engine off.

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Reply to
Winfield Hill

Wow! $0.25 a kWh is pretty pricey. I'm getting my juice at about a third of that. But then I use enough to make it worthwhile to use TOU billing.

I'll say that if your heater impacts your mileage more than 15%, you either have a very efficient car or a very horrible heater. The heater in my mod el X is 5 kW max. At 60 mph the power the car uses averages 20 kW. For th e heater to impact that 15% it would need to run 2/3 of the time. I think if my toes were warmed by a 3 kW heater they would be quite toasty indeed.

Rick C.

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Reply to
gnuarm.deletethisbit

the frustrating thing about the Volt's electric heater is that even though it also draws about 5kW running full blast on a cold day it still seems to take nearly as long for the hot air to come up as it would in an ICE car with a heat exchanger. but it's an electric heater! my 1kW electric space heater starts blowing hot air in about 3 seconds not sure what the hold up is.

Best guess is maybe they bring it up slowly to save thermal cycling stress and premature failure

Reply to
bitrex

The Prius Prime heater seems really wimpy, compared to my former Prius heater. Before it was a heating coil, now the A/C is a heat pump. Well, OK, the other problem is the damn cold! -2 deg two nights ago and +4 last night.

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    - Win
Reply to
Winfield Hill

This solves the range anxiety problem:

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John Larkin         Highland Technology, Inc 
picosecond timing   precision measurement  
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Reply to
John Larkin

Somerville MA is like a spot-on caricature of all Conservative stereotypes about bohemian "urban liberal elites", "metrosexuals", manbuns, everyone's got a trust fund and rides a fixed gear bicycle and sports at least five tattoos.

It's not true everywhere, but they're mostly all true there.

Reply to
bitrex

That depends on the cost structure of the station, doesn't it? If the land or improvements dominate the cost, I'd think a timed charge is quite reasonable. If electricity dominates, charge by the kWh. Really, just charge what the market will bear.

Lefties hate everyone. Just watch them eat their own when they don't toe the line perfectly.

Reply to
krw

e:

01/30/2019 07:24 PM, snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

stated in the article.

should be in KW and Tesla rate should be below SF.

don't buy $50k, $80k, or $100k

money on gas. Yeah it kinda sucks for people like me

our modest packs

y.

quite wealthy having to pay

toys or fight for legislation to protect 'em.

ich? Just because they have done well doesn't mean

said I hated nobody.

robably pointless to try to legislate that

ses whose business model seems to implicitly be to cater to them

kWh to do otherwise, that's

is.

he kWh, I would tolerate a

ging the charger space more time than others

e slow chargers, but it seems of any group, government au ght to

argers.

station, doesn't it? If the

nate the cost, I'd think a timed charge is

nable. If electricity dominates, charge by the kWh.

eally, just charge what the market will bear.

For many of the EvGo/ElectrifyAmerica installations, they are in the middle of nowhere, where land is cheap. Some charger s also run by solar, which costs less than $0.10/KWH. Th ey are doing so just because they are pretty much micro-m onopoly in certain region, using discriminatory pricing t o maximize profit. I see anti-trust issues.

Reply to
edward.ming.lee

8:34:43 PM UTC-8, snipped-for-privacy@notreal.com wrote:

9 6:31 PM, bitrex wrote:

This is for charging 24KWH Nissan Leaf as stated in the a rticle.

in KW and Tesla rate should be below SF.

e the prices are oriented to gouge the

Tesla owners who definitely don't buy $50k, $80k, or $10

0k

a sucks for people like me

hat ya gonna do most of us charge our modest packs

It's hard to get too miffed about the quite wealthy havi ng to pay

or legislation to protect 'em.

because they have done well doesn't mean

Also you have a weird definition of "hate" I never said I hated nobody.

bly pointless to try to legislate that

s whose business model seems to implicitly be to cater to them

kWh to do otherwise, that's

it is.

e by the kWh, I would tolerate a

hose hogging the charger space more time than others

ernment aught to

the slow chargers.

tructure of the station, doesn't it? If the

improvements dominate the cost, I'd think a timed charge is

rge by the kWh.

will bear.

nstallations, they are in the middle of nowhere, where la nd is cheap. Some chargers also run by solar, which cost s less than $0.10/KWH. They are doing so just because th ey are pretty much micro-monopoly in certain region, usin g discriminatory pricing to maximize profit. I see anti- trust issues.

I looked at the maps on both web sites and didn't find many chargers I would say were "in the m iddle of nowhere". Have you actually looked???

They also seem to have rather poor coverage of many areas. EV GO has no chargers anywhere along Rt 95 between Washingto n, DC and Jacksonville, FL... what, 700 miles? I guess s ome cars have very good batteries. Electrify America has chargers along that route, but one of the distances is a round 230 miles. Do the EVs other than Tesla have that m uch range?

Rick C.

--+- Tesla referral code

-

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Reply to
gnuarm.deletethisbit

Not true. The only place I've seen charging stations is in shopping malls, and such. That land is _quite_ expensive.

Hell, I don't pay that much for electricity at home ($.07/kWh now).

Utter nonsense. If you think there is so much money to be made, start building solar charging stations. You'll be rich!

Reply to
krw

One of the "consumer reporters", and ex-Tesla.fanboi, on the radio here, said his Tesla-S is down to 35mi per charge. Going to be a long trip for him to DC.

Reply to
krw

If that $50K were invested, rather than sunk into a "Women's Studies" degree, it would be the start of a decent retirement.

You were willing to actually *work* for a living.

As do I, but the reality is different.

Assuming yours have learned from you, they'll be at the top of the curve. 1%ers, even. Most won't - having trouble coming up with $400 in an emergency (including credit cards).

Reply to
krw

On Feb 1, 2019, bitrex wrote (in article ):

Somerville borders on Cambridge, Mass, and is now a yuppie haven. The original blue-collar population of Somerville was priced out long ago, when Cambridge ran out of housing space.

Joe Gwinn

Reply to
Joseph Gwinn

On Friday, February 1, 2019 at 9:28:53 PM UTC-8, snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wr ote:

:

e.

SF.

0k

ke me

packs

y

m.

one well doesn't mean

body.

that

them

t's

a
s

to

e

ddle of nowhere, where land is cheap. Some chargers also run by solar, whi ch costs less than $0.10/KWH. They are doing so just because they are pret ty much micro-monopoly in certain region, using discriminatory pricing to m aximize profit. I see anti-trust issues.

uld say were "in the middle of nowhere". Have you actually looked???

hargers anywhere along Rt 95 between Washington, DC and Jacksonville, FL... what, 700 miles? I guess some cars have very good batteries. Electrify A merica has chargers along that route, but one of the distances is around 23

0 miles. Do the EVs other than Tesla have that much range?

Consider the followig two examples:

Bakersfield, downtown, chargepoint, $0.05/min, $3 for 30 miles. Plenty of c hargers in area.

Delano: Walmart, evGo, $0.15/min, $10 for 30 miles. It's 30 miles north of Bakersfield, in the middle of nowhere. No other chargers within 30 miles of Delano.

Downtown real estate is certainly more expensive in Bakersfield than Delano. Both are running from Solar carports.

Not saying local government should regulate, but should facilate/foster competitions.

Reply to
edward.ming.lee

On Saturday, February 2, 2019 at 8:05:59 PM UTC-5, snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wro te:

te:

:

cle.

ow SF.

100k

like me

t packs

pay

'em.

done well doesn't mean

nobody.

e that

to them

hat's

e a

ers

t to

the

middle of nowhere, where land is cheap. Some chargers also run by solar, w hich costs less than $0.10/KWH. They are doing so just because they are pr etty much micro-monopoly in certain region, using discriminatory pricing to maximize profit. I see anti-trust issues.

would say were "in the middle of nowhere". Have you actually looked???

chargers anywhere along Rt 95 between Washington, DC and Jacksonville, FL. .. what, 700 miles? I guess some cars have very good batteries. Electrify America has chargers along that route, but one of the distances is around

230 miles. Do the EVs other than Tesla have that much range?

chargers in area.

Uh, one is Chargepoint and the other is EVGO. Obviously they each charge d ifferently. I don't get how Delano is "the middle of nowhere". Whatever.. .

Rick C.

--++ Tesla referral code -

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Reply to
gnuarm.deletethisbit

rote:

rote:

te:

ticle.

elow SF.

30

19

11

he

$100k

e like me

est packs

o pay

t 'em.

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e middle of nowhere, where land is cheap. Some chargers also run by solar, which costs less than $0.10/KWH. They are doing so just because they are pretty much micro-monopoly in certain region, using discriminatory pricing to maximize profit. I see anti-trust issues.

I would say were "in the middle of nowhere". Have you actually looked???

no chargers anywhere along Rt 95 between Washington, DC and Jacksonville, F L... what, 700 miles? I guess some cars have very good batteries. Electri fy America has chargers along that route, but one of the distances is aroun d 230 miles. Do the EVs other than Tesla have that much range?

of chargers in area.

differently. I don't get how Delano is "the middle of nowhere". Whatever ...

Both are 50KW fast chargers. If your vehicle support it, you can get 50KWH for just $3 from Bakersfield (run by a credit union). Delano is surrounde d by a 30 miles radius of open spaces.

Reply to
edward.ming.lee

On Saturday, February 2, 2019 at 10:03:09 PM UTC-5, snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wr ote:

the middle of nowhere, where land is cheap. Some chargers also run by sola r, which costs less than $0.10/KWH. They are doing so just because they ar e pretty much micro-monopoly in certain region, using discriminatory pricin g to maximize profit. I see anti-trust issues.

s I would say were "in the middle of nowhere". Have you actually looked???

s no chargers anywhere along Rt 95 between Washington, DC and Jacksonville, FL... what, 700 miles? I guess some cars have very good batteries. Elect rify America has chargers along that route, but one of the distances is aro und 230 miles. Do the EVs other than Tesla have that much range?

y of chargers in area.

ge differently. I don't get how Delano is "the middle of nowhere". Whatev er...

WH for just $3 from Bakersfield (run by a credit union). Delano is surroun ded by a 30 miles radius of open spaces.

By "charge" I was referring to the fees. My point is you are drawing too m uch conclusion from very little data. Location is not the only difference between the two chargers. I expect you would find similar differences by b rand or possibly you picked an anomaly. I don't know about these two brand s, but many charger networks allow the host to determine the charging struc ture.

I don't get your point. Your original comment was about "many" of the EA a nd Evgo chargers. Then you list one. That's a long way from "many"... unl ess you count, 1, 2, many.

Rick C.

-+-- Tesla referral code -

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Reply to
gnuarm.deletethisbit

Right, there are kids in their 20s and 30s paying $1k a month to rent a room there, not even a studio apartment, a single room in a 4 bedroom third-floor apartment where you have to share kitchen and living areas with three other people.

It's near Manhattan-level pricing at this point paying thousands a month to rent a few hundred square feet of living area and subletting bay windows and closet space.

I saw one ad where someone was subletting an "apartment" for $700/month it wasn't even an apartment it was like half of a living room divided with a curtain. You don't even get a real door to your room for that price you just get a curtain!

Boston has its nice aspects but it's hard to see paying 80% of Manhattan prices for 20% of Manhattan amenities. You can do a lot better renting just 20 minutes further north or south but then you're living someplace terribly unfashionable/blue collar and non-hip and have to deal with the highway traffic

Reply to
bitrex

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