Electric airplane

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martin

On my PC it just sits there. No message, nada, zip, zilch.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

"gmail" domain blocked because of excessive spam.
Use another domain or send PM.

On a sunny day (Fri, 05 Sep 2008 20:06:05 +0200) it happened Martin Griffith wrote in :

So, I am using 9 too, and no problems. about:plugins Shockwave Flash

File name: libflashplayer.so Shockwave Flash 9.0 r124

MIME Type Description Suffixes Enabled application/x-shockwave-flash Shockwave Flash swf Yes application/futuresplash FutureSplash Player spl Yes

:-)

On a sunny day (Fri, 05 Sep 2008 11:10:12 -0700) it happened Joerg wrote in :

You have to wait a few minutes, has been like that all day, perhaps too many clicks, commercial comes first too, ignore it.

ith

Re-clicking on the video hyperlink at bottom of page is lot faster than waiting for link made by OP.

Incidentally, I started studying last year for my Private Pilot's license. I was warned in advance that, in general, pilots have major egos, which, from my experience with real life pilots, seems to be partially true, but certainly not as bad as I was told, certainly nothing to give much thought too.

OTOH, pilots in rec.aviation.piloting...ahem.... lets just say that there are some of them you might have a drink with, and some of them you would not want to rescue you from be stranded island in Pacific. The rudeness of the latter is immeasurable. Those who are rude believe that their knowledge and experience in aviation gives them license to be rude. What's remarkable is that some other pilots actually subscribe to principle. I wonder how well Bob Pease would be received if he uttered expletives to random strangers online more than 10 times/ day on average, and then said, "I'm allowed to do this. I'm brilliant."

But on topic of airplanes, I have strong suspicion that there is a "tertiary" model for flight, in addition to propeller and jet, just as there are multiple models for amplifiers (vacuum tube, BJT, FET). It would likely reduce noise and vibration considerably if it worked. I don't know the details yet, just a hunch. ;) But I do know that there are a lot of people, pilots and aerodynamacists alike, who probably have inccorect understanding of lift:

In such cases, there is often great opportunity to be realized, if only someone would actually takek the time to figure out what's really going on. That person will not be I of course, but it's always tempting to fidget. :)

This reminds me of the development of Carnot cycle...

...where engineers were very much deep into developing and using the steam engine without [really] understanding how it works.

IMHO, the prevaling "backwash directly causes lift", IIUC, is suspect

- it violates basic Newtonian physics. Of course, I could be misinterpreting what is meant by it.

-Le Chaud Lapin-

Probably about the same as Thompson - he actually _believes_ he's as "brilliant" as he claims to be. ;-)

He's not really, you know; he's an analog IC savant. His politics are somewhere between Genghis Khan and Mussolini.

Cheers! Rich

Hmm , 'lectric aeroplanes to Genghis"Thompson" Khan in six posts, without invoking Mr Godwin, congrats :)

Reasonable but utterly non related video here

with a modern "Beatles" haircut, and matching jeans

martin

It's too bad that the people in rec.aviation.piloting cannot engage in the same type of gentleman'ly banter that goes on between Rich and Jim.

Would be a lot more fun to read. :)

-Le Chaud Lapin-

here

I went for my PPL about 15 years ago, gave up 'cos driving a 10 yo beat up Cessna is a bit like driving a 2CV JoergeMobile, boring, and the bit of arrogance at the airfield didn't help.

Still read that pilot bloke on Salon though

Rich and Jim should do a youtube show

martin

here

Reminds me of a Belgian pilot at our airfield there. He had an airplane, his own, kept it spiffy and up to date. It looked really good, not like our parachuting Cessna where occasionally something would fall off. The _only_ other vehicle he owned was a rickety old moped where the wheels weren't even straight.

I subscribe to Flying Magazine since who knows when, maybe ten years now.

That would be fun!

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

"gmail" domain blocked because of excessive spam.
Use another domain or send PM.

I am up to my neck in a large research project that is finally coming to a close. After I am done with this, I would really like to get into avation. Not flying, but thinking/designing.

I don't need to convince anyone here that electronics/software can revolutionize the cockpits of almost any aircraft, including the new Airbus A380. But it has been slow-coming due to a peculiar social dynamic at play in aviation industry between

1. private pilots
2. commercial pilots
3. airlines
4. military pilots
5. FAA
6. student pilots
7. instructors
8. general public
9. suppliers of technology to the aviation industry.

In a nutshell, aircraft manufactures do for $1 what could be done for a dime many areas. The under-utilization of electrical and software controls is so extreme, it makes an electrical engineer want to get down on all fours and gnaw and the gastroc with gnashing teeth. And if one even thinks about suggesting an alternative method, the fightback is abrupt, rigid, and sustained - by the pilots, who view paying $800 for a headset, or $10,000 for a $120 computer as a rite of passage. Ironically, out of the parties listed above, the one that is most likely to consider new ideas, most apt to encourge cross-discipline contributions, most likely to sponsor technological advancement, most likely to cast out the old if the new is better...is,

the FAA:

From what I seen, the biggest impediment to advancing aviation is not the FAA. It's the people who sit in the cockpit, many of whom will not hesitate to let it be known the last thing they want in the cockpit is advanced technology. They prefer to fiddle with the knobs and gadgets.

-Le Chaud Lapin-

On a sunny day (Fri, 5 Sep 2008 12:25:54 -0700 (PDT)) it happened Le Chaud Lapin wrote in :

Lift seems simple to me. Take a sheet of wood, hold it at a slight angle \\ \\

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Better site:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWoLsJz8J5U

JF

d

"For a 100V battery pack 13.5kW =3D 134 Ampere.

Jan, I've always wanted to know the Ah capacity of my car battery. So is the answer something like 100-150 Ah? BTW If you know something about batteries.... I was reading somewhere that the "charging efficency" of NiMH's was only 70% or so. That is for every 10 electrons you pushed into the battery only 7 of them stayed... the other 3 leak away somewhere. Is this true? It seems like an ineffeicient storage mechanism. Are Lithium ion any better?

On a sunny day (Sat, 06 Sep 2008 08:41:29 -0500) it happened John Fields wrote in :

Beautiful, lost of technical details.

75 cents per hour at 70 mile / hour, 2 hour recharge. This is waaaaaaaaaaaaay cool!!

On a sunny day (Sat, 6 Sep 2008 07:14:33 -0700 (PDT)) it happened George Herold wrote in :

100Ah is a lot for a car battery, maybe it is more like 45? Bigger cars / trucks bigger batteries. Hi I do not know a lot about batteries, but wikipedia does :-)

The glass cockpit is rapidly gaining ground in GA here in the US. This is actually causing more of a "heads down" attitude in the cockpit as folks play with the gadgets. In the "steam gage" age there was not much to look at so you keep your eyes looking outside. Jim Weir, RST Engineering, has a great tongue-in-cheek article on his site about the TSO'd pencil

Helps to explain the 10K computer that should be 100 bucks.

I dont agree with you that the impediment is in the cockpit. If you go to any of the EAA or AOPA shows, the avionics booths are packed with folks looking for the latest in glass cockpit, moving map, etc. Here in the US, it seem that some new gadget pops up every month for the experimental aircraft crowd - engine monitoring, autopilots, led navigation lighting, entertainment systems, the list goes on. It's the FAA that's the real problem. Just take something as "simple" as LED strobes and try and get it certified. You better have a lot of time and money before you start the task. The FAA has been working on "updating" the 60+ year old standard repair practices manual for at least 4 years. Maybe, just maybe, they will update the section on welding 4130.

--
Joe Chisolm
Marble Falls, TX

First off, forget R.A.P. The S/N is very bad in that group. Join EAA and/or AOPA, read the magazines, go to the flying events. Just like any other profession you will find some pilots that are real ass holes, but in general a pretty good bunch of folks. I got my ticket in the fall of '83. Dont fly as much as I would like, time constraints mostly. If you have not yet, I would suggest you go up for a demo flight. Most flight schools will have some type of intro flight package. They will give you a little ground school and then, usually, a hour flight. Try not to judge the experience by the airplane or the flight instructor. If you really like flying a small plane you will know quickly. If the answer is yes, then by all means, continue and get your license. We need more private pilots. Shop around for a flight school and dont be too concerned about the age of the fleet. It's nice to go boring holes in the sky in a brand new 172 or Archer, but that 30 year old plane with the bad paint job will do just as nicely. And usually the rental rate will be less and availability will be great. I used to fly a beat up Piper 140. Looked like hell from the outside, but had a strong engine, solid controls, and good radios. No one else flew it so I had the plane to myself - almost as good as owning.

Find an instructor you really like and try and stay way from the young ones. They are usually just trying to build time. Dont be hesitant to change instructors. Find one you get along with and can work with. You are gonna spend a lot of time in close quarters with this person. Budget more than the required 40 hours and try and fly at least twice a week. Just like any other training, if you fly for a couple of hours and then it's 2 or 3 week before you fly again, it will be one step forward - two steps back routine.

[snip]

--
Joe Chisolm
Marble Falls, TX

On a sunny day (Sat, 06 Sep 2008 13:10:26 GMT) it happened Jan Panteltje wrote in :

So started wondering.. .you know fuel costs kills many airlines these days... looked up Boeing Dreamliner on wikipedia:

What if we scale up that electric airplane to 250 passengers. Then (do?) we need 250 x 67.5 kg = 16250 kg battery pack. But we want to fly 15000 km, not only 100 km, so x 150 makes 2 437 500 kg.

The Dreamliner 787-8 has a fuel capacity of 126 000 liter, maybe 100000 kg... but we do not need full power all the time, at cruise much less, so we are in the same order of magnitude.

Now jet fuel is 335.3 cents per gallon

so to fill up that Dreamliner costs 33,528 x 335.3 cents = 11238585.6 cents =

112 386 dollar.

100 x .75 x 250 for the electric plane makes 18 750 dollar. Almost 1/10 of the fuel costs.

And you do not get on fire if crash landing.... and plenty of power for your laptop.... Engines are silent, only problem would be the low speed, takes days to cross the Atlantic, more meals need to be served, well, but anyways, maybe Dreamliner could do better electric.

Did anybody ever consider going electric for big airplanes...?