Cost for stencil per aperture?

For example, how many "free" apertures does one get for a standard PCB stencil (ie: standard or minimum charge), and why does the cost seem to go up exponentially for more apertures? Perhaps i should ask, what is the "standard" charge per aperture or are there price "un-breaks"?

Depends on how fast they work on your car after they shut off the engine and the original viscosity of the oil and the length of time the engine was run from cold start. Explained: "thick" oil sticks better and does not drain out as fast (hot engine or low viscosity oil runs out faster and does not stay in the engine). Cold engine and high viscosity stays inside. therefore less oil needed to fill to mark on dip stick. Also it the tech is in a hurry he will put the plug back in early. And it you spin the oil filter fast enough when taking it off, the oil in the filter will go back into the engine. And if you had a larger filter the first time and they did not spin it fast, then more oil would come out with the filter. And if they did not wipe the dip stick you have more oil staying in the engine.

P.S. I have a beautiful bridge I would like to sell you. It's over in Brooklyn.

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Who uses apertures? RS-274X gerbers include aperture data. I've never even had to bugger around with what an aperture is.

Far as I know, manufacturers raster print the whole mask (think laser printer), etch the boards (probably photographically still), so apertures aren't needed, everything is simply converted from vector data to 2D bitmap.

Tim

-- Deep Friar: a very philosophical monk. Website:

Well, all of the pick-and-place shops i have dealt with, send out the work for making stencils for screening the solder paste. And those stencils have some price that allows up to so many holes AKA apertures; then the total price starts to climb rapidly as the number of apertures go beyond that "limit". So..where is that limit, eg: how many apertures? And what is the pricing after (so i get an idea as to why the cost seems to go up exponentially)?

I have no idea. I think you're basing this on a single unreliable pair of data points. Most of the pricing seems to be fixed for a given area and construction of stencil.

Since the stencils are generally laser cut from metal, the actual cost in machine time is going to be related to the totals of the perimeters of all the cut areas plus a smaller multiple of the distances between, but I doubt that really matters much as there is a relatively large setup, materials, overhead, profit etc. amount in there.

Eg.

Photoetching would be almost completely insensitive to what was being cut out, but I have not noticed that being used for SMT stencils.

Best regards, Spehro Pefhany

--
"it's the network..."                          "The Journey is the reward"
speff@interlog.com             Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog  Info for designers:  http://www.speff.com

PCB-Pool charges me nothing for stencils. Free, zero, nada, .....

Yes, paste masks are always extra -- typical charge I've seen is around $300, so you don't want to do it for a proto, but it's a no-brainer even for moderate quantities. This mask is physical metal.

As far as I know, the rest of the process is little more than regular printing, if probably on a film mask or something rather than paper. But that's just the cost of film and ink / toner / resist, and rolls into the overall production cost (materials, machine time, labor) of manufacturing a complete board.

Tim

--
Deep Friar: a very philosophical monk.
Website: http://webpages.charter.net/dawill/tmoranwms

I gave no data points; the question is based on information from a number of assembly shops, each very strongly recommending i limit the number of apertures or pay an excessive amount. Absolutely no mention of multiples, or distances; just swiss cheese holes.

I bet your PCB does not have thousands of holes per board with a step-and-repeat of that pattern on a panel which multiplies those holes by a factor of 100.

You could ask a stencil supplier directly for a quote. Anything online showing this caveat?

Could be it's nothing to do with the stencil itself, but has to do with a 'per pin' cost they think they incur (since, generally, stencil apertures = 'pins').

Best regards, Spehro Pefhany

--
"it's the network..."                          "The Journey is the reward"
speff@interlog.com             Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog  Info for designers:  http://www.speff.com

The PCB-POOL qoute has been independent of the number of holes. However, quantity and area make a diffrence. Here is an example

For a 10in x 10in double-sided board, using FR-4, solder mask on both sides, silkscreen on both sides, 6mil minimum trace width, 12mil minimum drill dia., and 8-day delivery:

1 piece = $208.00, free stencil 5 pieces = $138.00 each, free stencil 10 pieces = $100.00 each, charge for stencil.

The stencil charge is $59.00 for 1 side, $89.00 for both sides (no mention of number of holes). The charge is levied for 10 pieces or more, or 160 sq-in or more area.

Thanks; that is a start for the basic charge..do you have any idea as to the "limit" of # of apertures before the cost goes up?

Again, as far as I can tell, they do NOT charge by the number of apertures. Also, if you do a prototype, you can get a free stencil if you order 1 to 10 boards. Then you have the stencil free, and can go wherever you want for production quantites.

You need to talk to them to get specific quotes for large quantity.

Also, if you do a prototype, you can get a free stencil if you order 1 to 10 boards. Then you have the stencil free, and can go wherever you want for production quantites.

In that case ("they do NOT charge by the number of apertures"), would you GUARANTEE via a posted bond, the cost difference when i get charged for apertures beyond the quantity covered by that $300? That is to say are you willing to pony up $1,000 or so?

Also, if you do a prototype, you can get a free stencil if you order 1 to 10 boards. Then you have the stencil free, and can go wherever you want for production quantites.

I am not PCB-POOL. I don't work for PCB-POOL. I am not connected in any way to PCB-POOL. I am merely giving my experience with them. I have had them do several boards for me with exellent results. I even received a discount after ordering

10 boards.

As I said in my last post, if you want specific information, contact PCB-POOL, NOT me!!

When I have purchased solder masks, it is usually a fixed cost, say $100, for any stencil up to a certain size. Since they are usually just laser cut metal, they don't charge per apperature. It is all setup fees...

Charlie

Also, if you do a prototype, you can get a free stencil if you order 1 to 10 boards. Then you have the stencil free, and can go wherever you want for production quantites.

PCB-POOL. I am merely giving my experience with them. I have had them do several boards for me with exellent results. I even received a discount after ordering

10 boards.

NOT me!! I do not work with them; i dare say they would refuse my business because i want assembly done on my boards (special material) not some Fancy Routine Printedboard material.

Yeah; like i said to someone else, you do not have (say) 50,000 apertures (swiss cheese board multiplied by 100 or more).

? 2012?4?9???? UTC+

8??4:44:56?Robert Baer???

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