Hello, Hope i'm not going to get flamed for this: I was about to order the Art of Electronics - 2nd Edition; just wanted to know if the 3rd edition will be out this year? I've been bumming the library copy so far, but i'd like a copy for myself.
It's at least 18 months off, more likely much more.
--
Thanks,
- Win
Thank you! Just bought my copy.
I hope you enjoy it.
--
Thanks,
- Win
Hello I'm an electrical engineering student at the University of Technology Sydney. I've been reading The Art of Electronics - 2nd Edition since high school and it was the main reason I choose engineering as my career. I've d ecided to buy the 3rd edition as soon as it comes out, May I ask if the boo kwill be released any time soon?
-Oscar
Meantime, have a look at Jim Williams' two collections of essays on the art and science of analog electronics design.
-- John Larkin Highland Technology Inc www.highlandtechnology.com jlarkin at highlandtechnology dot com Precision electronic instrumentation
ogy Sydney. I've been reading The Art of Electronics - 2nd Edition since hi gh school and it was the main reason I choose engineering as my career. I'v e decided to buy the 3rd edition as soon as it comes out, May I ask if the bookwill be released any time soon?
rt and science of analog electronics design.
Not exactly the same kind of book - AOE is a university text book, original ly written for an electronics-for-physicists class at Harvard (and since us ed as an undergraduate text at Cambridge UK where undergraduate entry is si milarly selective).
Jim William's collection of essays are essentially application notes.
When I complained that his application note on using the LT1923 High Effici ency Thermoelectric Cooler Controller - AN-89 - didn't include the equation for getting relating heat transfer per unit current as a function of the t emperature difference across the Peltier junction, he gave me the Stephen H awking defense, that each equation in the application note halved the reade rship. The problem is mentioned on page 11 of AN-89, but the relatively sim ple equation that spells out what's going on isn't.
-- Bill Sloman, Sydney
Dear Dr. Hill, I realize you may not reply to this, so no matter about that.
How is the fundamental proliferation of technology working against your effort? As you write, a galloping horde of developers comes up with new technology. The internet was not there like today when you wrote the 2nd edition, and I can imagine you could now structure your effort, which generically is to encompass electronics understanding (pardon my words), with a web software "container" for the thousands of technology developers out there today. This would be a kind of intelligent wikipedia of electronics with teaching tracks going through it, like expeditions in the jungle. This has wiki inclusivity combined with articulate context establishment. (editing.)
It was possible to be a "Renaissance man" years ago, but I wonder if the exclusive book format is right still. Recall that the Stanford Professor decided to put his AI course notes on the web for his class, a few years ago. He was surprised to find 100,000 subscribers shortly later.
The internet has brought changes of a "formal" nature to traditional institutions. In classic business theory, most institutions cannot adapt. (HBR paper "Marketing Myopia.") The writer of that seminal strategy paper counseled to identify the real business that you are in. He said buggy whip companies were in the transportation business. That's the form which contains their content, their particularity.
In the case of AoE, what "business" are you really in? I wonder if that business is really clear expository writing about abstruse technology. And then I ask myself, "What is the disruptive technology which will replace your current form, the book? I see a kind of teaching wikipedia, where technology proponents can write things which you edit and place within a scientific framework. (I imagine that framework, besides classical physics, would have to include ideas of software, practical AI, cybernetics (feedback), etc.)
There is disruption of the outward form of what you do (the book) and there is disruption of the deep structure of what you do. The issues today seem much less "physical" and much more architectural and "systems" oriented. I don't know what the current context should be, but I think its got initials like SNR, DSP, AI, in it.
A MOOC as I'm describing it must have software technology along with it. For example, a transparent language translation between 10 languages: Chinese and English, etc.
I'm going to suggest a way to do all this. Go to a VC and get 25 million to create a giant wiki-MOOC to teach electronics technology to the world. The income is from tuition: A course with $20 tuition and 100,000 students every 6 months - you do the math. As well, electronics companies will want in to teach their particular brand of technology.
Finally, how do you prevent business hot-shots from taking it over and ruining it? (They are like hired tigers who will eat you.) Simple: create a business structure where you are on the board and the CEO is subservient to you. You will have ultimate control, but make damn sure you know your limits. You just need a CEO with technical training, management skills, who is honest. Focus on the honest factor. Hire "at will." The idea is your articulate technology vision guides everything.
Thanks for listening. I certainly have AoE on my shelf, and I am realistic about the difficulty of changing form for most people. I just think there is a MOOC tsunami out there. I suppose changing form is just to study it in its own right.
jb
"There is change and those who resist it." - Buddha.
ffort?
y.
I can imagine you could now structure your effort, which generically is t o encompass electronics understanding (pardon my words), with a web softwar e "container" for the thousands of technology developers out there today. T his would be a kind of intelligent wikipedia of electronics with teaching tracks going through it, like expeditions in the jungle. This has wiki inc lusivity combined with articulate context establishment. (editing.)
The internet wasn't there when Win and Paul Horowitz wrote the 2nd edition of AOE, but even back then there were thousands of developers inventing new integrated circuits and new ways of using them.
The new gear got publicised in the trade journals, the IEEE journal and pla ces like Review of SCientific Instruments and the Journal of Scientific Ins truments now Measurement Science and Technology).
Win and Paul coped with this pretty well by concentrating on the fundamenta ls.
The trade journals have moved to the internet, where their "teaching tracks " are as uninspired as ever.
re is disruption of the deep structure of what you do.
No more than when it was first written. The internet moves information arou nd faster, but it doesn't create new information, though it does propagate a lot of half-baked rubbish that no editor - no matter how incompetent - wo uld waste printing press time on disseminating.
"systems" oriented. I don't know what the current context should be, but I think its got initials like SNR, DSP, AI, in it.
That's all been around for quite a while. It takes quite a while to get any project properly sorted out, and while one can now publish the sorted-out details more rapidly than before, this doesn't really speed up the developm ent cycle which still includes a lot of thinking, a lot of detailing, and a lot of debugging before there's anything worth publishing - and even now p eople hold off so that they can publish in peer-reviewed journals where the editorial process blocks total rubbish (though it less through a lot of re asonably sound but uninspired stuff - along with the occasional drop-off).
cIn fact he isn't, because he doesn't know what he's talking about.
s just to study it in its own right.
There do seem to be Massive Open Online Courses out there. I see less evide nce that anybody much is getting anything out of them. There are some auto- didacts around, who can learn stuff without having to have it structure int o easily absorbed sequences, and there are rather more "good" students who can soak up structured courses without needing teaching invention to keep them paying attention to every last bit of the course, but most students se em to take the John Larkin approach to education and try to ignore anything which doesn't strike them as having an obvious practical application.
This makes thermodynamics really difficult to teach - on top of the fact th at it's not an easy subject to get your head around.
When I was a graduate student I once demonstrated (taught) a practical chem istry class for medical students - they couldn't see how the work was going to help them do the work that they thought doctors did, and had to be remi nded - often - that if they didn't pass the course (along with all the othe rs they were doing) they weren't going to get to be doctors.
If they'd been doing a MOOC they'd have faked all their results.
-- Bill Sloman, Sydney
art and science of analog electronics design.
ally written for an electronics-for-physicists class at Harvard (and since used as an undergraduate text at Cambridge UK where undergraduate entry is similarly selective).
John L. was probably talking about the two "Art, Science and Personalities" books, not the newer hardbound Williams/Dobkin anthologies. The ASP books are wonderful essay collections, but they aren't usable as textbooks, and they certainly aren't for novices or for people in other fields trying to g et something done with parts from Radio Shack. The anthology volumes are f ull of the greatest app notes of all time, but you don't have to buy them u nless you just want printed copies for posterity, and they are also not use ful as electronics texts.
I actually think PhilH's book (
-- john, KE5FX
Thanks for the kind words. I started writing in the summer of 1994, when AoE II was only 5 years old or thereabouts, and tried pretty hard to avoid duplicating material that Paul and Win included. By the time my second edition came around, I was space-limited pretty badly--Wiley reduced the font size and got rid of a lot of white space, which disguised the fact that the second edition was 100 pages longer than the first. (The third edition will be a bit longer yet. I haven't stopped writing since 1994, and probably won't until I quit learning stuff.)
My basic aim was to help prevent folks working in electro-optical and other mixed-technology systems from falling into the same old potholes the rest of us fell into on the way up. The enthusiasm and confidence of young people is way to precious to waste.
So the ethos is pretty similar, by intention, but there's not a lot of overlapping material.
Cheers
Phil Hobbs
-- Dr Philip C D Hobbs Principal Consultant ElectroOptical Innovations LLC Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics 160 North State Road #203 Briarcliff Manor NY 10510 hobbs at electrooptical dot net http://electrooptical.net
Yes, I meant the two "art and science" books that he edited, with each chapter by a different author. I think they are great, because they talk a lot about the design process, not just the technology.
The Williams/Dobkin books aren't nearly as good.
Right. Even of you don't care too much about the optics, the electronics bits are worth having Phil's book around. I sent a copy to the co-founder of a gigabuck laser company, and he complained that he spent so much time reading it that he wasn't getting anything else done. Some people are never happy.
-- John Larkin Highland Technology Inc www.highlandtechnology.com jlarkin at highlandtechnology dot com Precision electronic instrumentation
effort?
ogy.
nd I can imagine you could now structure your effort, which generically is to encompass electronics understanding (pardon my words), with a web softw are "container" for the thousands of technology developers out there today. This would be a kind of intelligent wikipedia of electronics with teachin g tracks going through it, like expeditions in the jungle. This has wiki i nclusivity combined with articulate context establishment. (editing.)
n of AOE, but even back then there were thousands of developers inventing n ew integrated circuits and new ways of using them.
laces like Review of SCientific Instruments and the Journal of Scientific I nstruments now Measurement Science and Technology).
tals.
ks" are as uninspired as ever.
here is disruption of the deep structure of what you do.
ound faster, but it doesn't create new information, though it does propagat e a lot of half-baked rubbish that no editor - no matter how incompetent - would waste printing press time on disseminating.
nd "systems" oriented. I don't know what the current context should be, but I think its got initials like SNR, DSP, AI, in it.
ny project properly sorted out, and while one can now publish the sorted-ou t details more rapidly than before, this doesn't really speed up the develo pment cycle which still includes a lot of thinking, a lot of detailing, and a lot of debugging before there's anything worth publishing - and even now people hold off so that they can publish in peer-reviewed journals where t he editorial process blocks total rubbish (though it less through a lot of reasonably sound but uninspired stuff - along with the occasional drop-off) .
tic
is just to study it in its own right.
dence that anybody much is getting anything out of them. There are some aut o-didacts around, who can learn stuff without having to have it structure i nto easily absorbed sequences, and there are rather more "good" students wh o can soak up structured courses without needing teaching invention to kee p them paying attention to every last bit of the course, but most students seem to take the John Larkin approach to education and try to ignore anythi ng which doesn't strike them as having an obvious practical application.
that it's not an easy subject to get your head around.
emistry class for medical students - they couldn't see how the work was goi ng to help them do the work that they thought doctors did, and had to be re minded - often - that if they didn't pass the course (along with all the ot hers they were doing) they weren't going to get to be doctors.
@@@@ Whatever, my point was that the reach of MOOCs will disrupt the reach of bo oks, no matter what you or I say about it. Someone will, at some point, take Hi ll's and Hobb's books, and re-package their content into a MOOC, IF the MOOC thi ng takes off, which it gives signs of doing. Just to be funny, no one will kn ow who Hobbs is, just some goof-ball who popularizes him. I've seen it happen in many fields. (your comments about human intelligence as copying pertinent h ere.)
Your touting of journals misses the point - 99.9% of the world can't access your journals, as they are mostly paid access. To be blunt, they are ethica lly corrupt and practically corrupt. Recently, regarding the medical journals like JAMA and NEJM, it came out that a large percentage were ghost-written by pharmaceutical companies, including faking of data. This made the NYT, and the editors promised to fix it.
As far as your teaching med students TDX or chemistry, why hadn't they lear ned that stuff in college? Maybe you had to use a cattle prod because you were boring and obtuse from the start. :)
jb
"What do you call a medical student who graduates last in his class?"
ans: a doctor.
I just wonder how many people read your book. I see 8 comments on Amazon, and the book is $140. I suppose Wiley sells it to libraries, but 8 reviews?
For an amusing cartoon on the difference between the self-absorbed creator and the marketing-man, see this series in the left column of the page:
jb
ur effort?
ology.
and I can imagine you could now structure your effort, which generically is to encompass electronics understanding (pardon my words), with a web sof tware "container" for the thousands of technology developers out there toda y. This would be a kind of intelligent wikipedia of electronics with teach ing tracks going through it, like expeditions in the jungle. This has wiki inclusivity combined with articulate context establishment. (editing.)
ion of AOE, but even back then there were thousands of developers inventing new integrated circuits and new ways of using them.
places like Review of SCientific Instruments and the Journal of Scientific Instruments (now Measurement Science and Technology).
entals.
acks" are as uninspired as ever.
there is disruption of the deep structure of what you do.
around faster, but it doesn't create new information, though it does propag ate a lot of half-baked rubbish that no editor - no matter how incompetent
- would waste printing press time on disseminating.>
and "systems" oriented. I don't know what the current context should be, b ut I think its got initials like SNR, DSP, AI, in it.
any project properly sorted out, and while one can now publish the sorted- out details more rapidly than before, this doesn't really speed up the deve lopment cycle which still includes a lot of thinking, a lot of detailing, a nd a lot of debugging before there's anything worth publishing - and even n ow people hold off so that they can publish in peer-reviewed journals where the editorial process blocks total rubbish (though it lets through a lot o f reasonably sound but uninspired stuff - along with the occasional drop-of f).
istic about the difficulty of changing form for most people.
rm is just to study it in its own right.
vidence that anybody much is getting anything out of them. There are some a uto-didacts around, who can learn stuff without having to have it structure into easily absorbed sequences, and there are rather more "good" students who can soak up structured courses without needing teaching invention to k eep them paying attention to every last bit of the course, but most student s seem to take the John Larkin approach to education and try to ignore anyt hing which doesn't strike them as having an obvious practical application.
t that it's not an easy subject to get your head around.
chemistry class for medical students - they couldn't see how the work was g oing to help them do the work that they thought doctors did, and had to be reminded - often - that if they didn't pass the course (along with all the others they were doing) they weren't going to get to be doctors.
books, no matter what you or I say about it.
They've been around for a while, and if there's any disruption going on, it 's very slow and gradual. A book is designed to be read, and MOOC is design ed to be followed. They aren't doing the same job/
their content into a MOOC, IF the MOOC thing takes off, which it gives sign s of doing.
If you were paying attention, you'd be aware that AOE started off as course at Harvard - electronics for physicists - and you can buy the "student's m anual" version
popularizes him. I've seen it happen in many fields. (your comments about h uman intelligence as copying pertinent here.)
ss your journals, as they are mostly paid access. To be blunt, they are et hically corrupt and practically corrupt.
They are all available at at university library near you. And there's a pro cess underway to stop the publishers charging for access. The Public Librar y of Science (PLOS) project is having an effect
that a large percentage were ghost-written by pharmaceutical companies, inc luding faking of data. This made the NYT, and the editors promised to fix i t.
Big Pharma has big money. It may take a while.
arned that stuff in college?
Because this was in Australia, where the medical course takes six years, wi th the first three devoted to teaching them the stuff Americans have to lea rn before they can be admitted to medical schools, as well as stuff like hu man anatomy (with dissection). The American habit of making medicine a post
-graduate course has been described as "professional birth control" and isn 't usually seen as making a lot of sense
m the start. :)
I didn't have any opportunity to be either boring or obtuse - these were la boratory practical classes, and my job was just to answer questions, demons trate how to do things, collect the students written reports, and give them a mark. And make sure that they didn't kill themselves or the other studen ts.
Any formal instruction was given by the senior demonstrator. None of them w ere either boring or obtuse.
For the medical students the senior demonstrator was Valda Macrea, who was both smart and funny. She died a year so ago and was widely missed.
-- Bill Sloman, Sydney
Total sales were somewhere around 8k copies last time I checked (a couple of years ago). Like other technical books, it's also widely pirated. I think it has hit the target, overall. When I go to visit universities doing advanced optics stuff, virtually all the grad students have used it, and most of them have a copy (legit or pirated, I don't know the proportion). It's pretty funny for an old bald guy who doesn't get out much, having a bunch of twentysomething folks clustered round with smiles on their faces.
Cheers
Phil Hobbs
-- Dr Philip C D Hobbs Principal Consultant ElectroOptical Innovations LLC Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics 160 North State Road #203 Briarcliff Manor NY 10510 hobbs at electrooptical dot net http://electrooptical.net
Don't think so. The number of people who have the discipline to successfully audit a difficult technical course even in person is pretty small. I don't think I've ever known one, in fact.
Plus online courses are useless for reference, whereas books are very handy. (Having both hard and soft copies is even better.)
Cheers
Phil Hobbs
-- Dr Philip C D Hobbs Principal Consultant ElectroOptical Innovations LLC Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics 160 North State Road #203 Briarcliff Manor NY 10510 hobbs at electrooptical dot net http://electrooptical.net
WTF is a fking "MOOC"- godammed bullshit artist. IF you can't define the acronym, don't use it.
HA HA Fred - MOOC is Massive Online Open Classroom.
ur effort?
ology.
and I can imagine you could now structure your effort, which generically is to encompass electronics understanding (pardon my words), with a web sof tware "container" for the thousands of technology developers out there toda y. This would be a kind of intelligent wikipedia of electronics with teach ing tracks going through it, like expeditions in the jungle. This has wiki inclusivity combined with articulate context establishment. (editing.)
tion of AOE, but even back then there were thousands of developers inventin g new integrated circuits and new ways of using them.
d places like Review of SCientific Instruments and the Journal of Scientifi c Instruments now Measurement Science and Technology).
mentals.
racks" are as uninspired as ever.
there is disruption of the deep structure of what you do.
around faster, but it doesn't create new information, though it does propa gate a lot of half-baked rubbish that no editor - no matter how incompetent - would waste printing press time on disseminating.
l and "systems" oriented. I don't know what the current context should be, but I think its got initials like SNR, DSP, AI, in it.
t any project properly sorted out, and while one can now publish the sorted
-out details more rapidly than before, this doesn't really speed up the dev elopment cycle which still includes a lot of thinking, a lot of detailing, and a lot of debugging before there's anything worth publishing - and even now people hold off so that they can publish in peer-reviewed journals wher e the editorial process blocks total rubbish (though it less through a lot of reasonably sound but uninspired stuff - along with the occasional drop-o ff)..
istic
rm is just to study it in its own right.
evidence that anybody much is getting anything out of them. There are some auto-didacts around, who can learn stuff without having to have it structur e into easily absorbed sequences, and there are rather more "good" students who can soak up structured courses without needing teaching invention to keep them paying attention to every last bit of the course, but most studen ts seem to take the John Larkin approach to education and try to ignore any thing which doesn't strike them as having an obvious practical application.
ct that it's not an easy subject to get your head around.
chemistry class for medical students - they couldn't see how the work was going to help them do the work that they thought doctors did, and had to be reminded - often - that if they didn't pass the course (along with all the others they were doing) they weren't going to get to be doctors.
f books
Fair enough. You may find the motivation in India or China, I don't know. I s the book available in Chinese?
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