400V 500A inverter

Eh? That's what I do now. I'm on Time of Use billing (ToU) so I pay less for charging the car and everything else actually. I turn off my heat and AC at peak times. I pay about half for generation but the same for distrib ution.

Now you are just talking nonsense. Needing to charge the car is not at all the same as it being empty. In fact if your car is at 10% you will be sta rting the charge very early to make sure it is charged for the next day. W in's use case would not reduce the charge even below 50% leaving 100 miles of range.

How stupid do YOU feel?

You haven't looked at the issue and you obviously know nothing about it. T alking through your hat.

Rick C.

Interesting stuff. Maybe these topics have been covered in some of the CR4 forums. That's where the grid guys hang out.

Unless your distribution network is already overloaded, i.e.you have brownouts during some peak hours, I do not think that the EV charging load would harm the distribution network. as long as most EV users charge their cars during off-peak hours. There are still 16-20 hours/day outside peak hours, so still a lot of spare capacity is available.

At regional/national level check the day/night consumption difference. Power plants and distribution networks must be built for the day peak, so car charging can be done at off-peak hours.

Could you do your normal commuting with a single phase charger (and topping out the batteries during weekend) or do you need a split phase/three phase charger ? That will give you some hint of the average power needed on the 24/7 basis. My guess In most cases an average 1 kW/EV available on 24/7 would suffice across a residential area.

snipped-for-privacy@downunder.com wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:

have

charging

We are going to rebuild the AC power infrastructure and I am sure increased residential service capacity is included.

But really, Hospitals and industrial zones consume way more juice than what you guys are talking about residential customers pulling. They (residential) would only need to upgrade the transformers on each local leg and maybe reduce the number of those serviced from each, which means more are needed of course. But the overhead HV feeds sould be able to handle it.

Maybe the better way would be to design a car that has a removeable battery module. You come home from work, back into your garage, and drop of the depleted battery pack and pinck up a fresh chraged one, and let the just dropped off module get started on its refill charge.

That way, we could charge them more slowly. Perhaps even use renewable power from your back yard to do it. Solar panels and windmills. Anything supplemental is a good thing here.

On Sunday, March 24, 2019 at 8:19:26 AM UTC-4, snipped-for-privacy@downunder.com wrote :

be slow. I think we are headed for a critical mass in about four years. A t that point there will be sufficient charging facilities and enough people will have bought EVs that they will not be the rare things anymore. Once they become more commonplace it will break down the resistance and they wil l become the norm rather than the exception.

l need to keep up. When I try to talk about issues in the distribution net work in Tesla forums, people talk to me about generation. With a moderate amount of encouragement people will mostly charge at night which *helps* th e grid by utilizing generating capacity more evenly. But it will be stress ing the residential distribution harder.

n in that regard. I was told it was common for four homes to be on the sam e distribution transformer and they are sized for the expected loads at pea k usage time, ~7 PM. But in many neighborhoods these transformers were siz ed 40 years ago. We have been bumping up our typical usage for decades and the EV impact will be a lot more abrupt than "decades". My concern is tha t the utilities will use this as justification to raise rates. Instead, th ey could develop programs of coordinated charging so autos get the charging they need, without all being on at the same time. I know that utilities t end to move slowly on matters like this unless required to by the regulator s. I'd like to see someone thinking about this now.

That is my point. Many EV owners will just plug in their EV on getting hom e and the peak EV load will be coincident with late afternoon peak which wi ll load both both generation and distribution.

But... I think that can be overcome easily. My car has a timer to start ch arging at some later time. However there is still the issue of winter peak . Where I am most homes have heat pumps and residential usage peak is wint er nights when the heat pump isn't enough and the electric coils kick in at 50 amps... the same time EVs will be charging. So I see a potential probl em there.

Generation is not the issue particularly if charging at home. The day peak does not stress distribution because that is from the combination of resid ential and commercial with separate distribution. So neither one is really impacted at the time of overlap necessarily.

I have a very unusual driving routine. I tend to drive longer trips with m inimal local driving. So I mostly use Superchargers with 120 volt home cha rging. Once I'm at a home, I tend to not need a lot of charging like Win. But the trips require Supercharging.

Why? If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

Who cares? Commercial is fed by separate distribution mostly.

My point is with some sort of a coordination techinque, I don't think home EV charging is needed. You simply need your car charged by morning and rea lly don't care exactly when. This should be very simple to put in place in the grand scheme of things. My concern is the utilities seeing an opportu nity to add fees or raise rates to deal with this. I'd like to see governm ent getting in front of it, but I don't have much data on this.

Non-starter. Everyone has looked at the problem and no one finds it useful . Charging at night is perfect with a little coordination to prevent the n eed to upgrade equipment.

Yeah, a lot of people with EVs use PV to charge. I might install some, but it won't do the job alone.

Rick C.

It certainly can for an individual, if you want. My roof made 50kWh yesterday, and 21kWh so far, 1/3 of the way through today, and it only takes 7kWh for a round trip. We get about 11 MWh/year and 240 round-trips would use only 15% of that.

While using unreliable renewable sources may require some rethinking about the electric network, I am not sure if actual network hardware updates are needed, but of course, there must be a _data_ network between distributed producers and largest distributed loads to coordinate loads and production.

If there is too much renewable production, you may have to disconnect the renewable source, but only the greenies will cry foul :-).

In situations when you try to hang new wind turbines at the edge of a weak medium voltage (MV) network, you may need to strengthen the MV network, in order to avoid flickering the lights close to the wind turbine.

That is worth about $10 at Mass rates, maybe half that in some other states. What did the array cost?

If you are at work during the day, do you store the solar energy to charge the car at night?

snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote in news:9468f783-6fe7-4a06-9737- snipped-for-privacy@googlegroups.com:

You ain't real bright then. It is a well known fact that the main grid infrasctructure as far as transmission lines, towers, etc., are all over 40 yers past their rebuild due date. Those leaks cost us money too.

snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote in news:9468f783-6fe7-4a06-9737- snipped-for-privacy@googlegroups.com:

Wrong.

snipped-for-privacy@downunder.com wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:

They are over 40 years past their rebuild due date.

It's a genuine error alright. For some reason, Chinese have trouble distinguishing 'r' and 'l'. Still, their English is better than my Chinese.

Jeroen Belleman

And if so, by what means?

-- This message may be freely reproduced without limit or charge only via the Usenet protocol. Reproduction in whole or part through other protocols, whether for profit or not, is conditional upon a charge of GBP10.00 per reproduction. Publication in this manner via non-Usenet protocols constitutes acceptance of this condition.

On Monday, March 25, 2019 at 3:58:17 AM UTC+11, snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wro te:

te:

• be slow. I think we are headed for a critical mass in about four years. At that point there will be sufficient charging facilities and enough peop le will have bought EVs that they will not be the rare things anymore. Onc e they become more commonplace it will break down the resistance and they w ill become the norm rather than the exception.

ill need to keep up. When I try to talk about issues in the distribution n etwork in Tesla forums, people talk to me about generation. With a moderat e amount of encouragement people will mostly charge at night which *helps* the grid by utilizing generating capacity more evenly. But it will be stre ssing the residential distribution harder.

pen in that regard. I was told it was common for four homes to be on the s ame distribution transformer and they are sized for the expected loads at p eak usage time, ~7 PM. But in many neighborhoods these transformers were s ized 40 years ago. We have been bumping up our typical usage for decades a nd the EV impact will be a lot more abrupt than "decades". My concern is t hat the utilities will use this as justification to raise rates. Instead, they could develop programs of coordinated charging so autos get the chargi ng they need, without all being on at the same time. I know that utilities tend to move slowly on matters like this unless required to by the regulat ors. I'd like to see someone thinking about this now.

ome and the peak EV load will be coincident with late afternoon peak which will load both both generation and distribution.

It doesn't have to. The internet of things is all about putting intelligenc e at the ends of the network, and telling electric vehicle that it is expen sive to recharge during the afternoon peak is a fairly obvious application. The intelligent electricity meter that computes you bill will charge you e nough more for an emergency charge to discourage its frivolous use - how mu ch more can be left to the free market to work out. The price Australian el ectricity retailers already pay the electricity generators is already set b y auction, currently for half hour chunks, though the people that designed the system wanted ten minute chunks and it will probably move to even short er chunks to cope with solar and wind sources.

The fact that private cars are parked for 95% of the time (on average) allo ws quite a lot of flexibility in when the bulk of them recharge themselves.

People with special needs - like you - will have to work out how much they want to pay to service them.

charging at some later time. However there is still the issue of winter pe ak. Where I am most homes have heat pumps and residential usage peak is wi nter nights when the heat pump isn't enough and the electric coils kick in at 50 amps... the same time EVs will be charging. So I see a potential pro blem there.

And the internet of things sees a potential opportunity.

tom

The reason is well known. The international phonetic alphabet distinguishes some 200-odd phonemes, and most languages restrict themselves to rather sm aller group of phonemes - English uses 44, though different dialects of Eng lish may get by with less. One Polynesian language gets down to 11, and one of the South African click languages has about 120.

English - like most European languages - treat 'r' and 'l' as separate phon emes. Chinese and Japanese don't. Once a child has learned the phonemes of their mother tongue, they learn not to pay attention to differences between phonemes that don't matter, which happens at about the age of six months.

You can learn to hear the differences again at any age, and phoneticians do , but it's a little more demanding than just learning a new language.

Google could tell you. Householders can buy battery systems that a big enough for exactly that job.

The Daily Mail and Russia Today don't spoon-feed Cursitor Doom with that kind of information, and he's perfectly incapable of finding it out for himself.

Aside from a few dropped articles the English in the rest of the document is fine, almost indistinguishable from a native speaker, and they don't make an error like that anywhere else, though.

Perhaps the images were annotated by someone other than the text's author.

AlwaysWrong is wrong, as always. US cars are hull of Chinese-made parts.

No, you're AlwaysWrong.