Rooftop Pv installers in Sydney area - Page 2

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Re: Rooftop Pv installers in Sydney area


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No, they are contributing to power generation as a time when it is in
highest demand. Your point only exist in an extremist attitude.


Re: Rooftop Pv installers in Sydney area



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In some climates this MAY be true but PV solar is no panacea for all ills. It
onlt makes sense in certain situations and always does so at a HIGH cost.

Graham



Re: Rooftop Pv installers in Sydney area

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You're not thinking very green are you? Any lessened usage of coal power is
welcome if you believe in carbon offsets.



Re: Rooftop Pv installers in Sydney area
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If one has decided that CO2 reduction is necessary, then it make sense
to achieve that by the cheapest possible means. Even wind power is
cheaper than solar PV, so solar PV just doesn't make the cut.

Sylvia.

Re: Rooftop Pv installers in Sydney area

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And large scale solar arrays are more cost effective than flea size home
roof top units in any case.
Just another case of government stupidity.
However wind, solar, tidal power etc. are complimentary IMO, since one may
be usable when the other is not.

MrT.



Re: Rooftop Pv installers in Sydney area


:
:If one has decided that CO2 reduction is necessary, then it make sense
:to achieve that by the cheapest possible means. Even wind power is
:cheaper than solar PV, so solar PV just doesn't make the cut.
:
:Sylvia.

If you have you ever approached your local council about erecting a tower with
minimum height of at least 10M to accommodate even a small wind turbine you will
find out they just won't allow these things, no matter how environmentally
greenhouse friendly they are. On the other hand they don't object to PV panels
on your roof. I also dispute your claim that wind power is cheaper. Assuming
that the govt rebate stiill applies, for a given output capacity, I think it
would be far cheaper to install PV than wind - assuming your local council will
approve the tower construction. The sun generally will shine for more hours than
a suitable wind will blow in the suburbs - unless you are high up and on the
coastline.

An even simpler way of reducing CO2 from electricity generation would be to
legislate that ALL houses must have a solar water heater.

Re: Rooftop Pv installers in Sydney area
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will
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than
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Small domestic wind turbines make no sense anyway. If you're going to
spend money on a turbine, you want it big, you want it high, and you
want it in a place that tends to get a lot of wind.

I recently went through the numbers on a solar water heater when my
electric heater was clearly on its last legs. Even with the government
rebates, the result was marginal, meaning that the true financial cost
was significantly higher than for an purely electric storage heater.

The best that can be said for solar hot water heaters is they're more
economic than other forms of solar power (and perhaps than wind power).
They *might* be the cheapest way to heat water when all the external
costs (CO2, etc) are included, if nuclear power is not acceptable.

Sylvia.


Re: Rooftop Pv installers in Sydney area

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In the same way as small domestic PV panels don't.

MrT.





Re: Rooftop Pv installers in Sydney area



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Have you any idea how LITTLE electricity they provide ? Modern diesel and gas
turbine generation  is very efficient for example in comparison. GE has a gas
turbine electric generator that's 60% efficient IIRC.

Graham


Re: Rooftop Pv installers in Sydney area
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It saves you money because in summer when loads are at their highest
running air conditioners, power is very expensive because peaking
generators are used, these are only used a few days a year and usually
run on very expensive diesel. Solar systems are ideal for reducing peak
loads in hot weather. Base load power generation is cheap, building and
running plant that might only be used a few days a year is extremely
expensive. Also, demand for power is highest during the day when solar
systems are most productive.

Re: Rooftop Pv installers in Sydney area
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I don't think that works out. We can get very hot weather even with haze
that reduces the effectiveness of solar panels.

Sylvia.

Re: Rooftop Pv installers in Sydney area
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Actually it doesn't reduce it a lot. Infrared is not what PV panels want.
I saw 400W (of 1.1kw max) produced on a rainy day.

Tony


Re: Rooftop Pv installers in Sydney area

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Err, those monstrous power stations are spinning anyway 24x7. What I can
not work out is why I can not battery bank off peak electricty.

Second, even if 10K people did it, I doubt if they will have any effect
like the 10%, 20%, 305 electricty price hikes bouncing around.


Re: Rooftop Pv installers in Sydney area
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The ones that are running 24x7 (which usually run on coal) are doing so
to supply the baseload - it's not as if there's power going spare. Other
power stations, which typically run on natural gas, or are hydro
stations, only run for part of the time, to meet higher loads.

However, there's nothing to stop you battery banking off peak - if you
can find an economic way of doing it. However, even running the numbers
on the back of an envelope will quickly show that it's not just
uneconomic - it's hugely uneconomic.

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No, they probably wouldn't. But any effect they do have is in addition
to the price rises we're getting.

Sylvia.

Re: Rooftop Pv installers in Sydney area

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Then how come they will sell it a 5.54c/KWH then?

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And?
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Do you mean it is legal to connect a bank of batteries to my off peak
supply and use that during the day?


- if you
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Care to share them?

Re: Rooftop Pv installers in Sydney area

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Don't feed the troll Terry!!        ; )



Re: Rooftop Pv installers in Sydney area
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That's the price at which there's none going spare.

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Suitably, installed, yes.

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I lost the envelope. But calculate the cost of the batteries you'd need
to support your day-time load. Then calculate the amount the interest
you'd earn on the money if you didn't buy batteries. Then calculate the
diffence in cost of the electricity you achieve through changing the
times you draw power from the grid.

Finally, take into account the very limited life of batteries.

The numbers show that it's a no-brainer.

Which is why the power generation industry isn't doing it already.

Sylvia.

Some Offpeak battery bank calculations


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Power industry isn't doing it because their size in batteries can not be
purchased at the local garage.

Okay, taking my fileserver, which requires 96 watts max and my LG995E CRT
monitor which requires 72 watts max, that means 168 watts I need out of
the battery bank, or 14 amps @ 12Volt.

So, to cover 7am to 10pm, I need to store 15x14 = 210 amp hours. In lead
acid, this means 420amps hours.

Practically, that equates to 5x100AmpHr batteriess hour at $200 (old
price), or $1,000. 10 year life span means costs 28c per day in
depreciation. Loan costs is 6% atm or 20c per day.

Electricity savings are 15(0.1575-0.0554) =$1.53c. Net savings are $1.07c
per day. <BLINK> or $3,905.50c over ten years.


Re: Some Offpeak battery bank calculations
On Wed, 25 Mar 2009 20:03:17 +0000 (UTC), terryc

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You need to do some serious research into lead acid batteries.
The type of application you are looking at needs deep cycle
batteries,not car batteries.
A 12 V 200AH deep cycle battery will cost you anywhere from $800 to
$1000.




Re: Some Offpeak battery bank calculations


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Yep


where are you buying those from?
Surely not Battery World?
BTw,I probably would not buy ones that big, but 2 x 6V200AmpHr


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