Re: Red Alert on Green Bulbs

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Utter RUBBISH. I though you had more sense.

This only applies to EXPENSIVE CFLs that have a covering 'bulb' over the tube.
This also reduces their efficiency.

Note that the efficiency of CFLs is commonly misrepresented as FIVE times that of
incandescents. It is no such thing. The comparison is being made with Softone
(tm) bulbs instead of good old GLS types that most of us use. Compared to GLS,
CFL is only at best 4 x as efficient. Add the polymer outer and probably only 3 x
as good.

Defects are slow 'warm-up' time especially in cold conditions and short life
under short duration on/off conditions like the light in the loo or dunny if you
prefer.

Yes. I use them but intelligently. No-one should be FORCED to use them and the
general public don't understand they can't be dimmed either. This has already led
to several house fires. Luckily no-one has been killed by a CFL yet AFAIK but it
will only take time.

An Orwellian step too far IMHO.

Graham


Re: Red Alert on Green Bulbs


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All of that is correct. I use CFLs to
reduce my power bill, but I have no
illusions that they solve anything much.
After they crap-out, I save the PCBs for
the high-voltage transistors and a few
other cheap components. Just hobby value only.

I laugh at yuppies who save a few kilograms of CO2
with CFLs, and then take a jet that produces tonnes
of CO2 to carry them across the world.

Nobody should be forced off incandescents.
**************************************










Re: Red Alert on Green Bulbs
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Not greatly



4-6 is the usual lumens per watt input calculus.

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That hasn't been my experience. I've been tracking my use of my
consumables (including light bulbs) since the late 1990s. Even in the
areas you specify (the porch, toilet, garage, bathroom), the average
time for CFLs over the last four years I've been using them has been
157 weeks -- which compares pretty well with the 123 weeks for
incandescents. Moreover, incandescents have a 5-6% initial failure
rate. I used to buy them a dozen at a time, handle them very carefully
and store them for that inconvenient moment, but it was common for at
least one in the batch to not operate at all. That has never happened
with a CFL I've bought, yet.

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But you have to look at the total picture. CFLs reduce per capita
energy demand and this in turn reduces emissions, not just of mercury
but much else that is toxic to humans. Incandescents are killing and
injuring people already, and have been for years. CFLs reduce this and
save money.

It's perfectly sensible policy to restrain people from injuring
others, especially if this can be done in a way that doesn't impose
any serious burden in cost or inconvenience. Admittedly, the move to
CFLs in Australia was effected by a conservartive government, but I
don't see that as a reason to oppose it.

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Hmmm ... You're insulting Orwell now


Fran

Re: Red Alert on Green Bulbs

"Fran"


That hasn't been my experience.


** Your alleged " experience "  is not a valid point.

The collective experiences of many others outweigh it totally.


CFLs reduce per capita
energy demand and this in turn reduces emissions,


** Massive false assumption.

A switch using CFLs in domestic premises will not reduce coal consumption in
Australia one bit.


Incandescents are killing and
injuring people already, and have been for years.


**  Totally silly claim.



......   Phil



Re: Red Alert on Green Bulbs
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Unbelievably silly claim.


I would strongly suggest that the incandescent light bulb has SAVED,
prolonged and enriched countless millions of lives since it was first
invented, and brought light to many places that were impossible
before.

Apart from removing the obvious fire hazard of illuminating with
flames, whether it be by candle, gas, oil, kerosine or wood, its
allowed safe lighting (that doesn't consume oxygen or create soot
where its used) in many dangerous areas where flames are a definite no-
no or just not possible to be used.  (operating theatres, aircraft,
space ships, laboratories, food manufacturing, areas where there are
explosives or other potentially unstable/dangerous  materials being
made or stored - factories where there is fine dust like granaries
(explosion hazard) places where  flammable liquids/gases are stored or
refined).

Other applications i can think of where it directly helps save lives -
portable search and rescue gear such as portable high power torches,
searchlights, are hard to imagine being practical without the
incandescent light bulb - even now.

While someone who knows a bit more about it might like to correct me,
The overhead surgical lamps used in operating theatres would  surely
be incandescent or quartz halogen (same thing).

----------------------------------------


How are incandescent bulbs killing people ?

Only ways I can think of is via electrocution, such as using a NAKED /
EXPOSED mains powered bulb as illumination to work on a car, on a tin
roof etc, the bulb breaking and the "active" live filament stem coming
into contact with the car body / roof etc. and making it "live".
(anyone doing this is just asking for trouble)

A metal car body would be particularly lethal under this scenario, as
the tyres being rubber would insulate, and the only path to ground
would be through whoever is standing on the ground (terra firma) and
touching the car body.

Alternately someone could step on it, crush it and contact the live
filament stem that way, or try and remove a smashed bulb from a light
socket without the power being off.
(this could be hard to determine in a situation where a bulb is on a 2
way switch arrangement)


These problems can be cured by simply using a safe enclosure (such as
an automotive inspection lamp housing)  for the bulb and an ELCB
(safety switch).

I will admit a CFL would be a lot safer in these conditions, as long
as the plastic base isnt broken (as there are high DC voltages inside)


The other scenarios are physical injuries, glass cuts etc, but I don't
see that as relevant as just about any seemingly "innocent" everyday
object in the average home can kill or injure when used in the wrong
way, or in the hands of a dickhead.


About the only way to 100% solve this problem is lock the dickhead in
a padded rubber room. this could also have the pleasant side effect of
making a lot of society's problems vanish.





Re: Red Alert on Green Bulbs
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I give in, how?
Somebody been eating them?

  CFLs reduce this and
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Re: Red Alert on Green Bulbs
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It was a response in kind to Grahame's comment about CFls not killing
anyone yet ...

If you're going to affect ignorance about what I meant, even though
you read the passage, then I'm not interested.

Fran


Re: Red Alert on Green Bulbs
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Or using as a "marital aid"   ??




Being forced to choose between the 2,  I would ingest the materials of
an incandescent bulb over the CFL. (leaving out the factor like
physical cuts from glass, sharp metal edges etc.) without a doubt.

Except for the small amount of solder (which if not lead-free solder
could possibly lead to lead poisoning?) used on the base terminals
(which is also used on the CFL, as well as plenty inside), I cant
think of much in a household incandescent light bulb that could harm
your body or digestive system, it would just pass straight through.

some of the chemicals used in the CFL electronic components, Phosphor
(carcinogenic) in the tube etc are definitely not safe to ingest, and
are no doubt poisonous.

Re: Red Alert on Green Bulbs
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Not greatly

of
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4-6 is the usual lumens per watt input calculus.

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3 x
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you
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That hasn't been my experience. I've been tracking my use of my
consumables (including light bulbs) since the late 1990s. Even in the
areas you specify (the porch, toilet, garage, bathroom), the average
time for CFLs over the last four years I've been using them has been
157 weeks -- which compares pretty well with the 123 weeks for
incandescents. Moreover, incandescents have a 5-6% initial failure
rate. I used to buy them a dozen at a time, handle them very carefully
and store them for that inconvenient moment, but it was common for at
least one in the batch to not operate at all. That has never happened
with a CFL I've bought, yet.

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led
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it
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But you have to look at the total picture. CFLs reduce per capita
energy demand and this in turn reduces emissions, not just of mercury
but much else that is toxic to humans. Incandescents are killing and
injuring people already, and have been for years. CFLs reduce this and
save money.

It's perfectly sensible policy to restrain people from injuring
others, especially if this can be done in a way that doesn't impose
any serious burden in cost or inconvenience. Admittedly, the move to
CFLs in Australia was effected by a conservartive government, but I
don't see that as a reason to oppose it.

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Hmmm ... You're insulting Orwell now


Fran

Re: Red Alert on Green Bulbs



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tube.
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Oh, so that's OK is it ?


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As a result of a daft UK newspaper article claiming that incandescents were being
banned, I went to my local trade electrical store and and bought an allegedly
illegal
150W GLS bulb (OSRAM) made in the EU (Slovakia).

The light output is rated at 2140 lumens. That's 14 lumens per watt.

Just more of the usual GREEN LIES.

You LIARS are finished.

Graham




Re: Red Alert on Green Bulbs
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Hear hear !!

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