Re: CFL Burns Home Down

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Hi Phil, ALL,

Yes we need to be aware about this...

My missus put one in my daughters room (fitted with a dimmer) after the
bulb stopped working..  Of course it didnt work so she told me..  I said
`You cant plug the CFL bulbs into a socket connected to a dimmer switch'.

As I walked into my daughter's room to replace the CFL there was a very
loud exploding noise, which scared the crap out of me, as my wife had
left the switch turned on.. a fair thing to do, one assumes its not
working why worry..

The CFL did not catch fire or even show signs of damage (strange
considering the noise it made when it blew).

Now to me it was well known not to use a CFL in a dimmer socket but I
was not prepared for the near catastrophic result of doing so I always
thought they just wont work.

So beware...we may have lost a house or worse our daughter because of
this simple oversight

Mik

Re: CFL Burns Home Down

"Mik DaDik"
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** That bang would be an electro or maybe film cap exploding.


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** Some do absolutely nothing -  which is excellent.

However, others flicker and carry on until you set the dimmer knob for max
and then they *seem* OK  -  but are actually operating in a  state of serve
component overstress.

See:

http://sound.westhost.com/articles/incandescent.htm#dim


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** Once out and away from the pack,  it is hard or even impossible to tell
if a CFL is rated as being dimmer/triac switch compatible or not.

They ALL  should be dimmer *safe* at least, by law  !!!

Plus fire and poisonous smoke safe too -  by making the base from
non-flammable ceramic and having no ventilation holes.



.....   Phil



Re: CFL Burns Home Down
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if the CFL has an LC filter (and lots do) then it wont be damped at all
(Fc is usually well below 150kHz so the resonant spike wont show up in
conducted (or radiated) emissions testing.

the high dV/dt of a dimmer makes the LC filter overshoot, and the output
voltage will head in the general direction of 2xVin. the little electros
get pushed hard anyway, and are invariably of dubious quality. mind you
even good electros go bad when you apply about 2x Vrated.



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Hear Hear.

Cheers
Terry

Re: CFL Burns Home Down
finger to keyboard and composed:

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This person has reverse engineered a lot of failed CFLs:
 http://www.pavouk.org/hw/lamp/en_index.html

- Franc Zabkar
--
Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.

Re: CFL Burns Home Down
put finger to keyboard and composed:

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My brother installed a CFL in a 3-stage dimmed touch lamp and
[fortunately ?] short circuited the triac in the dimmer.

- Franc Zabkar
--
Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.

Re: CFL Burns Home Down

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I run a CFL on my X10 switches all the time....the proviso is that I
always have at least one standard incandescent bulb in parallel with
the CFL.  I'm on my second CFL now...I'll see if my date stamp is
still visible.

 



Re: CFL Burns Home Down
put finger to keyboard and composed:


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What happens if the incandescent bulb burns out?

- Franc Zabkar
--
Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.

Re: CFL Burns Home Down

"Franc Zabkar"
"Lord Garth"
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**  It's obvious,  the CFLs all catch on fire and burn the house down.



    ....   Phil





Re: CFL Burns Home Down



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Never heard of CE, UL, CUL/CSA, C Tick or CCC ?

Graham


Re: CFL Burns Home Down

"Eeysore" <
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**  Never heard of  CRT monitors or TV sets burning home down  ??

   Agency approval has no effect on the fire hazard issue.



.....   Phil




Re: CFL Burns Home Down



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Actually I haven't. As in NEVER. But this is the UK ! The home of BS. (
British Standards). And the fused plug !

Graham


Re: CFL Burns Home Down

"Eeysore"
 >> "Franc Zabkar"
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**  Then you are an ill informed damn fool.



.....   Phil






Re: CFL Burns Home Down



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Doesn't happen in the UK. Fused plugs and all that stuff must help.

Electrical fires are all but unknown here. By design.

Graham


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** Well you have now.

http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/coventry-news/2008/07/17/faulty-tv-set-led-to-fatal-coventry-fire-92746-21356939 /

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/insurance/household-insurance/article.html?in_article_id40%4453&in_page_id34 %

http://exactproductsinc.com/WordPress/?p94%2

It is one of the common causes of house fires, since the plastic cases of
most TVs and PC monitors are highly flammable  PLUS give off toxic fumes
when burnt.

Hence the dead toddler in the first story.



.....   Phil




Re: CFL Burns Home Down



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http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/coventry-news/2008/07/17/faulty-tv-set-led-to-fatal-coventry-fire-92746-21356939 /
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http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/insurance/household-insurance/article.html?in_article_id40%4453&in_page_id34 %
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Sorry, did you dig up these stories from the 70s when high dissipation tubes
were in use ?

I have personally NEVER heard of such a fire. Were these sets *properly* CE
certified ?

Graham



Re: CFL Burns Home Down
"Eeysore"
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http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/coventry-news/2008/07/17/faulty-tv-set-led-to-fatal-coventry-fire-92746-21356939 /
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http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/insurance/household-insurance/article.html?in_article_id40%4453&in_page_id34 %
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** Read the damn dates on the stories

 -  you congenital,  monumental bloody  ASS  !!

 July, 2008      October, 2005    August,  2008     !!!!


It's a  FLAMMABLE   PLASTIC   FIRE  !!

Only takes ONE   HOT   RESISTOR   to initiate  !!!

For god's sake man   -  get real.





......   Phil



Re: CFL Burns Home Down



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http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/coventry-news/2008/07/17/faulty-tv-set-led-to-fatal-coventry-fire-92746-21356939 /
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http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/insurance/household-insurance/article.html?in_article_id40%4453&in_page_id34 %
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Hmmmm, a Chinese product with no testing and a falsely applied CE mark perhaps ?
Sadly I KNOW that this does sometimes happen.
You've seen examples of similar yourself like the non-isolating isolating
transformer.

Unscrupulous people can abuse the self-declaration aspect of CE.

The only way I can see to fix this would be to have guys monitoring imports on a
random basis.

Graham


Re: CFL Burns Home Down
 "Eeysore"
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http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/coventry-news/2008/07/17/faulty-tv-set-led-to-fatal-coventry-fire-92746-21356939 /
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http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/insurance/household-insurance/article.html?in_article_id40%4453&in_page_id34 %
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** You are  100%  WRONG yet again   -   dickhead.

 There is simply  NO prohibition on the use of flammable plastic cases for
TV sets and the like.

 TV set fires and consequent house fire have been happening since the first
plastic case sets come on the market.



.....   Phil






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http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/coventry-news/2008/07/17/faulty-tv-set-led-to-fatal-coventry-fire-92746-21356939 /
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http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/insurance/household-insurance/article.html?in_article_id40%4453&in_page_id34 %
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BSEN 60065 does in fact establish maximum temps for all case and internal
materials I can think of with the specific intention of
fire prevention along with user burns.

Graham


Re: CFL Burns Home Down



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http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/coventry-news/2008/07/17/faulty-tv-set-led-to-fatal-coventry-fire-92746-21356939 /
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http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/insurance/household-insurance/article.html?in_article_id40%4453&in_page_id34 %
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Ok, reading the report, the fire was described as 'small'. That might meet IEC
regs conceivably as long as it was
self-extinguishing.

What killed the child was *smoke* and I know of no regulations anywhere covering
that for electrical appliances.

Time for a review ?

Graham


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