Microbee Computers are Back

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Regards
Blue

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Re: Microbee Computers are Back
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The world has moved on from the early 80's. Can't imagine why anyone
would bother. Nostalgic dust collectors?


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Is there anything else around that the average joe blow could get their
hands on and program? Has some interesting I/O option for projects.



Re: Microbee Computers are Back
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Did you read the spec's
Dual Microprocessors * Z80 microprocessor @ 3.375Mhz * Coldfire V2
(MCF52259) @ 80Mhz^ 2 Megabytes Ram (1Mbyte shared space, 1Mbyte
exclusive to the Coldfire processor)

Hmmm - my original bee is still in the cupboard.

If they opensourced the hardware  then it might be a good learning
tool.

Regs
Joey

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That would be a question to ask.
Also about software compatibility. No sense shelling out for a project
kit and not being able to do anything on it,

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Average Joe Blow's do not program. They have difficulty getting their
minds around the TV remote control.

Since the OS is uCLinux, you could use any old PC and load up a flavour
of Linux and start programming straight away.

As for hardware there are plenty of ARM, PIC, Atmel, Coldfire etc
embedded dev boards around and dev tools to match.


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soz, wasn't talking about the couch spuddies, but the bit more active.
In the days of basic, plenty did.
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You must be jesting. In C, absolute pox of a programming langage.
Linux is not an easy language to learn yourself. It has two major camps
of programmers, the elite(if you can not read my code, then you are not
good enough) and the ones who want to sell you their pathetic program.


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And the average bloke could use these?

Re: Microbee Computers are Back
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Rubbish. C is an excellent language to program in. If the best you can
do is Basic then you probably need to learn how to program properly.

Linus is an OS, not a language. It's a simple to use and easy to program
under. The toolsets are there as well as debuggers. It is also very robust.


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Of course, why not? Most kiddies canuse a dev kit these days.

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Err, Linus is a programmer, Linux is an OS
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<snip>

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Krypsis

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Typical comment I've come to expect. How did you learn it?

If C is so great, how come there was that security bug in randomisation
for so many months. It was a basic mistake and in any other language it
could have been picked up by a beginner reading te source code.

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What a load of crap, that would be a problem with a particular
implementation not the language itself.

C is not an ideal beginners language as it leaves so much to the
programmer, there are no safety fences there, nothing stops you from
reading a string as a long int for instance, and you can do a lot of
"Interesting" things with pointers. However it, and its later derivative
C++ are the basis of most large projects, virtually every operating
system is written in one or the other.

Beginners are better off with strongly typed languages like pascal, C#
or (yuk) java.

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The problem is that the language is so cryptic, you have to be well
versed to spot a simple mstake. similarly, it makes it very difficult
for people to teach themselves by reading the code.


My 2c is that if the language lends itself to faulty implementations,
then it isn't such a great language.

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The language is not cryptic, it is succinct. It removes a lot of the
extra typing required in languages such as Pascal, and is certainly
easier to work through the coding flow than something as horrible as Basic.

I learnt a great deal by reading the Unix SysV source code and using the
K&R C book.

Poor programmers lead to faulty implementations, not the language.


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So non-cryptic that no one spotted a simple sign problem in 18 months.

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Shrug, your last comment is what matters "coding flow", not the language.
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You learnt programmng or C? In any case, you and I are not the target
audience I was asking about. I've worked with the Joe blow who walks in
off the street to the local computer club and wants to learn
programming. with old PCs, it was an easy matter of popping a prompt and
  editing a simple basic program that gave them a clue and they were
off. No such ability these days.


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That applies to any language.

Lol, reminded me of a Phd candidate(middile aged), with a successful
commercial program under their belt, who said he had spent all weekend
changing A CONSTANT. BLINK!

I learnt about global declarations the first week of uni by reading
comments in discarded programmes in the terminal room (early Dec stuff)
or the good old finger crunching ICL(?) teletype.


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Was already studying programming, but the course was in Pascal which I
wasn't a big fan of. There were a few sys admins and and real
programmers there (keeping the old Vax 11/780 alive) who I got to know
and undertook C programming myself (not part of the Uni course). Unix
was written in C so it was a good place to start reading code.
Surprisingly the code was very well structured and documented
throughout, making it easy to understand.

In any case, you and I are not the target
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Agree with that. The GUI sort of killed off the 'Ready>' prompt of the
old Z80 machines.

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Some changes from K&R C to ANSI C.

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I remember the teletype machines and the old thermal printer terminals.
Wrote a program that took over them from a remote console, allowing
copious BEL and FF characters to be sent to them, surprising the first
year undergrads :)



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All useful languages are like that. (not just computer programming languages,
all.)

C is one of the smallestt languages. it's got fewer keywords and
other symbols than most other languages.

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that's like saying if aome automobiles crash then the concept of
automibiles is flawed

--
⚂⚃ 100% natural

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Re: Microbee Computers are Back
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The problem was that a /temporary/ change - made to stabilise things
while something else was being tested - got put back *without* being
reviewed.

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It doesn't matter *what* language you use, if the code isn't reviewed
then using it could cause the proverbial monkeys to fly out your butt!

Yes, I use C, and prefer it.  I learned it back in 1981, after learning
Pascal in 1980, and then various assemblers and COBOLs and FORTRANs and
DIBOL and SPL and SPAN and POWERflex and perl and SQL and C++ and ...

    Cheers,
        Gary    B-)

--
When men talk to their friends, they insult each other.
They don't really mean it.
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Re: Microbee Computers are Back
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In 1983, at Sydney Uni.

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A random function has nothing to do with the language, it would have
been in someone's library. Unlikely that this library was widely used
either, or it would have been found during testing.




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It was actually a change made that wasn't picked up. My 2c is that in
other languages the particular mistake would have been obvious, but in
C, because you "can do interestig things" and its general obscurity, it
wasn't.

Hence my argument that it isn't sutable for teach yourself.

Re: Microbee Computers are Back

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Bring back COBOL.



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