Indian power loss, leakage?

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Indian power loss, leakage?

How could India have power problems?

Check out the perfect wiring:
http://www.photopumpkin.com/photo-blog/perfect-wiring-up-india /

Don...

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Don McKenzie

Olinuxino Linux PC:
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Re: Indian power loss, leakage?

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Yikes!

I once designed an electric meter for use in India, and it had
extensive anti-tamper hooks. Seems like a lot of power is stolen.
Military vets seem to feel that they are owed electricity for free.


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John Larkin         Highland Technology, Inc

jlarkin at highlandtechnology dot com
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Spillage as opposed to leakage. :-)

Don...


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Don McKenzie

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They actually tie stones to the end of wires and then launch them over
the transmission lines.
Hopefully they are not HV lines and presto, free electricity.

Cheers
 



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Due to cheap work force, it's cheaper/easier to add new wires than to
untangle existing ones.

StoneThrower
www.dgmicrosys.com


Re: Indian power loss, leakage?
On Tue, 31 Jul 2012 23:24:27 +0200, "Stonethrower"

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I get the impression that a lot of those wires are added by the
customers.

I read somewhere that maybe 10% of the power in New York City was
stolen. People drill through walls to tap into their neighbors
circuits, often in both directions.


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John Larkin         Highland Technology, Inc

jlarkin at highlandtechnology dot com
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Re: Indian power loss, leakage?
On Tue, 31 Jul 2012 16:31:45 -0700, John Larkin

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Sounds like green energy to me.  Someone should suggest it to Obama.

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"Customers" ?

Sylvia.


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Evidently they haven't heard of a demark box.  ;-)

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That's disgusting !! You would think they could keep those poles painted
to maintain a sense of order.

Rheilly P

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The bigger the mess, the better it works.

Beirut Lebanon telco switch and wiring.
<http://802.11junk.com/jeffl/pics/Beirut-Telco/
Note how carefully each wire is labeled.

One of my customers at his best:
<http://802.11junk.com/jeffl/pics/drivel/slides/mess01.html

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# Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D Santa Cruz CA 95060
# 831-336-2558
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I read that during WWII the British secret service in Turkey attempted
to tap the German embassy phone, but gave because they simply couldn't
find the appropriate connections in the mess of cables.

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Highly likely.  However, during that time, pole to pole wiring was
arranged so that long parallel wire runs were reduced by swapping
wires between poles (wire transposition).
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transposition_ (telecommunications)>
This was to reduce crosstalk between wires.  It looked like messy
wiring, but was intentional.  Maybe they just continued the practice
inside the embassy.

During the 1980's, most of the phone systems I was working with were
switching from 25 pair bundles and "push button" phones, to electronic
phone systems that ran on anywhere between 2 to 8 wires.  Rather than
remove the 25 pair cables from the overhead, new wires were simply
added.  When we had an earthquake in 1989, the weight of all the cable
in the suspended ceiling caused several of them to collapse.  At one
office, I hauled off 3 pickup truck loads to the recyclers.

The same problem occurs in the phone rooms.  As tenants at an office
building move in and out, the various telco wiring installers simply
add wires, and leave the unused wires in place.  Here's one that I
cleaned up, before and after.
<http://802.11junk.com/jeffl/pics/drivel/slides/Phone_Room_Before.html
<http://802.11junk.com/jeffl/pics/drivel/slides/Phone%20Room%20After.html

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Jeff Liebermann     snipped-for-privacy@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D    http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
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The "before" picture actually looks fairly tidy to me.

My eyes first saw the inside of a phone closet around the time that
Berners-Lee invented the web page. The phone closet was actually a
reimagineered clothes closet with two sliding doors, one on the left,
and one on the right. Restricted physical access enabled a technician
to work on only one side at at a time. A technician took his best
"photographic memory" of a given side before sliding a door closed to
walk over and access the opposite side.

Morons had stuffed the closet full of all manner of stuff. Lots of
25 pair, 66 blocks, twisted pair, phone line, coax, twinax, FM radios,
modems, routers, electrical cables, you name it. But relatively little
Cat5. The Cat5 came later.

At the time it seemed reasonable that simple bad luck dealt me such a
mess the first time out. But the next demarc, and the next, and the
next, *all* looked just as bad. Almost two decades later my string of
bad luck continues unabated...

OK. Surely the pros at my local telco CO *know* how keep things tidy?

No such luck. An insider tells me that it looks like someone armed a
barrel of chimpanzees with wire wrap guns then turned them loose to
do their worst.

"Mine's not to reason why, but to do or die." - telco employee.

--
Don Kuenz

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Then you have a poorly trained CO crew!  My frame was pretty neat and
tidy.  You always pulled the old jumper out when you replaced one. You
always dressed your cables and your jumpers.  New jumpers were always
pulled in directly, not under or over adjacent pairs, etc.

Running a CO frame all by yourself takes a whole new level of skill!

Charlie

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In all honesty, premise wiring keeps getting better all the time (as
the song goes). Phone and data now both use Cat5, 5e, or 6 and get
terminated in a tidy patch panel. Demarcs now come with RJ45 ports.

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The closest I ever got to a CO frame was in the basement of a 1960s
era, six story office building. A timeless technological work of art
to those with engineering eyes.

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Don Kuenz

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For a new building.. Any buidling with any age will have at least 4
diferent sets of phones wires, old RS232 cabling, coax network, Cat3,
maybe Cat4 and now Cat 5 being replaced with Cat 6 possibly Cat 7.
You wont notice all the cables as occasionaly they would have been
painted over or new trunking runs put in leaving the old there as well.
 
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Paul Carpenter          | snipped-for-privacy@pcserviceselectronics.co.uk
<http://www.pcserviceselectronics.co.uk/ PC Services
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The top half of the photo is missing and looks much like the lower
half, wires everywhere.  I couldn't take a single photo of the entire
mess because it was in a hallway, and I couldn't back up far enough
with my camera.  There are two light green terminal boxes in the
photo.  The lower one was a giant Gordian Knot of station wire.  It
wasn't as bad as some of the nightmare photos I've seen on the web,
but bad enough that it took me 4 full days to clean it up.

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I worked on one of those.  There was no way to get both opposing doors
open at the same time.  So, I just removed both doors from their
hinges.  It was still a problem because the building bathrooms were
next to the phone closets, which prevented me from making my usual
mess in front of the doorways.

Unfortunately, someone called the building manager, who called the
owner, who called my primary contractor, who called the
sub-contractor, who eventually called me.  After processing the story
through 4 people, it came out that I was allegedly throwing the doors
into the dumpster, and ripping out fists full of wire from the phone
closets.  

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Sounds a bit more than what I usually find.  My office building phone
closet is shared with a office cleaning service that uses the room to
store lawn mowers, weed whackers, pressure washers, air compressors,
hand tools etc.  I cleverly installed a power strip at the optimum
height for maximum impact by the lawn mower.  Of course, I get the
call from the manager that the internet is down, only when I'm 50+
miles away, or on a day off.  I should move it but every other
location is monopolized by Type 66 blocks, 110 blocks, and several
dead Meridian phone systems that I suspect isn't being used, but have
never bothered to check.  My theory is that if I fix the obvious, the
landlord won't pay me.  However, if I wait for the complaints to
accumulate, he'll pay me to make it right.

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That should be a clue.  Proper wiring is a lost art.  Those that
learned it from Ma Bell in the 1960's know how to do it right.  After
about 1990, nobody seems to be taking the time to do neat work or even
to label their work.
<http://802.11junk.com/jeffl/pics/drivel/slides/Comrade-Ma-Bell-01.html

Converted Victorian office building MPOE.  It's about 12 ft off the
ground.  I had to get a longer ladder.
<http://802.11junk.com/jeffl/pics/drivel/slides/SCZ%20Victorian%20wiring%20mess.html
This is typical.

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Nope.  They're the one's that usually make the mess.  However, I don't
blame them.  They have a fixed amount of time allocated to do the job.
That usually doesn't include "reinforcing" the cabling.  So, they do
it quickly and badly, hoping that the next installer will fix it for
them.  Of course, that never happens.

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Ask not for whom the phone bell tolls, for it tolls for thee.
(Appologies to John Donne).

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Jeff Liebermann     snipped-for-privacy@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D    http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
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   Who let the cat out of the bag? ;-)

Re: Indian power loss, leakage?
On Tue, 31 Jul 2012 21:59:12 -0400, "Michael A. Terrell"

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No one, the bag had disintegrated long ago.  Just nobody cared (including
the long ago loosed cats).

?-)

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