Finally, Death of the 3.5 inch floppy disk - Page 3

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Re: Finally, Death of the 3.5 inch floppy disk


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Occacionally I have been asked to take a look at a machine shop. Mainly
because it gets messy in there and they'd rather not carry disks around
and worst case get a splotch of gunk or metal chafings into a drive
(happened to me once). But usually there was only one or two of the
machines that had RS232, sometimes none.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com /

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Re: Finally, Death of the 3.5 inch floppy disk


says...
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Some machine shops have very old CNC equipment, last year I had an
enquiry to find a spare PDP 11/73 card for one, that MIGHT have had
a serial but I dread to think what format of media it might have had.


--
Paul Carpenter          | snipped-for-privacy@pcserviceselectronics.co.uk
<http://www.pcserviceselectronics.co.uk/ PC Services
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Re: Finally, Death of the 3.5 inch floppy disk


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I had to coach someone through repair and calibration of a circuit board
test bed from the 80's. All nicely DOS-based so it worked right off the
bat :-)

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com /

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Re: Finally, Death of the 3.5 inch floppy disk


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The AUTOEXEC.BAT no less? :-)

Re: Finally, Death of the 3.5 inch floppy disk


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Yup, pretty much, a batch file :-)

DOS is so remarkably fast. No grding on hard drives, no wait, it's instant.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com /

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Re: Finally, Death of the 3.5 inch floppy disk


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I have tried using some old 3.5's and had some pretty bad luck. I still
have people that want to read the larger floppies, and try finding
adaptors for that. Speaking of machine shops, one CF card got currupt,
and to fix that, required replacing everything.

greg

Re: Finally, Death of the 3.5 inch floppy disk


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Doesnt explain the claim that they can be read fine and the problem is with new
writes.

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See above.



Re: Finally, Death of the 3.5 inch floppy disk


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This doesn't explain why virtually pristine disks (written only once
and a visibly impeccable surface) have difficulties reading and
are almost impossible to reformat. I go with those saying that the
plastic in the surface deteriorates. And it seems to me that
double density, and especially single density disk are more
reliable. I managed to recover most from Osborne CP/M disks
with visibly damaged surfaces, and used very intensively.
(Remember those CP/M machines had no hard disk. Floppies
were even used for -- small -- databases. )

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Groetjes Albert

--
--
Albert van der Horst, UTRECHT,THE NETHERLANDS
Economic growth -- being exponential -- ultimately falters.
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Re: Finally, Death of the 3.5 inch floppy disk


On 29 Apr 2010 10:40:08 GMT, Albert van der Horst

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Problems with new disks are primarily head alignment issues with the
drive.  Computer manufacturers, after all, try to use the lowest cost
components and there are now quite a few low(er) quality component
vendors.  Although all the drives might be technically within spec,
differences in drift can make them incompatible.

Many high quality preformatted diskettes are made with an embedded
high(er) coercivity track lead (similar to hard drives).  These
diskettes *can't* be reformatted (your drive doesn't have enough
power) but can only be erased ... and if head drift prevents your
drives from accurately following the lead track then you have a
problem.

IME, since about 1995 it's become common to have machines which can't
recognize factory formatted disks or to write with one machine and not
be able to read it elsewhere.

George

Re: Finally, Death of the 3.5 inch floppy disk


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Nope, that is in fact a problem with old disks that
may well have been written in a different drive.

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Yes, but that effect wont be seen with new disks, just with reading old ones.

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Re: Finally, Death of the 3.5 inch floppy disk


On Tue, 27 Apr 2010 10:56:18 +1000, the renowned John Tserkezis

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My latest machine lacks floppy support on the motherboard (Asus P6T
WS). They suggest using a USB flash drive or USB floppy for RAID
drivers.  

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Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
--
"it's the network..."                          "The Journey is the reward"
snipped-for-privacy@interlog.com             Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
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Re: Finally, Death of the 3.5 inch floppy disk



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 That's nice, but USB flash drives won't ever map to A: or B:.  This is
done intentionally, and it makes perfect sense.  But it doesn't help the
fact that Windows will not look at *any* other drive than A:.

 So, that leaves USB interfaced FDDs, or, as already suggested, creating
an alternative boot disk with the drivers included.

Re: Finally, Death of the 3.5 inch floppy disk


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I have a Flash Drive that mimics part of its space as a USB Floppy
that *does* map to drive A: or B:. Unfortunately it doesn't work very
well with most systems. :(


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Of course this is all only just for WinXP (ie. that Windows release
from 8 years ago), or Server 2003 from 7 years ago..

Vista & Win7/Server 2008 either release have methods to read in
RAID/HBA drivers off flash or USB devices during installation while
booted into WinPE.  And its easy to make a new WinPE boot environment
with said drivers if needed.

Re: Finally, Death of the 3.5 inch floppy disk


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Unfortunately, XP is still the best version of windows for many uses.
Lots of companies feel they don't have time to waste testing for
compatibility with Win 7, or finding drivers for it, or re-training
staff, or handling the support.  It's better with the devil they know.
Besides, Win 7 has no advantages over XP if you are actually /using/ the
computer, rather than admiring the pretty clock on the desktop.

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I had to install windows (XP and Win 7) on a couple of computers
recently - it is often faster to install Windows from scratch than to
start using a typical "pre-installed" system (after it takes ages to
install windows from a hidden partition, you then have to waste more
time removing all traces of the "demo" and time-limited junk that comes
with system).  While Win 7 installation is mildly improved over XP, it's
still seriously inefficient.  And once you have the basic system
installed, you then have to find and install the drivers - which are
often totally absurd (I had to download a 100 MB file for an Ethernet
driver, including it's useless utilities - and it wouldn't even install
until I'd added dotnet runtimes!).

The Windows developers really should get hold of a few Linux
distributions to see how OS installers /should/ be made - they have a
decade or so catching up to do.

Re: Finally, Death of the 3.5 inch floppy disk


snipped-for-privacy@hesbynett.removethisbit.no says...
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That's not exactly true if you're running the 64-bit version of Win 7.
It does allow you to use more memory effectively.  The downside is
that it does require signed drivers---some of which weren't immediately
available.  About the only application I use that needs that much memory
is Matlab.
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I'd like to give the originator of .net a piece of my mind----for about
as much time and memory as it has cost me!
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Good point.  I've installed Ubuntu several times---and it has always
been pretty straightforward.


Mark Borgerson



Re: Finally, Death of the 3.5 inch floppy disk
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There's a 64-bit version of XP - I'm running it now.  But to be fair,
64-bit XP is an oddity that few people have and few developers test for,
while the 64-bit support for Win7 is much more mature (it's now almost
as well supported as 64-bit in Linux ten years ago).

The application I see that needs lots of memory is for virtual machines
- it's good to have a 64-bit host and lots of GB's if you want to run
several VMs at the same time.

Requiring signed drivers, however, makes a system pretty much useless
for embedded development work - you don't get signed drivers for the
dozens of hardware debuggers, cards, and other bits and pieces that you
need.  I seem to remember there being ways around the driver signing
requirements, however.


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Linux distros have worked hard to learn from the best aspects of Windows
- it would be good if MS tried to emulate some of the best /important/
features of Linux (they copied a lot of KDE's appearance when making
Aero - but that is only skin-deep and totally irrelevant when you are
actually using the machine).

Re: Finally, Death of the 3.5 inch floppy disk


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a few years ago when  I got a stack of dell 1U servers they all had a
USB floppy drive in the box with manuals etc.

-Lasse

Re: Finally, Death of the 3.5 inch floppy disk


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Thats why I keep a USB floppy drive, it gets used once in  blue moon
when I upgrade hardware, but it pays for itself every time.

Re: Finally, Death of the 3.5 inch floppy disk


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No wonder the sales have fallen, I have not seen any for sale for a year
or so in any of the big chains or even computer markets.
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http://www.examiner.com/x-16352-Japan-Headlines-Examiner~y2010m4d24-Sony-to-discontinue-35-inch-floppy-disk-in-Japan
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Re: Finally, Death of the 3.5 inch floppy disk


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http://www.examiner.com/x-16352-Japan-Headlines-Examiner~y2010m4d24-Sony-to-discontinue-35-inch-floppy-disk-in-Japan
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They are still around but the usb stick far out sells them

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