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Re: Drill tripping earth leakage protector


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Could that be due to voltage & current being out of phase or something? I'd
be surprised that RF switching hash could be strong enough to trip an RCD.






Re: Poxy is a real M***



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As I said previously, I think I (and others) have already explained what RCD
stands for and how they work quite comprehensively. The fact that you keep
repeating the same question over and over again leads me to suspect that you
still don't quite get it, which is fair enough,  I guess they are relatively
complex devices, depending upon your level of knowledge and experience.

Perhaps if you could contain your anger and frustration just a little and
try and express which bit confuses you. I'm not suggesting I'll be able to
help, but perhaps somone a little more knowledgeable in this forum can step
in and educate both of us!





Re: Poxy is a real Fuckwit


On Sat, 30 Apr 2005 11:17:19 +1000, "Phil Allison"

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Goodness me Phyllis! Do you think you would manage OK
if you only made about three posts a year?

Mike Harding


Re: Some M* do have them !



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Really? I could have sworn he was a some spotty teenager, priapic with
frustration, rage and unsatisfied needs. The fact the he might be as old as
you say is kind of scary.

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Frankly I have no desire to confront him - from what you say he sounds like
a bit of a sad case, and while his attitude and conduct is repulsive, I
can't see how beating up the poor fellow would help anything.

As you suggest the wisest approach is probably to ignore him - I do
apologise for extending this thread into a kind of "flame war".







Re: Some M* do have them !



"Poxy"
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** The Rutmaniac is a damn liar -  he has never spoken with me and does not
know me at all.


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**  Poxy  -  you are simply a pompous jerk.

      Usenet vermin.




.............    Phil






Re: Some M* do have them !


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Well I must say you do seem to making some effort to improve your language -
while still unnecessarily abusive, I applaud your restraint in not resorting
to foul language - there's hope yet it seems!




Re: Some M* do have them !



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I don't think anyone here wants to beat up Phil (although that's only my
opinion).  Certainly not me.  I just want to slam dunk the prick using the
legal system.  Of course I know he's a gutless wanker so he wouldn't dare
repeat his allegations in front of witnesses or risk having his bullshit
recorded to be played back in court.  As I've said before, Phil is a coward
and a menace.   All the regulars here know it.

The fact that Phil has singled you out for special attention this week is
unfortunate.  You are just one on a very long list of people who Phil has
taken a dislike to.  Don't for one minute consider yourself an orphan.

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Don't apologise.  Phil should be the one for doing that for his inexcusable
behaviour, although hell will probably freeze over first.  My advise is give
him absolutely nothing (personally about you) to go on and he will soon
become bored and move on to some other unfortunate soul.

Cheers,
Alan



Re: Some M* do have them !



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coward
inexcusable
give


Yep , pretty well sums it up




Re: Some M* do have them !


Phil does spout a very small amount of wisdom and fact. The fact that it's
buried in noise is disappointing because he could probably be an interesting
part of this community rather than a disruptive one.

If you don't like listening to him, set your browser to discard his posts.
It's very easy. I've done it - and if you silly bastards would stop replying
to his posts I wouldn't hear of him at all. I'm beginning to think you're
all tarred with the same brush.

-Andrew M


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Re: Some M* do have them !




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**  The  M  stand for  "moron " and there really is no-one at home.


 Andrew has posted a total of 9 times here  -   and only began this year.

 He is clueless, posturing, vile little shit.





.............   Phil





Re: Some M* do have them !



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Kill filing Phil only gets rid of Phil's messages.  It doesn't stop you
seeing all his stupid rants included as part of other's responses.

Cheers,
Alan





Re: Drill tripping earth leakage protector



"David"
 Phil Allison wrote:
Some dickhead:
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**  If there is residual 50 Hz current leakage, then it will all be from the
*active* wiring to ground  -  since there is a 240 volt difference.

A burst of RF voltage superimposed on the active will likely increase
current leakage significantly -  moisture etc being a good RF conductor plus
aided by the pre-bias of the supply voltage.  However a similar burst of RF
voltage will cause a lesser leakage to earth via the neutral  -  simply
because there is no pre- biasing voltage difference.

The resulting difference in leakage current may be all it takes to trip the
RCD so radiated RF into "space" may well be not very significant in this
case.

However, even portable ( ie plug in) RCDs suffer false tripping due to
switch arcing  -  this may be a design issue re EMI susceptibility.




...........   Phil




Re: Drill tripping earth leakage protector





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No, a neutral to ground fault can cause leakage current as well. Try
shorting the neutral to ground on a socket outlet. The RCD will most
likely trip.

Despite the neutral being tied to earth at the MEN point (assuming an MEN
system), due to voltage drops in the neutral wiring, the neutral will be
above ground potential in most places in the wiring system. You can easily
get 2 to 5 VAC neutral - earth. A lowish resistance fault can then cause
the required residual leakage current. The neutral is considered a "live"
conductor by the wiring rules. While not affecting normal operation of a
device, a neutral to earth leakage can cause the RCDs to trip.

David


Re: Drill tripping earth leakage protector



"David"
Phil Allison wrote:

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**  Irrelevant to any of my points.

Current flow due to a short is not "leakage"  -  you  ass.

 Kindly fuck off.



............   Phil








Re: Drill tripping earth leakage protector



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Please go back and read my post properly, and point out where I said a
short is leakage. My words which you omitted were "A lowish
resistance fault can then cause the required residual leakage current".

Your statement

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is not necessarily true, and if you only check the active for leakage you
may not find the cause. You will need to isolate the neutral and test that
for leakage too, as anyone compentent to test wiring would know and
understand.

David

Re: Drill tripping earth leakage protector



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No Phil. We fortunately don't have that disorder in our family genes. I
can only wonder why you know so much about it. Still it would explain your
behaviour, especially your acceptance of fantasy instead of reality, and
deficits in social interaction.

David



Re: Drill tripping earth leakage protector



"David"
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 **  That is seriously insane.

  You are a vile piece of work  -  David the Anonymous.




.............   Phil




Re: Drill tripping earth leakage protector


finger to keyboard and composed:

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The author of this letter claims he has experienced nuisance tripping
as a result of off-peak control tones:
 http://www.siliconchip.com.au/cms/A_101973/article.html

Any thoughts as to what is going on inside the ELCB?


- Franc Zabkar
--
Please remove one 's' from my address when replying by email.

Re: Drill tripping earth leakage protector




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Without more details its pretty hard to guess, but if it was control
tones, then the RCD would trip out more often than just once a day, as the
control tones are sent many times a day to control various loads on the
network. They are not sent only once a day. If the RCD was sensistive to
control tones, then it should trip each time a control tone is sent, not
just on the one at 6:30am. I would suspect if only once a day, then it
would more likely be related to the load being switched by the control
tones.

A common problem is that some old fridges had 24 hour timers
in them to autodefrost. This would activate a heater, which often had
sufficent leakage to trip a RCD when cold and damp, then once on would dry
out. This would happen every 24 hours.

Changing to a different brand RCD may stop the tripping, as the
replacement one may have a slower tripping characteristic or
slightly higher tripping current etc. Also some RCD's can handle switching
surges and capacitance to ground better than others, and often include a
10ms delay before tripping (not to be confused with the S-Type, which is
delayed to allow series installation with other RCDs, and is not intended
for personal protection).


David

Re: Drill tripping earth leakage protector



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I haven't bothered to read the link but I am sure the assertion
is correct.

For a period of around 6 (or 12? can't remember) months until
about 6 months ago my ELCB regularly tripped at 7.30am
and 10pm. Not every day, but probably 6 of the possible 14
times per week (as I write this I have a suspicion it didn't happen
at the weekends, but I'm not sure). For the past 6 months it hasn't
tripped at all. There is nothing in my house that would cause
such an issue. If that wasn't tones on the line then I'm damned
if I know what it was?

I suspect they were either doing some trials with new tones or
increased the amplitude of the original ones but finally got the
message they were causing problems.

Mike Harding


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