Is it any good?
Also significant amounts of 63/37 Sn/Pb (the true eutectic point) are being offered whereas the locally available product has mostly always been 60/40. Why so (and/or which is preferable)?
-- John H
Lower melting point possibly better for reflowing and also reduced the chances of board damage when doing repairs?
I don't see a real downside though I still use 60/40 so no direct experience with it.
Well it's a fair bet it has real lead in it, since they were putting it into the paint on kids' toys ...
And it has to be better than the s**te lead-free crap that causes so many failures.
** Funny thing about using Chinese solder is that after you have made a good joint, couple of hours later you want to do it again.
.... Phil
I keep a bit of Savbit on hand (for soldering thin copper wires) but I've mostly used the normal Multicore, at least in part because Savbit only seems to be available in 1.22mm... and now costs around $80 for
500g. The normal stuff is similarly priced (and also seems slightly better to use).It's not that I use much of it but sooner or later it has to be replaced and I particulary object to the price... noting that WES still sell 60/40 for around $8 per 200g (plus GST) but I've no idea what it's like, or who makes it.
FWIW Jaycar once gave me a couple of complimentary rolls of whatever they were selling at the time and it was absolute crap whereas the Chinese stuff I recently bought on ebay seems OK.
-- John H
lol
** The WES 60/40 solder wire is made by Shenmao in Taiwan.
The flux is a "no clean" type, not very effective on tarnished metals.
Works well on newish looking parts.
.... Phil
Which would probably piss me off!
First thing I tried the Chinese stuff on were a few stray components with badly tarnished leads and it worked reasonably well. The flux is pretty effective, with a residue that looks similar to Multicore and needs a commercial cleaning solvent to remove.
-- John H
WES were largely a supplier to the servicing trade (although the balance *may* have shifted a littlle towards consumer lines) so I'd expect it to be decent. I get my supplies of SnPb from a local electronics specialist who has the trade as 90% of his business.
They still are, even though the service trade probably no longer represents the bulk of their business... Wagner is the retail outlet. They also sell a considerable amount of junk (which may or may not include their solder).
Nearest thing to a specialist supplier within 500km of me is a Jaycar outlet which stocks even worse crap (I happen to live in a relatively remote area). I've previously bought solder from RS Components but last time around they sent Multicore HMP instead of 60/40 (which happens to have a very similar looking label). By the time I got around to using it, and noticed the mistake, it it was too late to send it back and I don't particularly feel like giving them another opportunity to stuff up. :(
-- John H
The popular 2000 series Dick Smith soldering stations have all actually been made by Xytronic:
The 2000 series model they currently sell has been through a lot of price changes over the years.
-- __ __ #_ < |\| |< _#
FWIW what I've always known as "Savbit" isn't 60/40 since it has a significant copper content, otherwise it wouldn't work. It's also got a higher melting point (and wider molten range) than conventional
60/40 and hence isn't as nice to use IMHO. The "quick overview" would appear to be a plug for Savbit rather than a description of the advertised item.The two remnant rolls I've got both have Multicore on the label though DSE could well have used more than one supplier.
Ease of use and final appearance are the main criteria that matter IMHO.
Probably deservedly so since many Chinese manufactured devices have featured some pretty rough soldering in the past, but I'm still happy to judge it as I find it and the aforementioned solder is both nice to use and makes good looking joints. Whether the quality is consistent between batches remains to be seen although many of the once run-of-the mill Chinese manufacturers seem to be improving rapidly in that regard.
Interesting comment on 63/37 as well, which I hadn't previously used. So far I'm impressed and can't see any problem with the lack of a molten temperature range. It's the reverse I find a PITA.
seriously doubt if any experienced tech would agree, with the object being to complete the joint as quickly as it's practical to do without compromising quality.
-- John H
Thought so, but searching online didn't quickly come up with a conclusive description of it. I gather Ersin (who don't seem to have a website, seems they used to have multicore.com) make both the Multicore and Savbit products, the latter they sometimes call Multicore Savbit.
Thing is that if I do a test I tend to want it to be objective. I think I'd end up with quite a complicated set-up if I did decide to do this, or maybe I'll just have to wait until a Spectrometer comes my way.
Probably the best of solders couldn't save some of the dodgy solderers who have haunted the assembly lines up in Asia.
And without having to keep the heat on components too long waiting for the solder to melt. I think I've seen 350C recommended in a few places and its certainly around what I use.
-- __ __ #_ < |\| |< _#
AFAIK this is the only one Multicore call Savbit....
Noting that the melting point is 215, with a molten range of 215 -
183, whereas 63/37 has a melting point of 183 with no molten range.Multicore is now part of Henkel... a German company that also owns Loctite. Not absolutely certain but I think the Ersin part only refers to the flux.
Savbit goes back to the days when soldering irons had unplated copper bits. Nowadays its main use is for soldering thin copper wires, which are rapidly dissolved by conventional Sn/Pb solders. It's also available in small quantities (20g or so) which is the convenient way to buy it for occasional use.
-- John H
All you need is an accurate soldering tip thermometer, since the initial melting point and molten range are what you need to know. Apart from the flux quality (which is always going to be a subjective assessment).
For mine I'm happy to run test strips on a piece of veroboard. The ease with which it wets indicates flux quality and the appearance of the finished product is a good indication of the molten range... those with a wide range have a matte appearance after they've set.
Running 60/40 Multicore, 60/40 Capalloy and the Yong Chang Long side by side all three are bright and shiny but the Capalloy doesn't wet as well as the other two, which suggests that the flux isn't as effective. I also tried Multicore HMP, Multicore Savbit and WES lead free, all of which have a matte finish.
The Yong Chang Long also has an ROHS sticker on it. No idea who put it there but it's probably meant to fool the Euros into thinking it's lead free (RoHS) when sold in that market, which it definitely isn't. Nor is the composition stated on the label even though it's being sold on Ebay au as 63/37, and probably is.
-- John H
** Crikey - what sort to "Savbit" are you using ?
I just tried a few solders on a thin strip of copper foil removed from an old V91 dial up modem - so you know how old that is.
The only Pb free type ( Multicore 99C ) was slow to wet and set very dull.
Two others were 60/40 and used "no clean" flux, so were a bit slow to wet and set a tad dull.
OTOH, Savbit wet like greased lighting and set with a mirror finish.
IME (over 40 years) this is how Savbit always performs, soldering tin and nickel plated metals instantly when other solders just dribble off.
... Phil
One that looks like this....
Is it definitely labled Savbit? Multicore 60/40 certainly performs as you describe and at least one vendor seems to have confused 60/40 with Savbit (see Kev's earlier cite).
It's been about that long since I last had a 1 lb roll (back in the days of plain copper bits) and I honestly don't remember how it performed but from the stated composition and melting points (50/48.5/1.5, 183-215) I wouldn't have expected it to be any different to what I've currently got.
-- John H
** Been using Savbit since I was a teenager, when it came in a 1 pound cardboard box. For a long time it was just about the only solder on offer for electronic work. Got mine from Radio Despatch Service, then DSE and finally Farnell / Element14.
.... Phil
** See pic:
... Phil
I've had great results using RS Components. The only dissapointment I've had was when recently buying a "1 litre tin of IPA". I can always use IPA (although I normally buy it in smaller quantities) and I have a brother in law who collects tins. However despite the picture on their site and the description on the invoice I was annoyed to discover my IPA came in a one litre plastic bottle. :-/
-- Shaun. "Humans will have advanced a long, long, way when religious belief has a cozy little classification in the DSM*." David Melville (in r.a.s.f1) (*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)
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